Canon 7D

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
This new Canon was just released. My son sold his 50D and bought the 7D which he claims has better video capabilities than the 5D Mk ll. There is also a rumor afloat that a new 5D Mk lll will be soon surfacing with these updated video capabilities. Anyone have any experience with the 7D?
 

DonH50

Member Sponsor & WBF Technical Expert
Jun 22, 2010
3,961
322
1,670
Monument, CO
The 7D has been out for about a year-plus now. I have been eyeing it but do not own one. You should check out the review on the Imaging Resource site: http://www.imaging-resource.com/ Be sure to look at the samples compare it to the 5D and Nikon cameras; full-frame is much better, but you have to remember the test shots are greatly emlarged. In practice I am not sure I could tell the difference.

I am also pretty sure there is some info about the 5D upgrade.
 
Last edited:

rblnr

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
May 3, 2010
2,151
292
1,670
NYC/NJ
5D mkIII is guessed at Spring '11 I believe. Have shot w/both the 7D and 5DmkII -- as is usually the case, the larger sensor wins.
 

rblnr

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
May 3, 2010
2,151
292
1,670
NYC/NJ
Here's a nice summary of still cam video capabilities:

http://philipbloom.net/2010/08/19/whichdslr/

The author's take on the 5D vs. 7D mirrors my own experience, and that is with a larger sensor you get a bit better low light capability, color/tonal gradation performance and the other things you'd expect by not having to cram so many pixels in a smaller space. The 7D, however, is a bit more feature rich and user friendly for video as Canon has evolved their thinking about video in DSLRs.
 

DonH50

Member Sponsor & WBF Technical Expert
Jun 22, 2010
3,961
322
1,670
Monument, CO
Is there some credence to the notion that the video on the 7D is better than the 5D Mk ll

Reviews say the 7D's capability is more advanced (feature-rich) and it has been used to supplement some movie cameras on some fairly major productions. However, as has been said, the bigger pixels in the 5D mean better, brighter pictures. I have barely fooled with either camera, meaning hardly at all the video stuff, but can attest the 7D is much easier to use than the 5D as a video camera.

I also agree the 5D's upgrade most likely release is the spring picture show, though a lot of folk are hoping for pre-Christmas (but that is not Canon's typical release date so my bet is spring 2011).

Did he look at the new Nikon announcement (7000, I think, new D90 replacement?)
 

DonH50

Member Sponsor & WBF Technical Expert
Jun 22, 2010
3,961
322
1,670
Monument, CO
Ah, say no more (not too many non-photogs realize how steep the learning curve to switch brands, especially when your finger automatically goes for the button that is not there, nor that lenses dwarf the bodies in terms of total ownership cost...) I was weaned on Nikon but have been getting Canon (lower-end) lately and a 7D is on my radar screen.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
29
405
Hi

This is not very much related to this Canon thread but I am thinking about coming back to photography ( Was Semi to full Pro when I was in College)... was then a Nikon/Hasselblad/Rolleiflex/Mamiya head.. Would not touch a Canon but would touch an Olympus. Love to this day the Leica Rangefinder not so much their SLRs...
I find many of the DSLR strangely balanced actually odd. The LCD screen which seems to be standard in Digital cameras leads to a wrong way of taking pictures ... Keeping the camera off your body is the surest way to have it off balance, thus shaking... Now about video.. a DSLR is the wrong form factor to shoot video... While the capability will please some fans .. The body is the wrong form factor for taking moving pictures. If you look at most video (moving picture) cameras .. You will see they are built to be an extension of one's arm... akin to a rifle . I would add that mechanically, the whole reflex assembly with a moving mirror and its damper, etc is wrong too but let's put this aside... Yes it might save you in a binge if video was that important for the particular situation ... else I would not advise one to make a decision based on the video capabilities of a DSLR... all IMO of course..
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
29
405
Steve

it does .. the point of my post was that a DSLR is the wrong tool for shooting video .. such capabilities is IMO only nice to have, unlikely to be used often ... oOn this the 7d is a nice machine but I would look seriously into the 5D MKIII if only for the larger sensor ...
 

rblnr

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
May 3, 2010
2,151
292
1,670
NYC/NJ
Steve

it does .. the point of my post was that a DSLR is the wrong tool for shooting video .. such capabilities is IMO only nice to have, unlikely to be used often ... oOn this the 7d is a nice machine but I would look seriously into the 5D MKIII if only for the larger sensor ...

I see this perception and reality changing. While the form factor of a DSLR is not ideal for motion shooting as you point out, there are plenty of accessories out there that improve the shooting ergonomics considerably. And once you're tripod mounted, the form factor becomes even less important.

The bottom line is that as a bang for the buck proposition, DSLR image quality is getting absurdly good. Problem primarily to me is handling of fast motion -- the rolling shutter issue. I know of a recent good-sized commercial shoot that used two 5Ds, w/an Arri D21 ($200K +) as a backup. What we're seeing is some of the big players like Arri w/the Alexa and Sony/Panasonic scrambling to come up w/lower priced alternatives to challenge the DSLRs. They will be/are better in many ways, but from a strict sensor quality/image processing engine/ultimate image quality standpoint, it's all getting very close, much closer than the $$ differences between pro dedicated video cams and DSLRs would suggest.

BTW, I will be testing a 7D vs. 5DmkII vs. Nikon D7000 next month and will let people know the results.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
29
405
rblnr

It is not a perception. it is an ergonomic fact. That you can put the exact same electronics and optics in a DSLR body is not the problem , it is the handling. On a tripod you still have the wrong shape to contend with... You need to aim and follow movement... an elongated form is the better shape for such. Still picture taking ergonomics are very different from those of moving pictures.

I see the Canon and Nikon of the DSLR world going back to video/moving pictures with dedicated and made-for-the-purpose models. Nikon and Canon were big in the moving picture game back in the 60's 70's and early 80s... Not a stretch to go back there they have the expertise and the companies which were in the Pro-Summer space (Super 8 and some 16 mm, Beaulieu, Eumig, Elmo, Nizo, Leicina, Bauer, etc) are no longer. There is a market where Sony , Panasonic and Arri are big but I see these guys sliding in ...
I had Beaulieu 4008 for months in my hands but found out the hard (and expensive) way that taking moving pictures was a much different game than taking still pictures .. My efforts were so pathetic that no traces of these remain :)
 

rblnr

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
May 3, 2010
2,151
292
1,670
NYC/NJ
Hey Frantz --

My point was that there are accessories out there -- rod systems, viewfinder extenders, separate monitors etc. that all improve the ergonomics -- elongate the DSLR so to speak. This pool of accessories is growing fast. To wit, the RED 'camera' is basically a small, heavy rectangular box -- nothing ergonomic about it. To the support rods above and below, you attach a shoulder pad, handles, hard drive, follow focus, etc. I shot all over the world with an Aaton Super16mm camera -- great ergonomics, cut out for the shoulder, light, quiet, great viewfinder -- but what we're seeing is that the camera itself is becoming a modular 'brain'. The right accessories make it ergonomic.

Same is true of the smaller dedicated pro or near pro cams up to 10K like the Sony EX1, Panasonic HVX200, Canon XL H2 (think that's the model #). Too many buttons on too small an elongated body, no great way to hold them steady, however an ecosystem of accessories improves things somewhat. The bigger stuff is better to hold, but again, when you're up on tripod w/the right support rigs -- all can be easily operated. Navigating menus primarily designed for still can be a bit of a pain though, but that's separate from body type. And we're seeing the DSLRs take video more seriously, so the interfaces are getting more motion capture friendly. 10K cameras don't touch the IQ of the best DSLRs because of their smaller chips and inferior glass.

Do I still prefer a motion picture cam for shooting movies/spots? Sure, but it can be hard to justify from an IQ standpoint. And part of that is me just being old school and thinking of a camera needing its own shape. I teach an advanced production class once a week at the School of Visual Arts in NYC -- nearly all my students prefer the DSLRs to the sub 15K Canons and Sonys.

Canon, as noted, is working the low end of pro, or high end consumer dedicated motion picture cams. Whether they have the resources or interest to go upscale is a question. Nikon lacks the resources, but will continue to improve the vid on their DSLRs as the market demands. The big players in the pro world are Sony, Panasonic, Arri and Panavision, and maybe RED, w/a few others as may niche players.

I think the real point is that once RED was able to get full frame 1080p still data out of the cam at 30fps -- a processing bandwidth/codec issue primarily, and others have followed -- the technologies of still and motion merged in a fundamental way. Who knows where it all goes, except that it'll keep getting better/cheaper.
 
Last edited:

rblnr

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
May 3, 2010
2,151
292
1,670
NYC/NJ
OT but funny. I'm waiting for mine too. Somebody spent a bit of money on this and the lead looks just like Bruno Ganz of 'Wings of Desire' and 'The American Friend' fame.


[video=vimeo;15830670]http://vimeo.com/15830670[/video]
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
This is for Frantz and others who were commenting about shooting video with this camera. My son sent me this video that he shot in HD last weekend at the Treasure Island Music Festival with the Canon 7D

http://vimeo.com/15954219

He said to turn up the volume when watching. IMO he didn't have any problems shooting video with that camera
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing