Videos of Acoustically-Coupled Audio Recordings

[PeterA]

IMHO, the usefulness of YouTube videos made with unadulterated iPhone or Android phone of equipment playing music, whether from home or show , is that you can evaluate a fairly level playing field. I personally take it one step further by only listening to equipment that is playing analogue LPs through valves as that is what I own and wish to compare.

To build a recording system using external microphones and other to achieve better sound sort of defeats the purpose. It no longer compares like for like, no longer useful (unless used solely to monitor before and after changes in that particular system).

Mark, you’ve given this subject some thought and reached your own conclusions and methods. You have shared your reasons and I respect your conviction and approach.

 

[hopkins]

I apologise for my last comment, I let the attacks get to me.

Let me try again from a different direction. I changed my speakers from Thrax Lyra's to Altec A7's (costing a fraction of the Thrax, but hopefully giving me the sound I was looking for). I wanted to record the sound from each early on to make sure it was a good idea. I had previously opened a YouTube channel and, using my iPhone 8 without external microphones or other enhancements, recorded the first movement of Scheherazade (LSC-2446, RCA Living Stereo) playing through the Thrax Lyra's . I then recorded my system playing that same first movement of Scheherazade through the Altec's (

) and compared the two video's on YouTube. I did not hear the improvement I had expected (a bit harsh sounding), but thought I could make improvements to the Altec's and get the improvement I was looking for.

At first it was the crossover's. I purchased a pair of Hiraga-style crossovers built by Pete Riggle in Washington State using large NOS oil-filled caps and recorded Scheherazade again, same phone, no external microphone, after the change in crossovers (

. Sound much improved, harshness gone but quieter and with resonances I did not like. I added reinforcements to the inside of the bass cabinet, 1"x 2" beams glued and screwed to the insides in irregular patterns so as not to form standing waves, added wool felt between and over those and onto the inside of a new back panel, I also changed the metal treble horn for a wooden exponential horn (two rows of five cells) built by Markus Klug in Germany and added in the super tweeters allowable with Pete's crossovers resulting in this

. Then, to match the Alnico magnet woofer (Altec 416-8B) with Alnico behind the treble horn, I changed the ferrite compression drivers (Altec 902-8B) for new Altec 802-8G series II compression drivers. I also purchased some super tweeters which Pete Riggle's crossovers handle, but not sure adding a third speaker helps. This next video is without, but with the new compression drivers, the volume of the new speakers needs tweeking

. This shows how incremental A/B changes can be monitored and used to guide further changes.

What else is interesting is to look at video's made at the hi-fi show and compare them with your own system video's. In my case, as I already explained, I prefer to compare only show video's playing records (and there is no guarantee those weren't cut from digital masters) to limit confounding factors. I am not saying you must restrict yourself to only digital systems, whatever floats your boat.

This explains my use of iPhone 8 mobile phone videos, and hopefully reveals why improving the sound quality of those home videos with external microphones etc., would make it impossible to compare yours with hi fi show videos in any meaningful way. Hence, my comment to Ron.

The reality is that more videos posted online are being taken with devices other than iphones, and I am sure this trend will continue.

Anyway, a phone video taken in a crowded room at a show is often too poor to compare with your own system.

No one would argue that it is best to use the same device to compare changes to your own system. As for your videos, the changes would be more obvious with better microphones (especially between the last three)!

 

[morricab]

I’ve yet to make it.

I have turned up the volume on the 802-8G compression drivers to 75% and not used the super tweeters, I need to record that and add it to my collection. It is lovely for most, but I am still hearing a bit of smearing in upper bass. I don’t know if I have maxed what is possible with the Altec’s, inserted too much wool felt, if the Ayon Spitfire 30 watt matter-of-fact presentation is at fault or if my Phasemation PP-2000 MC should be swapped for Koetsu. I can record Sachmo King Oliver so you can compare it with your copy played on your system to see if you can spot the issue, if any?

Try swapping the 6n30p for 6N6p tubes if you haven't tried that.

 

[stehno]

Still managed to be more interesting, productive and on topic than the last few pages of discussion IMO.

I'll bet dollars-to-donuts you're referencing the drivel, I mean meaningful dialogue between bonzo, tima, petera, and the ghost of david?

 

[PeterA]

I'll bet dollars-to-donuts you're referencing the drivel, I mean meaningful dialogue between bonzo, tima, petera, and the ghost of david?

During all of that I managed to watch your videos, report what I heard, read your response, and then answer your questions. Few others seemed interested.

 

[Rexp]

Getting back to reference tracks that sound realistic, how about this one from @the sound of Tao

 

[Scott Naylor]

Getting back to reference tracks that sound realistic, how about this one from @the sound of Tao
View attachment 111590

Joe Ferla! So many great recordings of Dave Douglas (and others). Nice sounding system in the video replay too.

 

[bonzo75]

IMHO, the usefulness of YouTube videos made with unadulterated iPhone or Android phone of equipment playing music, whether from home or show , is that you can evaluate a fairly level playing field. I personally take it one step further by only listening to equipment that is playing analogue LPs through valves as that is what I own and wish to compare.

To build a recording system using external microphones and other to achieve better sound sort of defeats the purpose. It no longer compares like for like, no longer useful (unless used solely to monitor before and after changes in that particular system).

perfectly stated

 

[hopkins]

perfectly stated

Can you find a video of Altec A7 speakers, with an analog source, of course, and taken with an an iphone, to illustrate the usefulness of comparing "like to like"?

 

[bonzo75]

Can you find a video of Altec A7 speakers, taken with an an iphone, to illustrate the usefulness of comparing "like to like"?

I have posted many Altec videos recorded by iPhones by me or by others. You will find many in the threads with videos in their subject title.

I posted some Altecs links a few days ago on this thread.

Though I don’t get your request in the context of my acknowledgment of Renssaeler’s statement on iPhone use Vs setting up a pro recording set up to make system sound good

 

[hopkins]

I have posted many Altec videos recorded by iPhones by me or by others. You will find many in the threads with videos in their subject title.

I posted some Altecs links a few days ago on this thread.

Though I don’t get your request in the context of my acknowledgment of Renssaeler’s statement on iPhone use Vs setting up a pro recording set up to make system sound good

Would you mind posting a few here so that we don't have to look for them and everyone can see them?

 

[hopkins]

Though I don’t get your request in the context of my acknowledgment of Renssaeler’s statement on iPhone use Vs setting up a pro recording set up to make system sound good

I find it interesting that audiophiles would spend so much time and money to make their systems sound good in their room and then not understand that a recording with a good microphone is a better tool to convey the quality of that system.

A better recording is not going to make a poor sounding system sound good, it is simply going to offer a better understanding, to its viewers, of what the system sounds like.

 

[bonzo75]

then not understand that a recording with a good microphone is a better tool to convey the quality of that system.

I find it interesting you did not understand what Renseller said

 

[hopkins]

As for comparisons, if you take the Munich 2023 show, I rather watch MoizAudio or TotalDAC's videos of the various rooms taken with good quality microphones, then say Thundersnow's videos (posted on this forum) taken with a phone and which make, IMO, all the rooms sound the same.

 

[hopkins]

I find it interesting you did not understand what Renseller said

What do you find so interesting about that?

 

[hopkins]

I can understand that not everyone is going to want to invest in better recording devices to post a video of their system, and even a phone recording can be fun and give some idea of what a system sounds like.

As long as the author clearly states what device is being used to record (which is not always the case), I really don't see what the issue is.

If some people choose to record with phones, that's fine, if others choose to record with better microphones, that's fine too.

There should be no issue with that, and claiming otherwise is simply BS in my opinion. The problems only arise when for some reason people are unhappy with comments made about these videos, but that's the nature of forums.

I have wasted enough time trying to argue something which is so obvious, so I'll stop arguing here...

 

[stehno]

During all of that I managed to watch your videos, report what I heard, read your response, and then answer your questions. Few others seemed interested.

Your growth never ceases to amaze me, Peter. I mean, it was only last week that I rebuked you for listening analytically to videos using your desktop speakers and now look at you. This week you're using new words and phrases even you don’t understand to describe what you think you hear.

 

[the sound of Tao]

Getting back to reference tracks that sound realistic, how about this one from @the sound of Tao
View attachment 111590

Thanks Rexp… it helps that it’s such a soulful and beautifully played piece of music… a great tune will always win through in the end.

 

[Rexp]

This may also be reference class, anyone care to record it?

 

[DasguteOhr]

IMHO, the usefulness of YouTube videos made with unadulterated iPhone or Android phone of equipment playing music, whether from home or show , is that you can evaluate a fairly level playing field. I personally take it one step further by only listening to equipment that is playing analogue LPs through valves as that is what I own and wish to compare.

To build a recording system using external microphones and other to achieve better sound sort of defeats the purpose. It no longer compares like for like, no longer useful (unless used solely to monitor before and after changes in that particular system).

i can you can pull your tooth, even i phone models have such big differences in the frequency response. you just have to google it to find out. people who have dealt with it and made measurements. supposedly iphone 6 is the best for recording. all smartphones have a loudness function when recording (picture) that shows why the same recording of a music title is heard so differently. just look at the critical range of 1-5 khz where hearing is most sensitive is very different. that's why some recordings sounds more natural and others don't because sibelates are displayed exaggeratedly. ergo get a cheap calbriated microphone and then you can compare recordings on a good level. my opinion about it.