What are the Top Horn Speakers in the World Today? Vox Olympian vs Avantgarde Trio vs ???

[Atmasphere]

My room is almost square so the first reflection from the main horn is the opposite corner, where I imagine the sound gets scattered and reflected differently. The reflections are certainly delayed.

The square quality of the room also makes it highly susceptible to standing waves (typical result is no bass at the listening position) as I found out in my new listening room which is also almost square. Some Audiokinesis Swarm subs sorted things out nicely.

 

[Hornsolutions Swen]

Great discussion. What are your thoughts on whether or not corner horns behave differently from conventional horn speakers? I imagine the directivity remains similar, but utilizing the front and side walls of the room for bass output may change things.

My room is almost square so the first reflection from the main horn is the opposite corner, where I imagine the sound gets scattered and reflected differently. The reflections are certainly delayed.

When it comes to generating optimal room ratios, this is nearly impossible with corner horns, as you cannot simply move them one or two meters forward. The best solution is stacking, but this requires accepting a visually much less appealing setup. Additionally, the midrange and high-frequency drivers of one speaker must be removed and mounted on something else.

If you’re interested in the correct room ratios, I recommend the following:


• Bolt Ratio: 1 : 1.6 : 2.4


• Louden Ratio: 1 : 1.4 : 1.9


• Sepmeyer Ratio: 1 : 1.28 : 1.54


Best regards,


S.

 

[Kingrex]

I'm modifying my 10 inch coax/horn. I had left over horns from my original speaker. I put a Raidian driver in it. I intend to install it above the 10 inch midrange. Its a high frequency horn. It's playing about 1200 herts and up. I will move the wires from the coax, through the center, horn to the new Radian horn. I should only need some resistor adjustments as the new CD is very similar spec to the stock high frequency CD.

 

[morricab]

1.5" or 2" throat? With CD, I assume, you mean constant directivity? So no horn but a waveguide.

No, he means compression driver.

 

[Kingrex]

1.5" or 2" throat? With CD, I assume, you mean constant directivity? So no horn but a waveguide.

1.4 inch throat.
Your saying I don't have a horn?
What constitutes a horn?

 

[Kingrex]

No, he means compression driver.

Yes. CD to me, is compression driver.

 

[Atmasphere]

Yes. CD to me, is compression driver.

Your photo sure looks like the driver is a compression driver...

 

[Hornsolutions Swen]

Yes. CD to me, is compression driver.

That was my mistake. So please forget my last comment. I’ll delete it.


Best regards,


S.

 

[Kingrex]

The magnet is hella strong. It grabbed my screwdriver, and I had to put a concentrated thought into gripping it and pulling it to free it.

 

[Atmasphere]

Ralph, that does not seem to be a problem in my room. I had good bass with my old system and even better bass now. In fact, an audio file friend of mine who plays the bass guitar remarked on how natural and good the base sounded from familiar recordings in my system in my room at the listening seat. Of course there is always room for improvement.

Between the fact that neither your speakers nor amps are capable of 20Hz to any great degree suggests it might be worthwhile.

If it were me I'd put a cap in series with the inputs of the amps to roll them off about 70Hz or so- and then have my subs roll in about 50Hz or so. You may find the additional bottom end isn't bad, and limiting the bass energy from the amps (which is gobbling power that the output transformer and speakers can't reproduce) will really help with clarity. Its the sort of thing you're likely to hear immediately and its not an expensive thing to do (if your new cartridge is any indication).

 

[Audiohertz2]

As for sensitivity, I find a 112dB speaker completely out of control and unbalanced. There is no way to keep it in check—just like it’s impossible to keep tube electronics entirely free of hum and noise.

People would have to be naïve to think high-sensitivity speakers don’t come with their own problems, such as driver integration, tonal balance, harshness, and so on.

A properly implemented horn speaker sound great but it’s very hard to achieve as well as noise and hum free high quality tube electronics.

Good luck …

 

[Audiohertz2]

That’s relatively easy to say. They were built with absolutely no compromises. Add to that a lot of experience that the owners acquired beforehand and the willingness to take their time.
Attached one of the most inspiring ones, with Tim de Paravicini (RiP)infront of it. View attachment 157968

Best regards,
S

Really good at 10M listening distance

 

[Audiohertz2]

Dear Duke,
I share your view that the exact measurement method for sensitivity specifications is crucial, and you haven’t misunderstood me. Let me address this step by step and elaborate, based on standardized acoustic principles.

First, regarding sensitivity measurement: Nominal values (e.g., 95 dB/1W/1m) are typically determined axially (i.e., in the main radiation direction) at a distance of 1 meter, often with an input voltage of 2.83 V (corresponding to 1 W at 8 ohms). The level is measured as an average over a frequency range (e.g., 250 Hz to 4 kHz), assuming hemispherical radiation (solid angle 2π sr, directivity index Q=2). Manufacturers ( Of course, assuming the manufacturer actually conducts these measurements and is willing to publish them).rarely inflate these values artificially, as they are standardized according to norms like IEC 60268-5 – the contribution of room reflections is explicitly excluded to ensure comparable conditions. In practice, this leads to deviations in a real room, as reflections influence the overall level at the listening position.

This is precisely where the point about reflections comes into play, which you so aptly addressed: With the same axial level (e.g., 95 dB for the horn vs. 98 dB for the cone loudspeaker), a conventional cone/box loudspeaker indeed has a broader radiation pattern (often nearly omnidirectional in the midrange), leading to stronger diffuse reflections. These reflections add to the direct sound and increase the measured level at the listening position – theoretically by up to 6 dB in a typical room (depending on distance and room geometry), as sound pressure in rooms decays less rapidly than in free-field conditions. However, this “additional level” often doesn’t translate into a pure loudness increase but rather as a diffuse “veil” that reduces clarity: Early reflections (under 50 ms) can cause phase shifts, while later ones blur transient contrast.

With horn loudspeakers, it’s different: Their directivity (narrower radiation angle, often 60–90° horizontally) focuses the sound more toward the listening position and excites the room less – fewer diffuse reflections mean less “background noise.” As a result, the pure direct sound level achieves a subjectively higher presence and clarity, making the horn appear louder and more detailed despite its lower nominal sensitivity. In a real listening room, this can even outperform a cone loudspeaker with a 3 dB higher rating, as the listener contends less with room reverberation.

And yes, you hit the nail on the head with dynamic contrast! Increased reflections often behave like masking noise, obscuring quiet passages and subjectively reducing the overall dynamic range (typically 60–120 dB in music) – similar to a concert hall, where controlled, spectrally correct reflections (e.g., from the ceiling) preserve contrast, but diffuse wall reflections diminish it. Horns minimize these uncontrolled contributions, making them particularly advantageous in acoustically challenging rooms (e.g., with hard surfaces). Of course, this depends on the specific horn design (e.g., Constant Directivity vs. classic) and room acoustics – a measurement with an SPL meter or REW software would best demonstrate this.

Beat Regards S.

You should actually measure how much pure sounds come out of horns , the reflective energy ( hash) is frightening, there is so much reflective energy and resonance coming of Horn cabinets it becomes part of the signature sound…

Subjectively you enjoy them , same for anything else in audio , thats it , there is no panacea …

BTW sensitivity is measured at center frequency , deviation from such is where the +/- Db measurement for bandwidth specs is derived ..

 

[PeterA]

Between the fact that neither your speakers nor amps are capable of 20Hz to any great degree suggests it might be worthwhile.

If it were me I'd put a cap in series with the inputs of the amps to roll them off about 70Hz or so- and then have my subs roll in about 50Hz or so. You may find the additional bottom end isn't bad, and limiting the bass energy from the amps (which is gobbling power that the output transformer and speakers can't reproduce) will really help with clarity. Its the sort of thing you're likely to hear immediately and its not an expensive thing to do (if your new cartridge is any indication).

Yes, thank you for this advice Ralph. You have mentioned it many times and on my system thread also. I do not have subs at this time as there’s no room in my current space. I have no plans of getting subs for this room right now. I have extra amplifiers for subwoofers if I ever move the system else. Thanks again.

 

[Duke LeJeune]

What are your thoughts on whether or not corner horns behave differently from conventional horn speakers? I imagine the directivity remains similar, but utilizing the front and side walls of the room for bass output may change things.

I don't have much experience with corner horns, but what little I have was very positive (Classic Audio Hartsfield, Pi Speakers 7Pi). It seems to me like the first significant horizontal-plane reflections would arrive later than with most speaker/room combinations (which is imo beneficial), and from an unusual direction (the diagonal rear corner region - again imo beneficial). And there is a certain elegance to taking full advantage of corner loading in the bass region.

For instance, I couldn't tell you how "accurate" the bass was from the Classic Audio Hartsfields, but its sheer impact and "butt-shaking-fun-factor" were off the charts. Driven by Atma-Sphere OTL amps, in case anyone was wondering.

You should actually measure how much pure sounds come out of horns , the reflective energy ( hash) is frightening, there is so much reflective energy and resonance coming of Horn cabinets it becomes part of the signature sound…

Could you clarify what you mean by "the reflective energy (hash)" and "reflective energy and resonance coming from Horn cabinets"?

 

[Hornsolutions Swen]

BTW sensitivity is measured at center frequency , deviation from such is where the +/- Db measurement for bandwidth specs is derived ..

Thank you for the information. If you had read everything written on the last few pages, you might have noticed that I already mentioned this, including the exact specifications for this measurement.


Best regards,
S.

 

[Kingrex]

Between the fact that neither your speakers nor amps are capable of 20Hz to any great degree suggests it might be worthwhile.

If it were me I'd put a cap in series with the inputs of the amps to roll them off about 70Hz or so- and then have my subs roll in about 50Hz or so. You may find the additional bottom end isn't bad, and limiting the bass energy from the amps (which is gobbling power that the output transformer and speakers can't reproduce) will really help with clarity. Its the sort of thing you're likely to hear immediately and its not an expensive thing to do (if your new cartridge is any indication).

I think a swarm is a great solution to bass. But it does take the 4 speakers. The amplifiers, the crossovers. And there are tools and skill required to dial them in. Its a $15,000 project if your hiring a pro to set it up and show you how you might tweak it when they are gone.

And they do take up room all over. Maybe not in places you want them. If your lucky, they end up next to chairs like tables.

 

[Kingrex]

Not quite sure how I'm gonna make this work.

 

[Atmasphere]

I do not have subs at this time as there’s no room in my current space.

The Audiokinesis Swarm is built to work properly (unlike most subs) when placed directly against a wall and they should be placed asymmetrically. That usually makes them much easier to install in a smaller room. I won't bring it up to you again.

I think a swarm is a great solution to bass. But it does take the 4 speakers. The amplifiers, the crossovers. And there are tools and skill required to dial them in. Its a $15,000 project if your hiring a pro to set it up and show you how you might tweak it when they are gone.

And they do take up room all over. Maybe not in places you want them. If your lucky, they end up next to chairs like tables.

Sounds to me like you're overthinking this if you think you need 15K to do it! Duke recommends a subwoofer amp that costs about $500.00. It has its own adjustable crossover built in (with high pass outputs if you want). Dialing in the settings really was quite simple. I found placing them wasn't critical; I put them in the only spots I really had and they worked a treat.

Most horn speakers I've seen with horn loaded bass drivers do not do the bottom octave. Some (like the Altec A7) are only good to 60Hz or so. There's more information going on in the deep bass than most people realize. Due to the ear's internal 'tone control' getting the bass right will have the immediate sense that the mids and highs have become more relaxed. So if you want natural sound, if you want the most out of most horn systems, getting the bass right is essential.

 

[christensenleif@msn.com]

when you add horn sub to "fullrange" hornsystem, the whole system snaps into focus
all other subs I know of are not capable of blending in properly