What are members recommendations on current turntables in the $15K to $22K price range?
- Thread starter Lee
- Start date
Nothing I'd care go further off topic to make apparent.
Back to microstrip debating the high end of $15K-$22K TT.
Short list is looking like...
CS Port
Grand Prix Parabolica
TW Acustic Raven
VPI HW40
AMG Viella 12 with Turbo arm
Kuzma Stabi M or R with 4P
Looking also at Bergmann and Brinkmann...a friend has the Galder and it's really good.
CS Port
Grand Prix Parabolica
TW Acustic Raven
VPI HW40
AMG Viella 12 with Turbo arm
Kuzma Stabi M or R with 4P
Looking also at Bergmann and Brinkmann...a friend has the Galder and it's really good.
Rega Planar 10, SME 30, Roksan Xerxes 20 Plus, Rockport Tech, Walker Audio (despite no longer being made), custom turntables by Scienceofsightsound of Princeton, NJ (state of the art really), Micro Seiki , Vertere TT (have been a long time fan of Turaj Mogadham's designs). Also, Clearaudio TT are awesome!
Benz MIcro cartridges are sublimely musically neutral as well.
Symphonic Line Rg-6 TT is SOTA as well, if a rare bird these days, well worth seeking out (call German Acoustics in Indianapolis).
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IMO, the Raven is too laid back. lacking some energy. The Brinkmann Balance was quite superior to the Monaco 1.5 in a direct compare. Apart from my own personal view (based on listening), Vienna (Savvas) on this forum measured many and found the BB to have the best measurements. The Galder as a complete unit with a linear tracker is cheaper if LT option is preferred, which I find good using Top Wing Red Sparrow in SETs horns type systems as the linear tracker red sparrow combo heightens nuance and agility and lack of distortion on violin highs is very musical. You will find the Galder lacking in weight and authority to the Balance whether with LT or pivot.
Fremer has reviewed each of those except CS Post, and I think he hasn't done VPI, not sure. He loves the BB. He also responds to PMs asking advice regarding those, you could simply say since you have reviewed the Galder, Stabi M, BB, and AMG VIella, what do you think? I did PM that exact question. I wouldn't bother asking him about Monaco because that remains one of his most negative reviews.
Imo it is quite superior to the likes of techdas AF1 premium, kronos, SME, Doehmann 1 etc, and only something like Vyger or some very rare tables, specially modded idlers or DDs, carefully set up by experts might beat it on a case by case basis.
Additionally, Marc Gomez of SAT also had advised tang to buy it saying it is superior to some high priced tables. In future you could always replace the Brinkmann arm with any arm you choose, from SME to SAT to linear trackers including the Bergmann Odin and Schroeder LT
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A Raven laid back, i never heard him so.I know it in all possible configurations, very dark background, no noises paired with an enormous attack. if I only listen to classical music I wouldn’t take a Raven,because he’s always on the gas, even though the music called for rest and break.
Dark too. And I auditioned exclusively on classical with different arms and carts
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Could be that's an important factor. Because I don't listen to classical at all and I don't find any of the characteristics you describe like dark, laid back, lacking energy......
Here also different tonearms with the same cartridge Dynavector XV 1s. Ok... the raven 10.5 tonearm, is better than the phantom. Cleaner highs, more dynamic, deeper bass.
I love that Combination 10.5 /XV1s
I love that Combination 10.5 /XV1s
Questions:
1. the speed stability is constant during play so the motor control compensates for stylus drag, etc?
2. looking at the design, how do you accommodate mounting a Tri-Planar or other tonearm? You must have to install/create an armboard specific to that arm's length.
3. what length arms can be mounted?
4. replace the platter pad with?
Ok, we agre it does not hurt. But the fact that the point can stay static forever has no correlation with sound quality. Such point only shows how subjective and unreliable can be our comments on value in the high-end. MHO, but consider the point you refer as a kind of Veblen feeling - people feel confidence in this type of misleading and abusive information, if it is accurate it should sound good. BTW, I also consider that the current Technics are top turntables - I could happily live with an SP10 R with an SME or Graham.
We recently had an interesting debate on this subject, thanks. It started here https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/natural-sound.32867/post-744076
IMHO feedback in turntables has no relation with feedback in amplifiers, although some controllers of turntables that have no feedback use feedback in the wave generators and drivers. Confusing?
Now you are addressing how a manufacturer prices his line of products - it is a complex and interesting subject, but we would need real data to comment on it. But It would be great if you or someone else pointed a link to this Vladimir Lamm statement.
A typical high end manufacturer does not have the structure and capability to produce such turntable, his costs would be artificial, what is the point of such comparison?
I am not in bikes and IMHO such analogies only manage to spread noise and confusion. I appreciate debating the high-end with proper facts, without analogies.
Feedback: … belt driven turntables have a feedback system in the form of a rotating platter suspended in a belt …
With a massive platter and good bearing, inertia/momentum is very constant and there is no need for continuous checking and adjusting the motor. I think the Technics platter is not very heavy, but it is all relative and there seem to be many opinions on what combination sounds best.
1. Yes
2 and 3. I designed an armboard of the same alloy and thickness as the plinth. The Triplanar mounts on top. Doing that, we were even able to mount the 12" Triplanar (FWIW this puts the combination well within the price limits of this thread)
4. I like the Oracle mat. Its not too hard, not too soft; the patter pad has to be the same hardness as the LP for best effect. It has to be permanently mounted to the platter so you can't use the platter mounting hardware.
I'll take that as a red herring then.
And many of them employ feedback (servo control) to keep the motor speed constant. That is how my Sota Cosmos worked.
Adding Bergmann Modi with Thor arm for a bit less than budget as a possibility.
You don't need to be into bikes to understand the underlying principle.
Veblen good - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
No one questions the principle, just if it applies or not to the high-end with major significance.
Or if simply, usually but not always, more money returns better performance and people just generically and unconsciously apply this rule.
You consider that the SL1200G outperforms outperforms turntables that cost quite a bit more - an individual opinion. Why should we consider that the people who own the other turntables are the fools and you are the wise man?
Vinyl is extremely subjective and varied. Its technical analysis is extremely complex, unless we just want to say that the Oracle Delphi is 634 times better than the Linn LP12 - I hope I am getting the factor correctly!
Yes, it is why I asked for a direct link. A nice thing about Lamm is that their site is filled with a lot of relevant information, but finding something specific can take some time . Anyway I will try to search it.
What generation of Oracle mat? I had a few types and liked them, but most were self adherent to the platter - once put in service they become the best, no possible comparison!
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