The official audio myth busting thread

[Al M.]

I agree! Though room acoustics for enjoying music at home and studios acoustics for processing music are very different things imo. It's hard to know what to believe for home acoustics as every one tell you different things.

The biggest change I make to my system is moving the speakers, just by a inch or less. It's free

Also if you change components a reassessment of speaker position is advisable imo.

Just a caveat, you could spend thousands on room treatment but there would be no guarantee you will like the result! Wise words from a very famous speaker designer who was round my gaff a while ago.

Still I do agree with you.

Great that we are in agreement!

I got all my acoustic treatment from ASC, you can read all about it in my system thread (linked in my signature), pages 1 and 2. There was no money wasted, and very little trial and error. I got great advice from them which all worked out (Art Noxon, the founder himself, recommended the window plugs to me), and Peter A. advised me to put some of the sound panels at first reflection points, which does the job brilliantly.

Overall, for the vast sound improvement achieved I might say that the acoustic room treatment was my most cost-effective system upgrade.

I agree with you about speaker positioning, and as you say, it's free!

 

[spazmatron]

Great that we are in agreement!

I got all my acoustic treatment from ASC, you can read all about it in my system thread (linked in my signature), pages 1 and 2. There was no money wasted, and very little trial and error. I got great advice from them which all worked out (Art Noxon, the founder himself, recommended the window plugs to me), and Peter A. advised me to put some of the sound panels at first reflection points, which does the job brilliantly.

Overall, for the vast sound improvement achieved I might say that the acoustic room treatment was my most cost-effective system upgrade.

I agree with you about speaker positioning, and as you say, it's free!

I have tried various panels and diffusers all round the room but I find it sucks out life, for my taste. The biggest problem imo is high frequency energy bouncing about in nasty ways and the old sound reverberating around the room killing the new sound, it squashes dynamics.

Still I do use a kind of window plug and some scatter devices behind my speakers. It's a work in progress, a rta of the room is my next thing and go from there. I do have music in my room though that's entertaining to say the least.

I know there seems to be arguments here but really the path to good sounds is fairly universal, I agree with you on these issues because it's impossible not to if you have hands on expirance with trying to get real music in you home the conclusions you have come to are inevitable.

I love music, so all I care about is sharing the process of making it a reality in our homes. You can't really fall out with anyone if that's your core goal.

 

[Al M.]

I have tried various panels and diffusers all round the room but I find it sucks out life, for my taste. The biggest problem imo is high frequency energy bouncing about in nasty ways and the old sound reverberating around the room killing the new sound, it squashes dynamics.

Yes, it does squash dynamics, among other things. The ASC tube traps and sound panels did nothing to suck the life out of the music, the window plugs dampened the room somewhat. The solution: take out a couch in the back of my listening seat (Peter A.'s great suggestion).

You can also counter-balance room treatment by changing/removing carpets.

The tube traps have been brilliantly successful in removing bouncing energy in mid and high frequencies. In my estimation they are more efficient in doing so than sound panels, even though these were also beneficial in my case.

While the room previously was in the way, it is so interesting how much more of the recorded acoustics I can now hear. The music becomes much more atmospheric and involving. Soundstage depth has increased tremendously.

 

[spazmatron]

Yes, it does squash dynamics, among other things. The ASC tube traps and sound panels did nothing to suck the life out of the music, the window plugs dampened the room somewhat. The solution: take out a couch in the back of my listening seat (Peter A.'s great suggestion).

You can also counter-balance room treatment by changing/removing carpets.

The tube traps have been brilliantly successful in removing bouncing energy in mid and high frequencies. In my estimation they are more efficient in doing so than sound panels, even though these were also beneficial in my case.

While the room previously was in the way, it is so interesting how much more of the recorded acoustics I can now hear. The music becomes much more atmospheric and involving.

Yes being a confirmed audio nut case I have spent many a hour treating my room by moving furniture around. It makes a massive difference. I have had bass traps in the past but yours look better. What's great about your room is the space you have behind your speakers, I bet you have a nice deep soundstage.

I probably have a little too much of my rooms acoustics in my music but it's not that bad... Though this is WBF not NBF so I will strive for better. I am very happy with my gear so tinkering with room acoustics is all I have left to do. Seems like you Boston audio geezers have a good thing going between you.

Cheers

Oh and as far as what I want to hear in my room, I want a trumpet to sound like a trumpet, double bass to sound like a double bass etc. That kind of what I got to be fair to myself.

 

[Al M.]

Yes being a confirmed audio nut case I have spent many a hour treating my room by moving furniture around. It makes a massive difference. I have had bass traps in the past but yours look better. What's great about your room is the space you have behind your speakers, I bet you have a nice deep soundstage.

Oh, I had just edited my previous post to reflect that. Yes, the soundstage is very deep at times, to the envy of some guests . Problem was that on many recordings it was too recessed, until the window plugs came along. Now I have massive depth of soundstage on music where it's in the recording itself, and a more forward sounding image otherwise. There's so much variation in presentation, it's just a pleasure.

I probably have a little too much of my rooms acoustics in my music but it's not that bad... Though this is WBF not NBF so I will strive for better. I am very happy with my gear so tinkering with room acoustics is all I have left to do.

Perhaps the ASC products might be worth a try. I had already had great success with just two tubetraps in the corners, with six it's obviously even better.

Seems like you Boston audio geezers have a good thing going between you.

Cheers

Yes, we do, it's great!

 

[Al M.]

I should add, the beauty of the ASC tube traps is that they have an absorptive and a reflective side, so you can fine-tune. I use the reflective side.

 

[spazmatron]

I should add, the beauty of the ASC tube traps is that they have an absorptive and a reflective side, so you can fine-tune. I use the reflective side.

Yes I probably would also, not sure about getting them in the uk.

So we are all agreed and not telling each other where to get off kind of feels wired

 

[Al M.]

Yes I probably would also, not sure about getting them in the uk.

I found these two links, for ASC and other products in the UK, perhaps this helps:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/feb99/articles/asctrap.432.htm

http://www.hifiwigwam.com/showthread.php?19879-Is-the-a-UK-based-ASC-tube-trap-supplier-distridutor

So we are all agreed and not telling each other where to get off kind of feels wired

Very enjoyable, isn't it?

 

[spazmatron]

I found these two links, for ASC and other products in the UK, perhaps this helps:

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/feb99/articles/asctrap.432.htm

http://www.hifiwigwam.com/showthread.php?19879-Is-the-a-UK-based-ASC-tube-trap-supplier-distridutor



Very enjoyable, isn't it?

That's a help thanks!

Well we are a rare example at the moment.

though we have taken the thread well off topic. we have in doing so created the most cordial passage in recent WBF history... Well at least in mikes area.

 

[Gregadd]

Giving up so easily. My niece and nephew are more committed to their temper tantrums.
I wonder if you truly have the courage of your convictions. Get back on your horse...

 

[Al M.]

That's a help thanks!

Well we are a rare example at the moment.

though we have taken the thread well off topic. we have in doing so created the most cordial passage in recent WBF history... Well at least in mikes area.

 

[Al M.]

Giving up so easily. My niece and nephew are more committed to their temper tantrums.

Hehe.

 

[Blizzard]

I've got my favorite speaker cables, obviously it's not for everyone or every speaker, so I won't try to convince anyone about its advantages.

The cable sheath says 1992 so I know they are nicely aged now.

Yes, those are 1/2" nuts.

1992 was a good year for copper

 

[853guy]

Do you attend the DHA meetings? If so might meet you there one day

Best wishes

Brother spaz

Hey brother. I stopped going. Once you get to a certain age the membership starts declining.

a+

 

[853guy]

Must be an analog guy. Thanks for the tips

Actually, I just go wherever the music is. If I may borrow from the inimitable Mr. Gary Koh, I’d say I’m format agnostic. Truthfully, Blizz, if someone made music I loved available only on cassette (a distinct possibility given some of the music I listen to), I’d buy that.

(There is a very nice CR-7A on eBay right now… Deep breaths… deep breaths)

I’m not here to tell you what to do, or what to think. My perspective is nothing more or less than that - a perspective - and comes with limitations. Mostly, it’s been shaped by experience, some of which has come from making a lot of mistakes and having a lot of regrets.

But you have a skill set I don’t. Plenty of us can talk crap on a forum trying to win the internet. Look, see? Here I am doing just that right now. But I feel fairly confident that should you put your money where your mouth is, and actually release the product you’re confident will be part of shaping the future of how we enjoy pre-recorded music in the home, the lives of audiophiles and music lovers will be changed in a way no amount of fervent posting on a forum will ever achieve. Even if that forum has your name on it.

Again, all the best, Blizz.

853guy

 

[Blizzard]

Actually, I just go wherever the music is. If I may borrow from the inimitable Mr. Gary Koh, I’d say I’m format agnostic. Truthfully, Blizz, if someone made music I loved available only on cassette (a distinct possibility given some of the music I listen to), I’d buy that.

(There is a very nice CR-7A on eBay right now… Deep breaths… deep breaths)

I’m not here to tell you what to do, or what to think. My perspective is nothing more or less than that - a perspective - and comes with limitations. Mostly, it’s been shaped by experience, some of which has come from making a lot of mistakes and having a lot of regrets.

But you have a skill set I don’t. Plenty of us can talk crap on a forum trying to win the internet. Look, see? Here I am doing just that right now. But I feel fairly confident that should you put your money where your mouth is, and actually release the product you’re confident will be part of shaping the future of how we enjoy pre-recorded music in the home, the lives of audiophiles and music lovers will be changed in a way no amount of fervent posting on a forum will ever achieve. Even if that forum has your name on it.

Again, all the best, Blizz.

853guy

Thanks again for the advice, but you, like many are assuming that the technology I discuss is my technology. Actually nothing I have discussed on this forum is my technology. This is all technology others have developed. I'm just discussing it. I'm here to discuss technology, and audio gear that's all.

I thought that's what audio forums are for? Well that's what Blizzard's corner is for anyways.

 

[bonzo75]

I should add, the beauty of the ASC tube traps is that they have an absorptive and a reflective side, so you can fine-tune. I use the reflective side.

The DAAD do that too

 

[853guy]

Thanks again for the advice, but you, like many are assuming that the technology I discuss is my technology. Actually nothing I have discussed on this forum is my technology. This is all technology others have developed. I'm just discussing it. I'm here to discuss technology, and audio gear that's all.

I thought that's what audio forums are for? Well that's what Blizzard's corner is for anyways.

So this is happening, or not?

So currently I'm working on a SOTA active speaker system. Another project is a stand alone 2 channel streamer/DAC/amp combo unit. I have teams in 6 countries working on different parts of the system. But I'm hoping to have the 2 channel combo unit ready early in the new year.

 

[Blizzard]

So this is happening, or not?

Yes I'm working on stuff, but the technology I've been discussing hasn't been mine. So far I've discussed almost every DAC related technology out there from several brands. I discussed a bit about the speaker system on my active speaker thread, and that's about it.

 

[853guy]

Yes I'm working on stuff, but the technology I've been discussing hasn't been mine.

Great. I look forward to your implementation of it.