Odd as I’ve been listening to Roon all week and it’s been a long time since I’ve been able to do that. I wonder if 918 caused one of Emile’s optimizations to no longer provide a benefit. I should mention though that I’m using HQPlayer with Roon.
Sound Quality of new roon versions (builds)
- Thread starter christoph
- Start date
I'm not sure why there's so much animosity towards ROON, it was IMO the first truly fully comprehensive music app that made future apps like TAS' and others possible. It set the baseline for a very good GUI. And even if its focus isn't solely on sound (think about the majority of their customer base - hint - it's not audiophile boomers) it can leverage HQplayer as a back - end predominantly avoiding sonic problems. Which makes me ask - has anyone compared TAS' player to HQPlayer with ROON? Or HQplayer solo? My $ is on HQplayer solo, but admittedly I've never used or heard TAS player.
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TAS and XDMS are only software players of Taiko music servers. They are the same as Mosaic app of Dcs, Aurender app of Aurender... You cannot hear them if you don't have their products and you also cannot compare TAS with Mosaic, Aurender. They are not the universal software players like Roon, HQplayer or mConnect...
I love Roon as a way to explore music and to connect you and drive you to access much more of the music that you have and take you away from just cycling through same ol same ol several hundreds of favourites. I’ve grown much more in music appreciation since having Roon as library manager and in some ways also a bit less stressed about the sound as I’m getting much more joy from the journey into music.
But the post build 898 turn of events wasn’t for me about some shift in tonal balance or a change in small ways… it was about a sudden significant loss of coherence and also a quite weird mid bass eq thing that reminds me of the ways people who like effects play with the sound to emphasise certain things and happy with it being more obvious and artificial rather than having the music sound like it’s just being true to represent the way that instruments can actually sound in life.
So with the recent builds the parts of the sound don’t come together into any kind of coherent musically connected whole. That is different for me than just some small shifts in the sound of things but creates a more fundamental disconnect. No point in discovering great music if it then struggles to engage you. I mean how do you even know if it’s great music anymore if you have to analyse it to find things that you appreciate in it.
I still love Roon and will hold out hope that they will find their way back to the path (and sack whichever soul less tinkerer
took over sound quality more recently).My salvation is that I’m able to switch to squeezlite in Roon and get away from the Roon back end (currently more of a back end in more ways than one).
I haven’t given up hope… as long as squeezlite squeezes up lemonade while Roon continues to just give us the lemons
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You are aware that the filter-deleting-thing is also valid and neccessary in roon with squeezelite as output engine, right?My salvation is I’m able to switch to squeezlite in Roon and get away from the Roon back end (currently more of a back end in more ways than one
Thanks Christoph, yes I was already over on squeezlite when I deleted the filters and the shift in sound was surprising.
Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
You sound like a broken record.
FWIW I too loved Roon when I got my Extreme. It opened up a whole new world of music listening for me until one day after a new Roon build there was a total loss of SQ. This has also been reported by users of Roon who don’t have an Extreme. It was a universal problem. You keep telling us you’ve never heard any decline in sound quality after any Roon build. Good on you is all I can say. This change is not isolated but continues to happen with virtually every build now. Then when manufacturers take matters into their own hands and design something that almost certainly will be better than Roon you get your knickers in a wad and tell us that Roon is still the best if only manufacturers learn how to tweak it and make it better. Well other manufacturers are done with Roon and have taken matters into their own hands by designing a player that is better than Roon and you continue to have blinkers on your eyes and ears to think that there will be something better than Roon and you cry foul because it’s only for Taiko users. I continue to love the Roon platform and interface but at the end of the day it is the best SQ I search. It used to be Roon but sadly not any more. I laud Emile and his team for spending 2 1/2 years of R and D developing XDMS. BTW after they created XDMS version one it was completely rewritten and made even better and version 2 will be released in May. I’ve seen a few screen grabs and to me they were as nice or nicer than Roon
Digital now is changing so rapidly that todays SOTA technology becomes tomorrows book ends. I laud Taiko and its determination to bring its users the very best of the best in sound quality with a platform as good or better than Roon. I’m confidant he will pull it off. I also know that miss doesn’t grow under Emile’s feet and he has a mind that is always finding ways to make thinks sonically better in virtually every upgrade he has given his users He has found a better way to control the signal from the time it hits the router until it exits the Extreme. He and his team have literally developed a solution at every point if the signals path in and out of the Extreme. So are you with me yet Steve. You can’t hear a difference so this is lijely why you are so upset to think that we Extreme users are going to find the poison bulked that will put Roon out of its misery for us. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again……my anticipation of the pending release of XDMS will result in a significant increase in Extreme sales. Then when he releases his network card, switch and router all to make for better sound quality I truly believe that XDMS and Taiko will be positioned at the top of the heap but for you Steve it won’t matter as you have never heard the change in SQ that the rest of us have so it really doesn’t matter. IMO you’re but a lone voice in the wind here.
"never the twain shall meet."
servers that commit to Roon organically have advantages with Roon. servers that don't, are going to be up and down with Roon.
servers with their own proprietary software will have that what they have, and Roon will rise and fall on their servers if Roon can even be a choice.
if you want to do a head to head with both ways (gosh, who would think of doing that? ) you will have a subjective result for that moment in time. but later you won't know.
it's how this goes.
servers that commit to Roon organically have advantages with Roon. servers that don't, are going to be up and down with Roon.
servers with their own proprietary software will have that what they have, and Roon will rise and fall on their servers if Roon can even be a choice.
if you want to do a head to head with both ways (gosh, who would think of doing that?
) you will have a subjective result for that moment in time. but later you won't know.it's how this goes.
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Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
The beauty of Taiko is that using their app you can switch easily and quickly from TAS ( soon to be XDMS) to Roon so I beg to differ about never the Twain shall meet. It will be an easy a/b test because the Extreme will play both. How’s that for a commitment. The best of both worlds all in one package."never the twain shall meet."
servers that commit to Roon organically have advantages with Roon. servers that don't, are going to be up and down with Roon.
servers with their own proprietary software will have that what they have, and Roon will rise and fall on their servers.
if you want to do a head to head with both ways (gosh, who would think of doing that?
it's how this goes.
View attachment 90875
done it. not close at that particular time. neither TAS nor Roon on the Extreme were as good as organic Roon to my ears and others (who were Extreme owners). why? that's another question. what is causing what?
but that was 2 months ago......so present day and the future is a question.
i do agree that being able to do both Roon and TAS is a potential advantage. probably. let's revisit this question in a year or 18 months. might be interesting. the 'sharps' in Vegas might lay you some odds......
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Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
Things don’t stand still Mike. Personally I think you’re in for a surprise. Nothing stands still with Emile. In the digital domain. He has never failed to deliver something bettter in his updates
FWIW I have no idea what you’re talking about when you say” organic” Roon l
FWIW I have no idea what you’re talking about when you say” organic” Roon l
'organic Roon' is just that. Roon is integrated into the server design.
i don't doubt Emile. but i also don't limit him to any particular pathway. whether XDMS or Roon is a better vehicle to ride into the future, i'm confident Emile will choose best. i'm not religious about it either, i'm agnostic about the method, all in on the result.
I am explaining what TAS is to @sbo6 but you quote my post and advertise XDMS. What for? Taiko fans is really blind. XDMS is only software player for Taiko, nothing else. I never see Dcs fans praise lavishly the Mosaic app each time it is updated although it is also the amazing app. Mosaic is also better then Roon so much to Dcs fans but they are still so polite. They are really music lovers. In the meanwhile, it's so funny whenever Taiko updates TAS or XDMS, Taiko fans will extol Emile to the skies immediately.
What do you think about the software players? It will change games? You think that, do you? Pure illusion!
Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
We’re not blind at all. It’s you that seems to be turning a blind eye because you can’t accept that there will be something better than Roon. I’d say we Extreme users have our heads screwed on correctly and continue to seek the best SQ. You on the other hand have never heard a problem. Your head is in the sand I’m afraid. Progress moves on and if you think Roon will continue to be the best is narrow minded IMHO
Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
Bottom line to me is you’re a whiner. All manufacturers are coming to the conclusion that Roon is not what it used to be and are writing their own solutions but you are the one who is thumping your chest about Roon. Once again read the OP of this thread as everyone’s posts in this thread except yours seem to be consistent. To me it is becoming obvious that there will be many solutions to Roon all of which will indeed be better IMHO
Hahaha. Please read my posts again.
If companies put Roon is their core, they will need to optimize their OS to take full use of Roon. In this situation, Roon is the best.
If companies create ABC software player to optimize their music servers, ABC is the best.
Remember that.
Could you expand on this a bit MIke? I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the difference between ordinary Roon (cross-platform player for everything from cellphones to high-end servers) and Roon integrated into the server design.
With all respect -- I'm just trying to understand and not trying to mount some defense of Taiko/Extreme or anything else.
Thanks,
Steve Z
Steve Williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
Let it go Honestly you sound like a broken record as well as a spoiled kid yelling . You accept yours and I’ll accept mine. It’s all good
As I just wrote to Mike L. could you explain a bit what is involved or how a company puts Roon at their core and optimizes their designs for Roon. And by extension, how that insulates their platforms and their customers from the variable sound quality of Roon after each new release.
Honest question -- I'm trying to understand how this is accomplished and not trying to mount a defense of any particular manufacturer or platform or software music player.
Thank you,
Steve Z
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