Yes. It is a peak spectra using exactly the same 60 seconds of music. I tried different periods and the result was similar. Surely it would be great if someone repeats it to confirm.
Zero Distortion: Tango Time
- Thread starter bonzo75
- Start date
Great idea. Maybe we could extract more familiar figures if the freq axis was also log scale?
Good, thanks. A nice full sound with weight and density. Both videos show the low bassoons entry after the horn intro through the phone and my tablet. Copper cable is slightly better intonation. As you say the associated gears -- AS2000, Lammies, and Cessaro with bass - let the cables show themselves. I have this and will play it tonight.
I love this music. There is no greatest symphony but if there were M3 would be in the running.
I also have this very recording and decided to play it this afternoon after watching Tang’s video. I wish I had an earlier pressing that was not a heavy re-issue.
Hi Peter,
The inexpensive copper interconnect cables are coming. Right now I am using Denon speaker cables that ddk gave me even before COVID. I don't know what model. They are old. Rubber cable sleeve has turned very dark no model number. Not the same as yours I was told. The phono cable I already described in 3012R thread. Ddk didn't recommend this phono cable to me. Imo it offers many advantages over the SME stock cable while maintaining normal sound not overplay or overexpose sound. Both speaker cable and phono cable took a long breakin time to show their true dna. They sucked on the first week of playing...muddy dull veil no top end no lowest bottom. I was impatient. Only committed myself to try again about two months ago. Now find them great speaker cables. Very different from Kuro Silvergold. Flip of a hand changed my sound presentation. @Al M. is using silvergold cables. I understand his perspective why prefer video 1. Like I said it is great to have flexibility in switching sound presentation making hobby interesting.
I would summarize my past 10 weeks of system evolution as follow.
1) Change of speaker cables. This brings in significant lower mid and upper bass. Tympani, cello, bass brass wind instrument have more authority more oomph. Previously I had something like a bird-eye view with tremendous air kind of presentation when listening big orchestra. Now it is like I am sitting more in front roll and instruments in the back of orchestra are pushed up closer tighter. The sound is fuller denser but feel less space around the orchestra.
2) Direct electricity from pole. This bring serenity to sound. Tone is purer. Increase in definition. High is cleaner. We hear a lot from MikeL saying it is one of his top priorities to do warp 9 and his sound still hold together solidly. I am certain he could not have achieved this without clean power. Funny I now have less effect from vinyl surface noise too. Highly recommend anyone living in a house to do direct dedicated electricity to listening room. It is cheap and gives significant delta. In my case I don't even have an isolation transformer...just a direct line. One thing though, I was in agony and scare the first day with new electricity line. My sound totally collapsed. You will need time yo burn the new electricity wire too. Once your electricity is clean or cleaner you don't need to try to clean electricity using expensive specialized power cords. This is the logic.
3) Change of phono cable. This is now also significant (more significant than when I wrote my impression of the Denon phono cable in 3012R thread.) The new phono cable also needs a lot of time to burn. I still find it is less energetic less fast than the SME cord but if you already have a very lively system it becomes a non issue. What I get from Denon is an even more palpable more believable sound of musical instrument. The difference in high is obvious as you heard on video. Listening to drum cymbals is even more obvious. All brass withlow frequency tone can be sensed by wind pressurizes in the instrument chamber. Tonal width and woody body is also better with cello, violin, acoustic guitar. With piano you can distinguish between Steinway and Bosendorfer better. Transparency is just as good as the SME stock cord.
Btw, Peter, it is funny you and Al went to concert together, sat next to each other, heard the same sound and music, but interpret sound totally different. May be it all comes down to our head not sound itself because we all can hear the same thing.
Note: Cable and system sound balance are influenced by gears I use in my system. In other system different finding could be found.
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Franciso, remind me to never allow you to analyse my dinner. You will put me off my food!
I only opened it for light. I am blessed with insensitive ears so I hear no difference.
For those exact reasons, better mid and upper bass, and also more weighty low midrange, leading to a fuller, denser sound, I prefer video ONE, which according to you has the Kuro cables. From your description I have a similar taste as you do, Tango, and I do not like a tipped-up presentation with tons of air either. The sound in the second video is far more skeletal, more bare bones in terms of weight, even though it may have some added clarity due to that. From your description it almost sounds as if the videos are reversed. On the other hand, in the first video the cymbal crash towards the beginning is brighter, so that would more be in line with expectations.
Or is the different power delivery a major factor here in the difference between the two videos?
Either videos are reversed or you are hearing the opposite of the person in the room.
Seems like it.
As I said, we are not listening to the system but to videos of the sound. It could even be that my cheap onboard laptop computer DAC and my cheap headphones do something different with regard to the sound of the two videos than you would hear on other playback -- in fact reversing perceived body of sound -- but that seems a bit unlikely.
Hi Peter,
I would summarize my past 10 weeks of system evolution as follow.
1) Change of speaker cables. This brings in significant lower mid and upper bass. Tympani, cello, bass brass wind instrument have more authority more oomph. Previously I had something like a bird-eye view with tremendous air kind of presentation when listening big orchestra. Now it is like I am sitting more in front roll and instruments in the back of orchestra are pushed up closer tighter. The sound is fuller denser but feel less space around the orchestra.
Btw, Peter, it is funny you and Al went to concert together, sat next to each other, heard the same sound and music, but interpret sound totally different. May be it all comes down to our head not sound itself because we all can hear the same thing.
Note: Cable and system sound balance are influenced by gears I use in my system. In other system different finding could be found.
Thank you Tang for this additional information. It will certainly be interesting when the copper interconnect comes. It is clear that cables make a big difference even over these videos and people have all sorts of different ideas about cable sound and preferences. We certainly tune our systems with cable choices. Sometimes the cables have a big affect on the sound and sometimes the cables contribute less allowing you to hear more of the components. I agree with you that choices depend on the gear you have. I think it also depends on what the listener is after.
Your description of the sound of the two videos is just as I hear it over my computer and headphones. Yes I have attended a few concerts with Al and Ian too. Al has stated many times he prefers sitting close to the stage and musicians. The sound is more direct with a different presentation compared to other locations in the hall. The interesting thing about the two videos is that I find video two to sound more direct. The sound is more balanced and I hear the nuance which is closer to what I hear live.
I wonder if listeners’ opinions would be the same if you had not told us which video has which cables. Calling the wires cheap Japanese cables may simply turn some people off while it interests others. Perhaps I am highly biased and like the second video simply because you told us it has cheap and old basic copper cables. That’s my thing now.
I sent the two videos to Hieukm, who owns Kuro, and normally he and his friends prefer high end audio cables. I did not tell him which was which, he preferred the second video.
That is very interesting. How did he react when you told him that he preferred the cheap Japanese copper wires? It is definitely a different sound.
At this point,Tang can also try the cheap cartridge Denon 103R,could be a surpirse with Denon cables
Well, you have a point. Stereo is an illusion and most people are not prepared to know the truth ...
The truth about what Fransisco? I was hoping to learn something from your graphs and how they relate to the different sounds from the videos, but you could not say. We know they sound different just by listening to them. And we know how they sound different. Tang's description is more information that is also helpful. The graphs simply confirm they are different.
You could test Howie's food and tell him that the chemicals are slightly different, but in the end, they are both red meat dishes with spices and he knows which flavor he prefers. I was hoping for more. "Stereo is an illusion and most people are not prepared to know the truth...." That sounds funny, but what the heck does it mean? Tom Cruise told us that we could not handle the truth. The truth here seems to be that Tang prefers the cheap old copper cables. Some might not be prepared for that outcome, but it is what it is. Just like with the power cords.
Peter,
I explained it in the post, I will try to make it even more simple for you.
1. Measurements of cables carried in the audio band do not show differences - it is why the objectivist people are usually cable skeptics.
2, Tang referred that he only changed cables between the two videos.
3. The spectra shown are audio measurements.
4. The spectra show noticeable differences (different amplitude at the same frequency) .
5. 1, 3 and 4 imply that something other than the cables changed during the recording that affected the tonal balance of the recording in a way that can be measured and surely affects the comparison. Surely there is an explanation for it.
I am able to explain you my views on audio science and measurements and debate them, but humor is subjective. As long you do not post videos taken with different power cords I have nothing to say about the subject.
Remember - if an audio measurement would show differences between "decent" cables - signal or power cords we would not have endless, vague and inconclusive debates on them!
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