What sampling / bit rate would equal vinyl?
- Thread starter claytonJ2
- Start date
This thread has diverted as usual. The original poster's question should be fairly easy to calculate from first principles. The diamond that tracks a vinyl groove has finite dimensions. The most advanced such stones have two radii of curvature, one along their axis and one across it. The latter radius, which is the smaller in elliptical or more sophisticated profiles, is the one that does the information retrieval. Any lateral information that is smaller than this radius is hardly going to be noticed by it and, if a lot smaller, will be completely missed, just like a car with large tyres will not be disturbed by a tiny pothole. Based on any particular diamond's profile (for example the Ortofon Replicant stylus has a contact surface of 5 microns minimum radius), the distortion the cartridge creates when tracking a groove of similar displacement, the voltage generated, and factoring in subsequent RIAA deemphasis, at least the bit depth required should be relatively straightforward to calculate (for similar harmonic distortion levels). The frequency response necessary can also be approached along the same lines.
It may be simple for you, but definitely not for me. So do you feel like crunching the numbers since you know how? I would personally appreciate your efforts as I believe others here would.
It may be simple for you, but definitely not for me. So do you feel like crunching the numbers since you know how? I would personally appreciate your efforts as I believe others here would.
+ 1 ...
It may be simple for you, but definitely not for me. So do you feel like crunching the numbers since you know how? I would personally appreciate your efforts as I believe others here would.
Here, here. I'm a software test lead by trade, so I understand taking a methodical unbiased approach to this sort of thing. But I don't have the detailed knowledge to be able to formulate a test. Every time I think about it, I come up with so many ways to blow holes in the results. I enjoy records more than digitally sourced material, mostly. But I know they were digital during mastering. It doesn't make sense to me. I can think of all kinds of reasons why, but I can't test for them all.
The vinyl issue interests me little, therefore I'd rather delegate scutwork. I'm sure there are mathematically inclined volunteers to do it. If not, so much the worse for them
They were recorded and mastered at high definition and you listen to them at the Red Book level. This accounts for the objective deficiencies. If the vinyl interface adds its own euphonic ingredients and you like them, it is a matter of personal taste and therefore of no interest to those who do not share that particular taste. If you prefer vinyl material mastered from high definition masters, try to audition it in its original form and decoded by the same equipment used in the mastering process. Only then will confounding variables be eliminated.
I will change it a little. How about:
"If the vinyl interface adds its own euphonic ingredients, that seem to complement the information that was put in the recording during during the recording, mixing and mastering process, and you like them, because it makes it sound more lifelike, enhancing your connection with the music, it is a matter of personal taste and therefore of no interest to those who do not share that particular taste. "
If this would happen only for a few LP recordings I would not be worried - I would forget about it and this discussion. But when it happens in a systematic way, LP after LP, for a few thousands of items in our collections of recordings, and the exception is the CD sounding better, many audiophiles do not want to ignore it.
Since so many people love the sound of LP, I see nothing but opportunity in cloning that effect in digital domain. So who has characterized that coloration and can supply us a digital file with or without so that folks can listen and tell us if they are hearing the LP sound in digital? After all, if the theory of coloration is right, then that transformation by definition can be applied to a digital stream.
BTW, one plausible theory that was put forth before was that a digital master converted to analog in the studio in the process of getting converted to LP may have an advantage in doing the same in your home. Same gear can be used with the same clock and such. I don't know that this can universally answer the difference but it is a difference we cannot duplicate at home to verify.
Exactly so!
Since all sorts of equipment used in studios is freely available, the only case for what you describe to occur would be that certain studios use custom-made equipment to their own exacting specs. AFAIK some studios do, but most do not.
It's a function of the cartridge and preamp, too, naturally... Interesting idea, though. I need to get a system that allows me to apply functions to WAV files or something, then we could try lots of different ideas and see if folk can hear the difference.
I suppose I'd have to add a random pop and click function, maybe a little wobble?
Seriously, haven't there been various LP to CD comparisons performed over the years that would provide some insight? IIRC, the added distortion and crosstalk were among the contributions that "added" to the sound...
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