Zero Distortion: Tango Time

[marty]

And if you’re on a crooner trip at the moment Tang try this album with some background info too.

http://mint-audio-restoration.co.uk/stranger/

View attachment 68444

Whenever a singer comes on Sirius Jazz and I think to myself, it sounds like Sinatra but I know it's not, the correct guess is usually Matt Monro. Not sure why Monro never really made it big. My guess is that he didn't have as well connected a godfather as Sinatra had

As an aside, the "crooner" era was something I came to later in life as I cut my teeth like most boomers on classic rock, straight ahead jazz, and of course, classical. For me, the beauty of the "easy-listening" crooners weren't just the songs (with lyrics that meant something and which you could actually understand) but the incredible arrangements for the band. You'll often notice that when Sinatra finishes a song in a live performance, he usually credits the song writer and the arranger either at the beginning or the end. His favorite arranger by far was Nelson Riddle, who he said had more "tricks in his bag" than any other arranger, but he also used Gordon Jenkins and Marty Paich extensively. These things are always personal as I prefer those that could really swing, so if you want to explore this genre, you might consider Sinatra, Sammy Davis Jr. (arguably the greatest entertainer who ever lived although Louis Prima also has claims to that throne), Met Torme, Bobby Darin and Tony Bennett (who everyone knows Sinatra called "the greatest singer" of all). Really beautiful but tamer singers include the one and only Nat King Cole and Dean Martin. That era of great music will sadly never come again although fortunately, much of it is preserved rather well. And no, Harry Connick Jr and Michael Buble (although he's quite enjoyable) do not count!

Finally, and perhaps worthy of a new thread, if I could rent a time machine to go back and hear only 1 concert live, my choice would be Sinatra, Live at the Sands, ini 1966 featuring the Count Basie orchestra and with arrangements by Quincy Jones. That would have been something to see and hear in person.

 

[Tango]

Inspired by Mike starting his day with Mahler 2 at 5 in the morning, I juice up myself before work with this Wagner's Die Walkure. It is by Solti. Decca from the 60's. I didn't source this from the General. Would have been even better from him. The recording presentation is now back to my usual comfort zone...deep behind the front wall with hall reverb. I also bought the Scheherazade that Peter played in his video. That recording expanded width 1.5 meter through side walls. Since I added my FLH bass I admit I have been getting sucked into symphony works and buying more records. It is the way to really enjoy and the purpose of having a big system. Doing stereo at warp 9 with big more complicated music is an addictive experience. Not only the system needs to be able to perform but also the room. I found thing to improve my room more. Beginning to understand why Mike likes going warp 9.

 

[the sound of Tao]

That sounds fantastic Tang, you can virtually see the Valkyries charging in... and horns doing horns, amazing. Great way to get the office under way for the day.

Very much inspired by the multi horn with sub bass horn outcome that you have brought about and that life-like and effortless scale that you have. It really does justice to the complete vitality of this music.

 

[cjfrbw]

I gather Brunhild isn't a woman you say no to.

 

[MadFloyd]

Very nice, Tang!

 

[Tango]

Thank you Ian, Tao. A good disc can make any system sound good. I have a friend who is more of a music lover than audiophile. His system is vintage base not expensive if you go by the cost of systems of people in this forum. But he has great collection of vinyls. When I go see him it is always very enjoyable and good sound.

 

[andromedaaudio]

Henk, for your first two videos can you do one from a longer distance, just to see the difference? Like 4 meters?

Ked when you and ron where at my other place the machines were not right , the telefunken was configured mono, not calibrated / checked no recap .
The B 62 had several exploded caps due to them being soldered in wrong ( direction) , also the machines were not checked:/ calibrated correctly for modern high output tapes

Now the telefunken M 15 A is at play , whats better ? i think they both sound okay
Only thing about the telefunken is that its noisy , its either the capstan or reel motors or both , they are much more noisy then the B 62 , the B62 is also quiter then a A 80 RC MK 2
Also from the pavarotti live Tape ( its actually the : Luciano Pavarotti - live concert reel one (special edition) wooden box version .

The other one is from greetje kauffeld Dutch jazz singer / 1965 recording STS ( dutch company that makes tapes ect )

 

[Tango]

Ked when you and ron where here the machines were not right , the telefunken was configured mono, not calibrated / checked no recap .
The B 62 had several exploded caps due to them being soldered in wrong ( direction) , also the machines were not checked:/ calibrated correctly for modern high output tapes

Now the telefunken M 15 A is at play , whats better ? i think they both sound okay
Only thing about the telefunken is that its noisy , its either the capstan or reel motors or both , they are much more noisy then the B 62 , the B62 is also quiter then a A 80 RC MK 2
Also from the pavarotti live Tape ( its actually the : Luciano Pavarotti - live concert reel one (special edition) wooden box version .

The other one is from greetje kauffeld Dutch jazz singer / 1965 recording STS ( dutch company that makes tapes ect )

I have 6-7 STS tapes. I don't find any above par. Better off with your other tapes...much better.

 

[andromedaaudio]

I have 6-7 STS tapes. I don't find any above par. Better off with your other tapes...much better.

Wow 6 .
Yeah, there is a lot of different levels just like any other medium.
Just plunking down 300 - 400 - 500 euro doesnt mean its gonna be amazing .
But the sts is an old recording .



Brg hj

 

[andromedaaudio]

I have one tape i bought from a choir recording that is so bad and full of pops / clicks that i should feel embarrassed to ship it out even for 20 euros .
It sounds like the mikes where in the hall entrance somewhere .

Ps i won t mention names, i suppose the guy did his best

 

[Tango]

I wrote once that listening to Gian's video of his system playing Jazz at Pawnshop led me to an attempt to create freeer sound that portray better recording ambient. I couldn't find Gian's Pawnshop video but here is another video showing sound character of his room.

One day I find that Pawnshop video I will post. If you listen to my videos without the absorber panel now, you will find one similar character of Gian's and my room sound. Our rooms give a pretty good sense of recording ambient in a lively open manner. Without his video I would not have arrived where I am now. I examined his room and asked him for descriptions of his room. I found his room absolutely has no acoustic tweak...pretty much a bear room with some furniture. Whereas my room was designed to be an office using a lot of thick concrete and glass. It had hell a lot of reverb and snap. I had my acoustician fixed the problem. He put carpet on my polished concrete floor, tall absorbers on side walls, three on front walls and 70% of my ceiling has hanging absorber panels. Ddk was in my room said it was borderline dead...hehe.

So I took the three absorber panels, each 1m x 3m, that covered my front glass wall out. Right away I heard sound totally open up, lively and energetic. The stage went very deep and very dimensional. I thought WOW..Where is all this "air" come from. But the sound became a lot more snappy, transient is lightning quick, too snappy too quick. I then thought a hard wooden surface might retain the air and dimension while making sound less snappy and hard. So I had the acoustician make me the wood diffuser that I am using now. And the sound is like what you hear on my videos showing Then vs Now.

In term of staging, I know for sure that I could do even better if I have a meter or so behind my speakers. I heard what these Cessaro can do at my dealer friend's place before. His was at least two meters from front wall. But we can only do what we can in a given environment.

 

[howiebrou]

I wrote once that listening to Gian's video of his system playing Jazz at Pawnshop led me to an attempt to create freeer sound that portray better recording ambient. I couldn't find Gian's Pawnshop video but here is another video showing sound character of his room.

One day I find that Pawnshop video I will post. If you listen to my videos without the absorber panel now, you will find one similar character of Gian's and my room sound. Our rooms give a pretty good sense of recording ambient in a lively open manner. Without his video I would not have arrived where I am now. I examined his room and asked him for descriptions of his room. I found his room absolutely has no acoustic tweak...pretty much a bear room with some furniture. Whereas my room was designed to be an office using a lot of thick concrete and glass. It had hell a lot of reverb and snap. I had my acoustician fixed the problem. He put carpet on my polished concrete floor, tall absorbers on side walls, three on front walls and 70% of my ceiling has hanging absorber panels. Ddk was in my room said it was borderline dead...hehe.

So I took the three absorber panels, each 1m x 3m, that covered my front glass wall out. Right away I heard sound totally open up, lively and energetic. The stage went very deep and very dimensional. I thought WOW..Where is all this "air" come from. But the sound became a lot more snappy, transient is lightning quick, too snappy too quick. I then thought a hard wooden surface might retain the air and dimension while making sound less snappy and hard. So I had the acoustician make me the wood diffuser that I am using now. And the sound is like what you hear on my videos showing Then vs Now.

In term of staging, I know for sure that I could do even better if I have a meter or so behind my speakers. I heard what these Cessaro can do at my dealer friend's place before. His was at least two meters from front wall. But we can only do what we can in a given environment.

Tang, I can picture your sound absorption journey vividly, mainly because I am not a fan of overdamped rooms either. I never had an opportunity to try and get a profession to design an acoustically accurate room mainly due to funds and also my own distaste for making my room look like a padded cell. Having visited many homes I am even more convinced now that overdamping and killing the ambience and sound is all too common hence my room has zero treatment. I am lucky, I will admit, to having quite a long and tall t it is weird shaped so not perfect either but I enjoy the openness of it. Whilst echoes would also be unpleasant talking in an overdone room where your words stop short and don’t linger is also something I try and avoid.

 

[Folsom]

Tang maybe what you want is a pair of back firing tweeters?

 

[andromedaaudio]

Orchestra 7.5 ips Per 525 tape Telefunken machine .
I moved the speakers 20 cm back , it gets quit dynamic after a while.

This is what i like about CAT a feeling of effortlessness , i certainly dont wanna lose that.

Organ digital recording / CD with the speakers still at the old position .

With good headphones/ speakers you can hear the low freq. spectrum
With a bigger space / better placement/ liistening position you can hear a bigger soundpicture / more layering.

 

[Tango]

Early this week I received English/Scottish Dances, Malcolm Arnold conducting London Philharmonic Orchestra.. Lyrita SRCS109. I first heard this album from a video of Wilson XVX in HK playing it superbly..only better with my horns . Great great album. If your system has bass tower or subs will be at advantage. The sound will be very very physical. People say you don't hear the bass but feel it. That's exactly how it is with this album. Expensive but worth the money.

@howiebrou Thanks man.

 

[Folsom]

Nice, that's on my want list.

 

[howiebrou]

Early this week I received English/Scottish Dances, Malcolm Arnold conducting London Philharmonic Orchestra.. Lyrita SRCS109. I first heard this album from a video of Wilson XVX in HK playing it superbly..only better with my horns . Great great album. If your system has bass tower or subs will be at advantage. The sound will be very very physical. People say you don't hear the bass but feel it. That's exactly how it is with this album. Expensive but worth the money.

@howiebrou Thanks man.


View attachment 68725

Enjoy Tang. I'm still looking for a copy!

 

[cjfrbw]

Yes, those are good 'uns. Sound great on the vids, too. Long live horns and Lamm ML3s!

 

[PeterA]

I wrote once that listening to Gian's video of his system playing Jazz at Pawnshop led me to an attempt to create freeer sound that portray better recording ambient. I couldn't find Gian's Pawnshop video but here is another video showing sound character of his room.

One day I find that Pawnshop video I will post. If you listen to my videos without the absorber panel now, you will find one similar character of Gian's and my room sound. Our rooms give a pretty good sense of recording ambient in a lively open manner. Without his video I would not have arrived where I am now. I examined his room and asked him for descriptions of his room. I found his room absolutely has no acoustic tweak...pretty much a bear room with some furniture. Whereas my room was designed to be an office using a lot of thick concrete and glass. It had hell a lot of reverb and snap. I had my acoustician fixed the problem. He put carpet on my polished concrete floor, tall absorbers on side walls, three on front walls and 70% of my ceiling has hanging absorber panels. Ddk was in my room said it was borderline dead...hehe.

So I took the three absorber panels, each 1m x 3m, that covered my front glass wall out. Right away I heard sound totally open up, lively and energetic. The stage went very deep and very dimensional. I thought WOW..Where is all this "air" come from. But the sound became a lot more snappy, transient is lightning quick, too snappy too quick. I then thought a hard wooden surface might retain the air and dimension while making sound less snappy and hard. So I had the acoustician make me the wood diffuser that I am using now. And the sound is like what you hear on my videos showing Then vs Now.

In term of staging, I know for sure that I could do even better if I have a meter or so behind my speakers. I heard what these Cessaro can do at my dealer friend's place before. His was at least two meters from front wall. But we can only do what we can in a given environment.

This is a very interesting post, Tang. First you write that you have a new impression of Magico speakers from hearing my videos, and here you post that listening to Gian's video convinced you to change your room acoustics. Boy, for some people, the impact that these system videos can have seems quite big. Good for you for having the open mind and searching for something better.

I agree with you about room treatments sometimes being too much and overdampening the room. I removed the last treatment from my listening room, a 2' X 2' panel behind the listening seat, last week and am now experimenting with the angles of the wooden louvers on my windows. I guess those are a bit like a diffraction device. DDK told me it is all about managing the energy in the room. Removing those TubeTraps from my room really opened my ears. I am now simply using the furniture and rug for sound treatments. Al M. has started to do the same thing with a few of his tubes and panels, but not all yet.

 

[Tango]

Yes, those are good 'uns. Sound great on the vids, too. Long live horns and Lamm ML3s!

It is very different kind of presentation with the Gamma/ML3 vs the XVX/Goldmund. I wish I could show the different of two videos but unfortunately the other one is private. The XVX video caught my ears in the way creating the sense of "see everything" of that venue right there in front of you..the sound scene is unbelievable really. I could be very wrong. But mine feels a bit more walking entering "into" the venue from the back of the hall. The energy of this recording is quite something and with horns radiating subs moving air. The listening sensation is very satisfying to my ears and my skin. This I cannot be wrong describing.