Musical Fidelity 550K Superchargers

[Phelonious Ponk]

I think it’s going to take Fred awhile to decode what the MFs are bringing to the table (or taking off the table) besides the added power. Right now he is giddy with what they are bringing to the table, but it remains to be seen if long-term happiness will result (and I’m not saying it won’t).

I don’t think there is any free lunch, and I don’t know that it is possible to lash up a tube amp to a SS monster amp and expect only an increase in available power output and no added sonic signature from the SS amp. It seems to me that adding the Super Chargers is mixing and matching colorations from two different technologies. I believe that you can run the Super Chargers as straight up power amps can’t you? If so, it would be interesting to hear them without the tube amp in the signal chain and see if the sound gets better, worse, or just different. I can’t get past the feeling that if the Super Chargers are totally tonally neutral, than that means you are using the preceding amp as a tone control.

A tube tone enhancer? Even if the big iron is neutral, and it's probably close enough, it will still add a hell of a sonic signature. Sufficient headroom and driver control is a sonic signature, and a very good one, indeed.

Tim

 

[Orb]

I agree but we will not know for sure until an update.
It will be interesting to see if it maintains what is great about tubes (and what this listener loved with his own tube gear) without the associated weaknesses, question on everyone's mind I assume is what tube benefits-preferences are lost in such a setup.

Cheers
Orb

 

[FrantzM]

Hi

Traveling and not sleeping ..AT the risk of derailing the thread ... My thoughts...

First I tend to wonder what do tubes do that SS don't or aren't able to? I am no longer convinced of the superiority of tubes...
Second a potentially better path, IMO, would be a Tube preamp to drive the MF (interesting acronym don't you think people ? ) . It is likely that the load presented by the Supercharger input is benign to any power amp... Yet what is fed to it goes through a transformer .. It seems to me that avoiding that step could improve the overall performance of the system.

Anyhow Fred do enjoy your system.. Maggies do require ton of power... the Jolida was just trying .. Now you're doing

 

[Orb]

One primary aspect depends if you believe in time domain distortion, which in theory is managed better by tube gear.
Another that I have not seen measured is both time and frequency domain for a chord, so the harmonic spectral decay of say C major chord and the associated harmonic-partials, without this it makes the rest pretty hard to quantify such as the preference of timbre-texture-warmth-etc which do not rely upon THD beyond good solid state (quite a lot of the best tubes match performance of solid state in this regard).
Best for another thread IMO Frantz as it will go on for many pages, without us actually having any useful data, and therefore will go in the usual reiterative cycle and mess up this thread I feel.

Cheers
Orb

 

[Gregadd]

I think I should just go ahead and start a thread about solid state vs tubes. The problem is that not every product is an all out design. My belief is that the engineers or designers have pretty much figured out how to deal with shortcomings of both genres. But it comes at a price. The question is what distortions can you live with and how much power do you need. Most products are still built to a price point.
IMO the great designers where the guys who could build great products that the average audiophile could take home and still be able to send his kids to college.

 

[Fred]

I had written a reply to the questions posed yesterday morning, but somehow it got screwed up, I hit the wrong button and it was wiped out. I really hate that.

I'll write more about what I'm hearing later in the week, but for now there are a few things that I believe are settled.

The sound that is being produced through the Maggies is very smooth and natural sounding. I always felt the Jolida brought just a nice relaxed wholesomeness to my room. Now with the 550's I have not noticed one shread of any solid state coolness, dryness, etch, grain, etc., the common descriptions that are often bestowed upon the solid state sound. (A tonal quality that I decidedly did hear in the weeks that I had the Marantz IA in the system.)

Also, it's not that these amps deliver a great deal more SPL factor. What they do deliver is real and palpable dynamics. There is a slam factor and a better feeling of musical truth now than at any time in the past. Do these amps add a tonal character of there own? I don't know if I would ever be able to truthfully answer that question because it is making the Jolida sound like it has never sounded before nor was it ever capable of sounding like it does now, while it was a stand alone. Is this how the Jolida would sound if it were a 250 watt tube monster? I don't know. What I do know, is that the overall presentation strikes me the same as it did before, just much, much better. And by the way, the bass extension has gotten a whole lot better and more refined and defined. A huge benefit in and of itself.

The proof of this will come in 3 months or so. Will I be looking for a new power source, or will I be still living happily with this setup.

 

[mep]

Fred-the improvements you have described sound like improvements one would expect if you swapped out a lower powered tube amp for a good high powered SS amp. I don’t know that you are really listening to the Jolida amp at all anymore.

 

[Orb]

Not sure myself MEP, takes a special solid state to get even close to very good tube in their midrange and the textures,richer sound, depth-weight of the sound,etc.
And from Musical Fidelity only their big chassis lowish powered Class A products get close to it (from my experience with many of their products).

Seems Fred is describing only the improvements that are down to solid state.
Fred when you get the chance might be worth describing what has been kept from the tube as it would help.

Thanks
Orb

 

[FrantzM]

Orb

We may have to move our replies to the other thread but the notion of "wight of music" seems to be carried very nicely by SS .. I would never call the reproduction from Krell (to name just this one), light .. as for texture .. I do find the better SS satisfying on that count too (Burmester, DarTzeel, Gryphon, MBL, Spectral, plinius, etc ..)

 

[es347]

Orb

We may have to move our replies to the other thread but the notion of "wight of music" seems to be carried very nicely by SS .. I would never call the reproduction from Krell (to name just this one), light .. as for texture .. I do find the better SS satisfying on that count too (Burmester, DarTzeel, Gryphon, MBL, Spectral, plinius, etc ..)

.....McIntosh

 

[Orb]

.....McIntosh

Yeah they also can measure as well as a very good solid state, their anniversary was quite incredible.
Frantz regarding the depth-weight (go together), well I have had 600+ watt amps from various top manufacturers, and there is something about the best tube sound, do not forget some aspects subtly come from the preamp as well.
BTW I am a solid state person at heart myself, just that I still feel there are subtle and then some not so subtle differences between them.
Cheers
Orb

 

[Fred]

Sorry I had to check out on the conversation. Just got back from the Saints vs. Texans game.

I really do wish that the Jolida had pre-out jacks. I'd have them run to the single ended inputs of the MF's right now to see what the amps sound like as actual monoblocks. We're having our monthly audio club meeting this Thursday. I'll see if any of the members has a decent (and spare) pre-amp that they might let me borrow for a week or two. I'd be very interested in that .

 

[fas42]

I had written a reply to the questions posed yesterday morning, but somehow it got screwed up, I hit the wrong button and it was wiped out. I really hate that.

Know what you mean, have done it too many times, some may say I should do it more often . But easy fix: just before you click the big button, select all of your superb prose, and copy and paste it into a Notepad or whatever. Just have to remember to do this!!

Frank

 

[Fred]

A month in now and the 550K's are still impressing me. At this point I will say that if the amps are introducing any of its own signature to the sound, it's a very compelling signature. Realistically, however, I think I'm just hearing a much better, more dynamic and open Jolida.

I ran across the attached article from an Australian publication. It's a fairly in-depth review of these amps and I tend to be in agreement with the reviewers observations. I don't know much about measurements, but from the test bench, the amps appear to measure superbly well.

 

[Orb]

Thanks for the update Fred.
If they were introducing lean-cool-harsh sound I am sure you would had suffered from listening satisfaction perspective by now, especially as you use tubes.
BTW how hot to do the 550ks get?
Cheers
Orb

 

[Fred]

Thanks for the update Fred.
If they were introducing lean-cool-harsh sound I am sure you would had suffered from listening satisfaction perspective by now, especially as you use tubes.
BTW how hot to do the 550ks get?
Cheers
Orb

I agree. I think by now the new "fresh" sound would have worn off and the reality would be setting in if they weren't getting the job done. The amps do get warm, but not really hot. The entire outer case is a heat sink, so it does cool effectively. When I think of hot I have the 6550's on the Jolida as a comparison. That's hot.

 

[Gregadd]

Not bad

 

[Fred]

Not bad

They are rather attractive looking and much larger in the flesh than the photos suggest.

 

[Orb]

The design is interesting, not sure what came first.
These or MBLs.
Surprised they moved completely away from this look though, but I get the feeling the consumers either did not get the concept of these amps or did not like the look (so MF just stopped the model and look).

Cheers
Orb