More Consensus That Streaming Is An Inferior Format & Not High End?

[thedudeabides]

Message vs the messenger. I'll chose the message any day of the week.

 

[JackD201]

Oh no! The can of worms has been opened!

I'd say about 90% of my listening has been streaming. Hold on....

I'm on the road a lot because of our notorious traffic and so about 80% of that listening happens in the car. Mobile streaming is signal dependent so I'd say the plugged in usb drive beats it every time. It is also in the car that I hunt and seek new music and make playlists.

At home, if entertaining or just doing this or that, background music is likewise mostly streamed from Youtube Music which tops out I believe at 320mbps. It's good enough for bgm. That's the other 6% of the streaming pie. the 4% goes to the main system and typically that is when I hand over the controls to my kids.

Streaming has proved very instructive to my son. He could easily tell the difference between Spotify, Youtube Music, Tidal and Qobuzz. He was rather shocked at how poor Spotify in particular sounded. He is still glued to it because of Spotify's social aspect.

In my experience, yes there are differences in the sound of streamers but sadly we don't often get to have our cake and eat it too. Streaming from the Aurender is more convenient but the best sound I've gotten so far is streaming directly off the CH D1 via Ethernet. Hard to say exactly why. I'm assuming that USB's limitations could be a factor.

Ultimately I don't really sweat it much because I still will play mostly vinyl for that precious last 10% of the listening pie. I still like playing albums from start to finish. Streaming gives me ADHD. Admit it. How many tracks much less albums do you guys cut short while streaming? LOL

My main problem with streaming, here comes the can of worms, is what effect it will have on the production end. Right now we are opening up the cc functions on our tablets when we watch movies on them because there is just so much room for a down mix from mch surround into stereo to keep dialogue intelligible. Music producers and even re-issuers have been busy modeling the sonics for their primary audience. That means today, blue tooth earbuds. How well does that translate to stereo in free space? So far, the genre that has been most immune has been electronic dance music because the tracks are primarily meant to be played on large installations so THAT translates very well. The rest has been a mixed bag. So much so that I normally tend to shun reissues in general unless they have been done by reputable mastering labs. I'll generally just try and hunt down original pressings if available then if not go down the CD or Download route etc, etc. This has been par for the course but the question about NEW music is a big one. I guess we'll just have to live with whatever we can get. Just seems such a shame however that the trend of convenience trumping quality sees no end in sight.

 

[Gregadd]

"Ultimately I don't really sweat it much because I still will play mostly vinyl for that precious last 10% of the listening pie. I still like playing albums from start to finish. Streaming gives me ADHD. Admit it. How many tracks much less albums do you guys cut short while streaming? LOL " {JacKD201}

I listen to a lot of music that I never heard before. I cut it short not because of streaming but because I woud not listen to it any format. I was just patting myself on the back because streaming has brought me back to listening to the entire, cut/album. To be honest I like a lot of one hit wonders.
When listening to vinyl I would at least listen to the entire side. CD was a different matter because they could often contain a lot of tracks.
I am currently toying with the notion that plucking music out of the air across my cellphone may be better than getting it across Wi-Fi. I probably will never know because the equipment at home is vastly superior to the mobile stuff.
Just my opinion. I have no desire to start an argument.

 

[Audire]

Vinyl continues to be our best playback sound, but digital is much closer now.

 

[JackD201]

"Ultimately I don't really sweat it much because I still will play mostly vinyl for that precious last 10% of the listening pie. I still like playing albums from start to finish. Streaming gives me ADHD. Admit it. How many tracks much less albums do you guys cut short while streaming? LOL " {JacKD201}

I listen to a lot of music that I never heard before. I cut it short not because of streaming but because I woud not listen to it any format. I was just patting myself on the back because streaming has brought me back to listening to the entire, cut/album. To be honest I like a lot of one hit wonders.
When listening to vinyl I would at least listen to the entire side. CD was a different matter because they could often contain a lot of tracks.
I am currently toying with the notion that plucking music out of the air across my cellphone may be better than getting it across Wi-Fi. I probably will never know because the equipment at home is vastly superior to the mobile stuff.
Just my opinion. I have no desire to start an argument.

No arguments Greg. The point I was building towards was that for the vast majority of the music listening population, phones and buds are the way in which streamed music is consumed, hopefully enjoyed. That will ultimately impact the way music is produced. Phones over stable wifi are not really that bad. It is when you stray into areas with poor signal and the app drops bitrate down just to keep going that even in a car the sound degrades so much it can be unbearable.

I was kidding around about the ADHD stuff. Sort of anyway. Yes I like a lot of one hit wonders too.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

No arguments Greg. The point I was building towards was that for the vast majority of the music listening population, phones and buds are the way in which streamed music is consumed, hopefully enjoyed. That will ultimately impact the way music is produced. Phones over stable wifi are not really that bad. It is when you stray into areas with poor signal and the app drops bitrate down just to keep going that even in a car the sound degrades so much it can be unbearable.

I was kidding around about the ADHD stuff. Sort of anyway. Yes I like a lot of one hit wonders too.

when i think 'streaming' in the context of WBF and this thread, to me it's listening time to your big rig, smaller rig #2 or #3, or non mobile headphones. my wife has Sonus on for around the house and she shares my Tidal sign on, but for discussion of whether streaming is high end or not, her Sonus, or in car, or ear buds while exercising, is not what we are talking about.

when listening to the same system where your best sources are, which might be CD's or SACD's, or vinyl or tape, does on line music measure up to high end? my position is that it can and does for me. earlier in the thread i got deeper into my views about it, but for Jack's sake just thought i would chime in here with my 2 cents.

 

[JackD201]

I'm still using the original W20 to this day Mike. You guys have zoomed waaaaay past. The CH via ethernet beats the W20 handily. Even files stored on the W20. So yes in that sense I would consider Streaming in this context as at the very least level with files and my silver disc things

It is new music or music remastered for the new reality that worries me.

 

[Gregadd]

No arguments Greg. The point I was building towards was that for the vast majority of the music listening population, phones and buds are the way in which streamed music is consumed, hopefully enjoyed. That will ultimately impact the way music is produced. Phones over stable wifi are not really that bad. It is when you stray into areas with poor signal and the app drops bitrate down just to keep going that even in a car the sound degrades so much it can be unbearable.

I was kidding around about the ADHD stuff. Sort of anyway. Yes I like a lot of one hit wonders too.

I got involved in streaming because so many were listening to music over their smartphone. Without being condescending reception is probably better in the US. I currently use a mobile DAC/Amp the size of a matchbox. There is currently a boom of options available. Many use their smartphone as a stream medium for their home system. So do I. It's been a journey for me to get audiophile quality sound over my smartphone and through Wi-Fi. I think I have achieved it aa reasonable price. The good news is I could do even better if I were willing to spend more money.

 

[Gregadd]

Yeah, I too worry that streaming will go the route of FM radio. Without FM radio I would never have become an audiophile. Or at least done so at a much later date.

 

[JackD201]

I got involved in streaming because so many were listening to music over their smartphone. Without being condescending reception is probably better in the US. I currently use a mobile DAC/Amp the size of a matchbox. There is currently a boom of options available. Many use their smartphone as a stream medium for their home system. So do I. It's been a journey for me to get audiophile quality sound over my smartphone and through Wi-Fi. I think I have achieved it aa reasonable price. The good news is I could do even better if I were willing to spend more money.

No offense taken

 

[Solartiger]

In every scenario that I have experienced, local files sound better than files streamed via internet. You can go the easy route like me (download music to a local digital player) or try to optimise your infrastructure to stream via internet. Plenty of threads here that explain both paths.

 

[Amir]

as you know I do not like Streaming Sound Quality but What I like about Streaming is the Roon Radio , I love Radio because I do not know what will play in the next song.

 

[christoph]

Vinyl continues to be our best playback sound, but digital is much closer now.

Wait till you hear the Horizon

 

[PYP]

as you know I do not like Streaming Sound Quality but What I like about Streaming is the Roon Radio , I love Radio because I do not know what will play in the next song.

have added more than 1,000 albums (links to albums) using Roon Radio. If a song is interesting, it goes into a "Listen" playlist. Later, I listen to the entire album to determine if it goes into the library. It has given me a new appreciation for how much music is being created worldwide.

 

[Gregadd]

It's good you listen to the whole album. That is how you discover "deep cuts." One thing i do is get a bottle of wine. Find a live recording and pretend I am at a concert.
Enjoy the music.

 

[christoph]

have added more than 1,000 albums (links to albums) using Roon Radio. If a song is interesting, it goes into a "Listen" playlist. Later, I listen to the entire album to determine if it goes into the library. It has given me a new appreciation for how much music is being created worldwide.

Good strategy

 

[PYP]

Good strategy

Thank you. Considering how much reading and research some folks do to build their libraries (and, if digital, tagging and the like), this is the lazy way. But serendipity is fun.

 

[oldmustang]

Thank you. Considering how much reading and research some folks do to build their libraries (and, if digital, tagging and the like), this is the lazy way. But serendipity is fun.

Lazy is good. As important as music is to me -- and it is very, very important -- I do still have a life and other responsibilities I have to devote time to.

At least, my wife tells me this is so.

Steve Z

 

[PYP]

Lazy is good. As important as music is to me -- and it is very, very important -- I do still have a life and other responsibilities I have to devote time to.

At least, my wife tells me this is so.

Steve Z

she knows where to find you if she needs you.

 

[Powerman]

have added more than 1,000 albums (links to albums) using Roon Radio. If a song is interesting, it goes into a "Listen" playlist. Later, I listen to the entire album to determine if it goes into the library. It has given me a new appreciation for how much music is being created worldwide.

But that's what I don't like... If I use a client, it goes into that service, and not the streaming service. I stream away from home as well and it is irritating to have to go into the streaming service to save something I found listening to music at home. They all do it so it is what it is... I only stream so clearly I can get over it. I do purchase music, but only stuff I have to have on my drive.

My friend loaned me his turntable. I haven't spun records since high school. And I wore a few out... Ummm... Ya, certainly over that. He even had some 78 pressings... So even more work to listen to a couple songs. It does sound different, not really better. Hi res digital is really that good now. At least to me.