Linn Sondek 50th anniversary, really that good?
- Thread starter Uwiik
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I am an LP12 fan and have owned at least one for nearly 40 years. I presently have two in my TT collection, one of which I’ve kept upgraded to top level until my recent decision to stick with the original Radikal. I may still do that upgrade, but I haven’t yet. What other audiophile company still provides support for their initial product after 50 years?
The biggest argument against going out and buying any high end turntable new today is the precipitously steep depreciation. At the 40th anniversary some people bought the commemorative model with the hope that it would inflate in value, but there’s no evidence (outside of a few persuasive Linn dealers) that this has happened. If you buy any high end product new, pride of owning a new one has to be a major part of accepting the depreciation.
Is the 50th Anniversary model worth the sizable cost increase compared to Linn’s otherwise best? Who can tell? In my opinion, only the customer who is going to lay out the cash. It is a leap of faith to order without listening. But I’ll bet most who ordered will be very pleased. It is a true bucket list item.
As for ALL LP12s, as you point out, the footprint is delightfully unassuming. You have to dedicate a lot of space if you want to run one of the latest and greatest chrome wedding cakes, tire balancers, or other modern models. And compared to the current 6 figure reviewer favorites, the Linn looks like an incredible value.
In every legitimate TT “bake off” I’ve heard, Linn are legitimate competitors and much of what comes off as negative is really underlying lack of enthusiasm for the Linnies. On a sonic level, there is so much that is affected by cartridge and setup, broad brush assertions about one high end TT vs another can’t be generalized.
The biggest argument against going out and buying any high end turntable new today is the precipitously steep depreciation. At the 40th anniversary some people bought the commemorative model with the hope that it would inflate in value, but there’s no evidence (outside of a few persuasive Linn dealers) that this has happened. If you buy any high end product new, pride of owning a new one has to be a major part of accepting the depreciation.
Is the 50th Anniversary model worth the sizable cost increase compared to Linn’s otherwise best? Who can tell? In my opinion, only the customer who is going to lay out the cash. It is a leap of faith to order without listening. But I’ll bet most who ordered will be very pleased. It is a true bucket list item.
As for ALL LP12s, as you point out, the footprint is delightfully unassuming. You have to dedicate a lot of space if you want to run one of the latest and greatest chrome wedding cakes, tire balancers, or other modern models. And compared to the current 6 figure reviewer favorites, the Linn looks like an incredible value.
In every legitimate TT “bake off” I’ve heard, Linn are legitimate competitors and much of what comes off as negative is really underlying lack of enthusiasm for the Linnies. On a sonic level, there is so much that is affected by cartridge and setup, broad brush assertions about one high end TT vs another can’t be generalized.
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FWIW, the LP12-50 is limited to 250 units. It is priced at £50k. $60k in USD.
Peter Swain (Cymbiosis in Leicestershire) installed one for one of his Cayman Island customers, and reports that the customer is absolutely delighted.
I’m not surprised. I’ve seen posts where different forum members are indignant about the idea that they’re not personally the best set up guru in the world. Indeed, I had this attitude myself at one time. I’ve grown to understand and hold in high regard the skills of Peter, Tom O’Keefe, and a small handful of others worldwide when it comes to the LP12.
Peter Swain (Cymbiosis in Leicestershire) installed one for one of his Cayman Island customers, and reports that the customer is absolutely delighted.
I’m not surprised. I’ve seen posts where different forum members are indignant about the idea that they’re not personally the best set up guru in the world. Indeed, I had this attitude myself at one time. I’ve grown to understand and hold in high regard the skills of Peter, Tom O’Keefe, and a small handful of others worldwide when it comes to the LP12.
Sorry , a new thorens td 1601 or roksan xerxes 20 plus beats in every area. If you want have a subchassis turntable I would listen to it.
I’d love to hear a side-by-side comparison of this modern LP-12 with a couple of other modern turntables in this price range. I suspect they’d all be excellent but different.
What number of the 250 limited edition did you audition? And who set it up for you?
Thorens make great turntables, as do many others. It is always good advice to compare with your own ears and buy what pleases you most.
But seriously, you assert that two other turntables thrash the LP12-50 in every area. How do you back this up?
Because the basic principle hasn't changed in 50 years. The LP 12 is basically like td 160 Thorens. Tuning parts were offered such as motor control, other bearings, different sub-chassis. But actually it's still at the same level as the 1980s. For comparison, Thorens recreated everything new on the model 1601, because at some point you're done with an old base. Linn missed the train.
Even back then, I found the Xerxes to have more precision and depth in the bass and more resolution in the highs. I think the Linn is very good in the midrange but the rest is limited. That's my opinion, Linn fans will stone me now.. I said jehovah(life of brian)
.P.S best sound lp 12 on ikea axamo table or time table my opion
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By your reckoning the Porsche 911 shouldn't exist either. In its current iteration its still among the very best sports cars made. Comparing today's Sondek to any built in the '80s, shows your willful ignorance re LP12s than anyting else. To your point, one could say the very same thing re the TD124!
Interestingly when introduced the LP12 trounced all in its path all the TD124,125, 301,401 , et al , yet here we are still trashing about.
Aside 40-50K for an LP12 is ludicrous at best , sad ..
Regards
Aside 40-50K for an LP12 is ludicrous at best , sad ..
Regards
But the comparison is very flawed, at Porsche everything has changed in fifty years, dimensions, chassis, track width from air cooling to water cooling. The only thing that has remained with the 911 is the engine located behind the rear axle. The frame of the Linn is the same, the suspension etc. Compare the first 911 with the 991/992 model series, it's like night and day. Everyone can have different listening tastes. For me, LP 12 isn't special, and it's certainly not worth the money that you have to pay for it today
P.S I forgot the ignition lock is still on the left side... porsche
You would have to compare modern with a special vintage , say a 72 or 73 RS and just like comparing modern hifi the driving and listening experience brings a vintage smile ..!
Regards
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I haven't said a single word that this isn't fun. I just said that I don't like a Linn LP 12. I like driving old cars, the sound is fantastic, pure emotion. And i love good vintage hifi like this the modern stuff can't do any better.
I beg to differ … Distinctly average in comparison and nothing has changed …IMHO Obviously
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The Hashimoto wide bandwidth OPT’s sported by the AU-111 remain truely exceptional even today.I haven't said a single word that this isn't fun. I just said that I don't like a Linn LP 12. I like driving old cars, the sound is fantastic, pure emotion. And i love good vintage hifi like this the modern stuff can't do any better.
I listened to a LP12 Klimax and was astonished, hence my interest in LP12-50 and I understand how it is priced. I used to like the Kuzma due to its heft and brass color (audio aesthetic is important for me) but as I grow older my tastes changes too, now I like the simplicity, unassuming and legendary shape of the LP12. I also like the fact that it has a proper lid, sometimes when I am too lazy I can just leave my TT untouched for months and just focus on my Taiko, I treat my TT like a finely aged Cuban Cigar, I don’t smoke but when I do I want to make sure I do it in the most elegant and fine way where I enjoy it to the max with no stress nor disruption whatsoever for hours, proper lid is very important on this case. Last but not least, I just love the fact that LP12 is backed up by so many optional genuine/aftermarket parts so the tinkering possibilities are endless.
Let me rephrase my question then, will it be at least sound better than my current Kuzma XL-DC?
Let me rephrase my question then, will it be at least sound better than my current Kuzma XL-DC?
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I absolutely love my LP12/DC Motor & Power Supply/Naim Aro Tone Arm/Benz Ruby Zebrawood MC Cartridge. To my ears, it produces an immensely musical reproduction of my precious original vinyl jazz and classical lp's from the late 50's/60's. The fact that it still gives me goosebumps and can still take my breath away with such strong and powerful emotions from listening to the music being performed.... to me, that means it must be doing something right. I'm not saying that it is the greatest turntable out there (as we are very blessed that there are a great number of wonderful tables to choose from nowadays).... but, the simple fact that it still puts the biggest smile on my face every time I listen to it, well that is what's most important to me
Best wishes to all for a very Happy and Healthy New Year!
Don
Best wishes to all for a very Happy and Healthy New Year!
Don
Thank you very much for the encouraging words. There must be a reason Linn Sondek is the most popular in my country and I think I cannot go wrong with LP12-50….some might think it’s ridiculously priced (especially on our neighbor’s forum) but I don’t think so at all, so I would be fine and happy if it at least better my Kuzma XL DC which is not an easy feat.I absolutely love my LP12/DC Motor & Power Supply/Naim Aro Tone Arm/Benz Ruby Zebrawood MC Cartridge. To my ears, it produces an immensely musical reproduction of my precious original vinyl jazz and classical lp's from the late 50's/60's. The fact that it still gives me goosebumps and can still take my breath away with such strong and powerful emotions from listening to the music being performed.... to me, that means it must be doing something right. I'm not saying that it is the greatest turntable out there (as we are very blessed that there are a great number of wonderful tables to choose from nowadays).... but, the simple fact that it still puts the biggest smile on my face every time I listen to it, well that is what's most important to me
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Best wishes to all for a very Happy and Healthy New Year!
Don
Thought so. You are not aware of the fact that an LP12 from back in the day shares NO parts with the current models. Not even the plinth design, top plate, or the fixings are the same. It could literally be LP12 Mk XX if a naming algorithm like Burmester uses were used. There have been multiple iterations on every major component, from bearing, to subchassis, to motor and controller, to arm, ad nauseam.Because the basic principle hasn't changed in 50 years. The LP 12 is basically like td 160 Thorens. Tuning parts were offered such as motor control, other bearings, different sub-chassis. But actually it's still at the same level as the 1980s. For comparison, Thorens recreated everything new on the model 1601, because at some point you're done with an old base. Linn missed the train.
Even back then, I found the Xerxes to have more precision and depth in the bass and more resolution in the highs. I think the Linn is very good in the midrange but the rest is limited. That's my opinion, Linn fans will stone me now.. I said jehovah(life of brian)
P.S best sound lp 12 on ikea axamo table or time table my opion
The basic principles for good turntable design do not change. Linn and Thorens both understand them. The goal is to extract as much information as possible out of the grooves while not adding noise components that obfuscate.
Your post should have been “I don’t know anything about the LP12-50, but I did not like Linn when I listened to an LP12 in the ‘70s. If it were me, I’d listen to X, Y, and Z which I prefer.” No argument there. Your ears, your system. But to announce that certain other models are superior in every way to a current top model that you have never heard, is simply arrogant Linn bashing.
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