Lampi GG 512dsd + 44k + 48k superclocks + RTR PCM + KR242 + grounding post + SGM server----

Legolas

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Astro.

DSD on the Big7 is ONLY by USB. DSD and PCM engines are separate. PCM is R2R and DSD is "chipless" discrete decoder.

Perhaps the Golden Atlantic may be better suited to you (if you are not bothered about tube rolling)?
Not sure what SPDIF max is. I have only ever used it with spinners, but I guess with a USB/SPdif converter (off Ramp, etc) it could take HiRez PCM too.

Thanks wisnon. So next question would be I guess, how far behind is PCM on the current discrete board in the Big 7 to up sampled PCM - DSD using the USB input. My system is using SPDIF out from a Rednet AOIP and ethernet out from my server. I got a nice improvement dropping USB so not wanting to go back to that really.
 

wisnon

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Thanks wisnon. So next question would be I guess, how far behind is PCM on the current discrete board in the Big 7 to up sampled PCM - DSD using the USB input. My system is using SPDIF out from a Rednet AOIP and ethernet out from my server. I got a nice improvement dropping USB so not wanting to go back to that really.

USB goes up a notch with Superclocks.
I find the usb PCM to be great and it has cut the gap to DSD. I have not tried spdif since my recent upgrade to sueprclocks and dsd512.
PCM is discrete R2R ladders and has latest firmware.

I mostly play native rate, but am working on an up sampling PC solution for 512.
 

RubenV.

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Feb 23, 2015
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I tried SPDIF with a PPA DDC in the chain. The maximum high rez I could play over SPDIF was 24 bit 192khz.
 

wisnon

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I tried SPDIF with a PPA DDC in the chain. The maximum high rez I could play over SPDIF was 24 bit 192khz.

That sounds about right...DXD needs USB, too.

Speaking with a buddy last night...upsampling RBCD to DSD512 seems to be magic (he doesnt care for even 256 upsampling). Ironically, he preferred JRiver upsampling to HQ P, but he didnt have a chance to play with all the filter setings in HQ P, so that could be where HQP has its "revenge" later.
 

dminches

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USB goes up a notch with Superclocks.
I find the usb PCM to be great and it has cut the gap to DSD. I have not tried spdif since my recent upgrade to sueprclocks and dsd512.
PCM is discrete R2R ladders and has latest firmware.

I mostly play native rate, but am working on an up sampling PC solution for 512.

Does this mean you do not upsample anything, even PCM?

Right now I am upsampling PCM to 384 but not to DSD. And I upsample DSD to 2XDSD only due to the Amanero driver issue. I really don't plan on ever upsampling PCM to DSD.
 

dminches

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USB goes up a notch with Superclocks.
I find the usb PCM to be great and it has cut the gap to DSD. I have not tried spdif since my recent upgrade to sueprclocks and dsd512.
PCM is discrete R2R ladders and has latest firmware.

I mostly play native rate, but am working on an up sampling PC solution for 512.

Does this mean you do not upsample anything, even PCM?

Right now I am upsampling PCM to 384 but not to DSD. And I upsample DSD to 2XDSD only due to the Amanero driver issue. I really don't plan on ever upsampling PCM to DSD.
 

wisnon

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Does this mean you do not upsample anything, even PCM?

Right now I am upsampling PCM to 384 but not to DSD. And I upsample DSD to 2XDSD only due to the Amanero driver issue. I really don't plan on ever upsampling PCM to DSD.

I would only upsample PCM to DXD or DSD512. I am a Mac guy who is working on a PC now. Normally I use native rate playback.
 

Legolas

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I would only upsample PCM to DXD or DSD512. I am a Mac guy who is working on a PC now. Normally I use native rate playback.

Few things. I think max on a Mac is DSD256 at the moment.

I don't upsample yet, as my DAC is old school Redbook NOS.

I wonder if the magic in the GG with DSD is the fact if misses any kind of digital processing or filtering? My DAC has no filter anyway, so maybe no point for me. I can only go to 24/96 with it's AD1865 chip.

I can play MQA inside Audirvana to 24/96, and sent it via AOIP (Rednet) to SPDIF or AES to my DAC. I have not tried it yet, as Audirvana V3 is not out yet, but in a fews weeks hopeful twill be.
 

dminches

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I am completely satisfied with the PCM sound from the Big 7. I have some DSD material it that sounds great too, but I don't feel the need to upsample everything to DSD now.
 

bonzo75

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I am completely satisfied with the PCM sound from the Big 7. I have some DSD material it that sounds great too, but I don't feel the need to upsample everything to DSD now.

Same here. I find this upsampling sounds good, some not, some is better native. People should buy the dac for its organic nature which will be audible with PCM. Fyi, all my Lampi shootouts are PCM.
 

wisnon

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Few things. I think max on a Mac is DSD256 at the moment.

I don't upsample yet, as my DAC is old school Redbook NOS.

I wonder if the magic in the GG with DSD is the fact if misses any kind of digital processing or filtering? My DAC has no filter anyway, so maybe no point for me. I can only go to 24/96 with it's AD1865 chip.

I can play MQA inside Audirvana to 24/96, and sent it via AOIP (Rednet) to SPDIF or AES to my DAC. I have not tried it yet, as Audirvana V3 is not out yet, but in a fews weeks hopeful twill be.
Hi AS. Recall the Lampi is 2 Dacs in one box and indeed, my GG even has 3 converters. PCM via R2R ladder. DSD256 attached to the ladder and separate DSD512 engine.

I am working on a PC with a pal that should play 512 via JRiver and HQP (without Roon).
Lampi DSD is a just an elaborate filter box and is ONLY via USB (super clocked in my case). DSD cannot be filterless and is fundamentally different to PCM. PCM logic does not apply.

I had a L4 Lampi in the past that I requested to be built with that chip and there was a soldertrick to enable 24/192 playback...but skill was needed not to muck it up.
 

dminches

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Hi AS. Recall the Lampi is 2 Dacs in one box and indeed, my GG even has 3 converters. PCM via R2R ladder. DSD256 attached to the ladder and separate DSD512 engine.

I am working on a PC with a pal that should play 512 via JRiver and HQP (without Roon).
Lampi DSD is a just an elaborate filter box and is ONLY via USB (super clocked in my case). DSD cannot be filterless and is fundamentally different to PCM. PCM logic does not apply.

I had a L4 Lampi in the past that I requested to be built with that chip and there was a soldertrick to enable 24/192 playback...but skill was needed not to muck it up.

Not to get too far off track but are you using jriver as just a GUI front end, dragging and dropping to HQP?
 

wisnon

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Not to get too far off track but are you using jriver as just a GUI front end, dragging and dropping to HQP?

Using JRiver and HQP independently. When I get the PC server, it will be AO and in minimal server mode I can choose either JRiver shell or HQP shell and play back in ASIO at upsample dsd512.

I could also do what you say in Mac, but Mac can't upsample beyond 128 on my Lampi. DoP only.
 

wisnon

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Same here. I find this upsampling sounds good, some not, some is better native. People should buy the dac for its organic nature which will be audible with PCM. Fyi, all my Lampi shootouts are PCM.
This is what I expect to find too...but now its experimentation time.
 

Legolas

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Using JRiver and HQP independently. When I get the PC server, it will be AO and in minimal server mode I can choose either JRiver shell or HQP shell and play back in ASIO at upsample dsd512.

I could also do what you say in Mac, but Mac can't upsample beyond 128 on my Lampi. DoP only.

I thought / was told on a Mac you can do DSD 256. I can select it is Audirvana on my Mac Mini 2015 model running 10.9.5

On upsampling, I am curious to try on a GG. I can't do that on my old school Audio Note, but no need it that case. I wonder if the DSD on the GG being a FPGA is a different approach, avoiding any pitfalls of Delta-Sigma upsampling and filtering. i.e. it is not just the upsampling, but also the excellent design of the DSD engine on the Lampi? I have read owners of the Nagra say a similar thing.
 

wisnon

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I thought / was told on a Mac you can do DSD 256. I can select it is Audirvana on my Mac Mini 2015 model running 10.9.5

On upsampling, I am curious to try on a GG. I can't do that on my old school Audio Note, but no need it that case. I wonder if the DSD on the GG being a FPGA is a different approach, avoiding any pitfalls of Delta-Sigma upsampling and filtering. i.e. it is not just the upsampling, but also the excellent design of the DSD engine on the Lampi? I have read owners of the Nagra say a similar thing.
My understanding is that you need a 50% overhead for DoP. So, as the Lampi does usb 384khz, only DSD128 is allowed on Mac. However, the separate DSD module can accept DSD512, so you may indeed be right. The limitation is via the Dac USB in DoP, not Core Audio.

Lampi DSD is NOT fpga. its an elaborate filter box that does not process the Stream in any other way than to extract the carrier wave from the music. lampi only plays back natively what is fed. It cannot upsample or contort the signal in any way. Pure bitstream playback. HQP or Jriver will do the heavy lifting and feed the Lampi at a given rate and it will simply play it back with high fidelity.
 

Legolas

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Dec 27, 2015
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My understanding is that you need a 50% overhead for DoP. So, as the Lampi does usb 384khz, only DSD128 is allowed on Mac. However, the separate DSD module can accept DSD512, so you may indeed be right. The limitation is via the Dac USB in DoP, not Core Audio.

Lampi DSD is NOT fpga. its an elaborate filter box that does not process the Stream in any other way than to extract the carrier wave from the music. lampi only plays back natively what is fed. It cannot upsample or contort the signal in any way. Pure bitstream playback. HQP or Jriver will do the heavy lifting and feed the Lampi at a given rate and it will simply play it back with high fidelity.

Interesting. So does both PCM and DSD on the Lampi have no digital filtering?
 

wisnon

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Interesting. So does both PCM and DSD on the Lampi have no digital filtering?

Dunno about PCM, but for sure DSD does. it MUST, as ultrasonic energy is too high and would fry tweets.

from his website: THE LAMPIZATOR DSD DAC HAS USB PORT BUILT IN, SOLID STATE DIGITAL FILTER, PASSIVE DISCRETE ANALOG FILTER AND ACTIVE DISCRETE TUBE FILTER. IT DOES NOT MANIPULATE THE DATA IN ANY SHAPE OR FORM, IT DOES NOT CONVERT IT, UPSAMPLE, RECLOCK OR DOWNSAMPLE. IT DOES NOT GO THROUGH PCM PROCESS EITHER. IT IS PUREST NATIVE DSD WE KNOW OF. WE PRACTICALLY ONLY GENTLY REMOVE THE CARRIER FREQUENCY FROM THE RAW DATA AS IT COMES FROM HARD DRIVE. NOTHING MORE NOTHING LESS.
http://lampizator.eu/Fikus/DSD_DAC.html

Look out for a PM on another matter.
 

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