Is there a subwoofer amp with room correction?

clayton72

New Member
May 25, 2011
38
0
0
Bothell, WA
#21
Don't suppose there's any free software that can use the built in laptop mics or a reasonably inexpensive mic while sending a 5.1 digital stream to evaluate and tune?
 

DonH50

Member Sponsor & WBF Technical Expert
Jun 23, 2010
3,526
3
38
Monument, CO
#22
I don't think so, though I have not played with REW or the other freebies much, nor Audyssey enough to know. My more-expensive (though still fairly cheap) SW doesn't, either -- I drive one or a pair at a time, as does MCACC. Tuning multiple sources all going at once is a formidable challenge...
 

Mark Seaton

WBF Technical Expert (Speaker & Acoustics)
May 21, 2010
319
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Chicago, IL
www.seatonsound.net
#23
I have a ServoDrive Contrabass and I'm driving it with an Outlaw 200watt mono amp. I'm wondering if there's an amp available with room correction built in? Or should I just get an Integra 80.2 (or 3 when those come out) and let that handle the correction? I'm also using an old M&K 12 inch for fill in as the big gun can't be bothered to reproduce low volume sounds.

Sidenote: The Contrabass isn't in a finished cabinet. Oscar is written on it in pencil, so that's what we call "him". Is that something that would have been written by the manufacturer?
Hi clayton72,

Unless someone had ordered the ContraBass unfinished with the intent of custom veneer (not all that many were sold this way), I would guess that your ContraBass is a kit that was sold for a few years (before I put my time in there). I'm guessing it's builder named it Oscar during the build process. ;)

The Dayton SA-1000 amp + an external box for response correction (auto or manual) would be my suggestion. The switchable high pass in the SA-1000 is a little higher in frequency than preferred, but can be bypassed with a switch on the back. The MiniDSP would be a great option if you are willing to play with Room EQ Wizard and an external preamp+microphone, or if you pick up the Dayton OmniMic system. As many have mentioned, there are plenty of automated systems like the Antimode, the BassQ and the Audyssey solutions sold by SVS. If you want to do the directing with the least amount of measurement tinkering, the SMS-1 will get you a long way there, and has an integrated high pass filter which would be useful to protect from over-excursion from content below ~15Hz.
 

clayton72

New Member
May 25, 2011
38
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0
Bothell, WA
#24
Thank you all! The SMS-1 looks pretty good. I find my ear is too adaptable rather than descirning, so automagical is the best way for me to go. :)
 

Nyal Mellor

Industry Expert
Jul 14, 2010
591
0
0
SF Bay Area, CA, USA
#25
True but that is a big conditional. Not many qualify.
Very true. I don't think there is anything stopping someone designing an automated system that really works.

For a sub only usage maybe the new Audyssey stuff is ok. I am not a fan of how it corrects above 200Hz and cannot be turned off above that frequency. Unless they've changed the way their products work I think that is still the case?
 

Nyal Mellor

Industry Expert
Jul 14, 2010
591
0
0
SF Bay Area, CA, USA
#26
Don't suppose there's any free software that can use the built in laptop mics or a reasonably inexpensive mic while sending a 5.1 digital stream to evaluate and tune?
I don't know of any that can send a digitally encoded 5.1 stream except those professional units that cost over $1500!
 

Nyal Mellor

Industry Expert
Jul 14, 2010
591
0
0
SF Bay Area, CA, USA
#27
The issue I have with PEQ is that I have yet to hear a PEQ solution that can deal with bass ringing as well as a reasonably well done time based solution. And even the time based solutions are not all created equal.

I have (at least I will when it gets returned from repair) an Integra 80.2 with the latest Audyssey capabilities and a TacT 2.2XP. While I can get the corrected response curves of the two technologies really close (measured via and external measurement system like XTZ or OmniMIc), I can assure you the bass ringing is far more improved with the 80.2 than with the TacT. That was not the case with the previous version of Audyssey but this version has far greater granularity in the filters for the bass/midbass portion of the audio spectrum. Once I get my 80.2 returned (I have no clue when that might be) I can post the measured results of bass ringing from XTZ. But I don't have to measure it to hear it -- nor have other experienced listeners. And in my experience, PEQ would be a distant third. As an aside, my room is very well trapped -- all four corners and the soffits.

I don't claim to be a PEQ expert but in my experience, I have much more confidence in some of the more reasonably well done time-based correction technologies.
I have some graphs from a recent calibration job that will be posted up in a blog post on my website at somepoint. We used a band of parametric EQ to deal with a room mode resonance at 25Hz, a frequency which is very difficult to treat with passive means. What was interesting is that small changes to the Q of the filter either meant you killed the ringing or really didn't deal with it at all. The theory says that if a resonance is minimum phase then if you correct the frequency response deviation you correct the phase as well. As long as the frequency response deviation is minimum phase then EQ can work a treat. It's when frequency response deviations are non-minimum phase that EQ is not the right thing to do. Unfortunately most auto EQ solutions are not sophisticated enough to determine which can be EQd and which can't. This is a good article from the Room EQ dude which is worth reading a few times - very insightful stuff - http://www.hometheatershack.com/roomeq/wizardhelpv5/help_en-GB/html/minimumphase.html
 

Mark Seaton

WBF Technical Expert (Speaker & Acoustics)
May 21, 2010
319
2
18
42
Chicago, IL
www.seatonsound.net
#28
Thank you all! The SMS-1 looks pretty good. I find my ear is too adaptable rather than descirning, so automagical is the best way for me to go. :)
Hi Clayton,

The one crutch of the SMS-1 is that the "auto" function is rather weak. You will get much better results by placing the microphone for measurements and use the remote control to slide the filters around in frequency and use fewer filters, vs. the evenly spaced (1/3rd octave centers) method the automatic mode uses.
 

Mark Seaton

WBF Technical Expert (Speaker & Acoustics)
May 21, 2010
319
2
18
42
Chicago, IL
www.seatonsound.net
#29
Don't suppose there's any free software that can use the built in laptop mics or a reasonably inexpensive mic while sending a 5.1 digital stream to evaluate and tune?
I don't know of any that can send a digitally encoded 5.1 stream except those professional units that cost over $1500!
I didn't note his mention of 5.1 digital stream...

Fortunately analog inputs will still allow independent and combined measurements of the left, center, right, and subwoofer, which is by far the most important, and directly connecting to amplifier or EQ inputs allow work with the rear channels.
 

Nyal Mellor

Industry Expert
Jul 14, 2010
591
0
0
SF Bay Area, CA, USA
#30
I didn't note his mention of 5.1 digital stream...

Fortunately analog inputs will still allow independent and combined measurements of the left, center, right, and subwoofer, which is by far the most important, and directly connecting to amplifier or EQ inputs allow work with the rear channels.
Hey Mark, I agree with you - I measure LCR and Sub playing together and separately as part of the calibration.
 

mirekti

New Member
Feb 4, 2015
26
0
0
Dallas, TX
#31
Almost six years later, the question comes back.

What are current subwoofers which come with room correction? Google search mostly points to the threads of age like this one.
 

sleepysurf

New Member
Sep 8, 2010
24
0
1
#32
Almost six years later, the question comes back.

What are current subwoofers which come with room correction? Google search mostly points to the threads of age like this one.
The MartinLogan BalancedForce 210 and 212 offer optional DSP Room Correction with the Perfect Bass Kit (but software is Windows only). You can also download sub crossover filters custom matched to various ML main speakers.
 
May 27, 2013
402
0
16
Chicago suburbs
#34
The MartinLogan BalancedForce 210 and 212 offer optional DSP Room Correction with the Perfect Bass Kit (but software is Windows only). You can also download sub crossover filters custom matched to various ML main speakers.
I run the Martin Logan BalancedForce 210 sub and their Perfect Bass Kit with either Magnepan 3.7i or Wilson Benesch Vertex speakers and find its performance and flexibility exceptional. With the optional PBK it accounts for room effects in the bass range quite effectively, and a Windows PC is only needed to run the initial setup with the provided calibrated microphone positioned in several locations. The software allows you to see the measured in-room bass response before and after the DSP correction is applied. :cool:
 

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