HDMI cables (Transparent Audio)

[amirm]

I will not take your bet as you sound fairly definitive. However, if Jfrech sees a difference and there is no difference in measurements, what would you conclude?

I am more than fairly definitive .

Video is very different than audio. We can freeze a moment in time and watch it for hours and examine every pixel. We can measure all of them. We can capture them and perform binary comparisons. I am 100% confident that in person I can demonstrate there is no picture quality difference in any HDMI cable that produces the image without pixels loss (which are quite obvious artifacts). In other words, we can match objective data with subjective with video.

I can put up a "pluge" pattern that is just one video level above black. We then switch cables. And I assure you that it will remain just one level above black. We can measure this and see it with our own eyes.

I went to transparent web site and was quite surprised that they make these video claims. I had not seen that from other manufacturers. But look at the features below and it says absolutely nothing as to what improves video. Again for sound there will be lots of claims but for video, they have the same standard stuff everyone else has for their HDMI cables.

There is just no room for picture quality improvements in the HDMI cable. Audio, there could be but not video.

 

[PeterA]

I am more than fairly definitive .

Video is very different than audio. We can freeze a moment in time and watch it for hours and examine every pixel. We can measure all of them. We can capture them and perform binary comparisons. I am 100% confident that in person I can demonstrate there is no picture quality difference in any HDMI cable that produces the image without pixels loss (which are quite obvious artifacts). In other words, we can match objective data with subjective with video.

I can put up a "pluge" pattern that is just one video level above black. We then switch cables. And I assure you that it will remain just one level above black. We can measure this and see it with our own eyes.

I went to transparent web site and was quite surprised that they make these video claims. I had not seen that from other manufacturers. But look at the features below and it says absolutely nothing as to what improves video. Again for sound there will be lots of claims but for video, they have the same standard stuff everyone else has for their HDMI cables.

There is just no room for picture quality improvements in the HDMI cable. Audio, there could be but not video.

Would this also go for a TV power cord change?

 

[amirm]

Would this also go for a TV power cord change?

Different animal but yes, I have the same confidence that it will not change the picture.

 

[FrantzM]

Hi

I was about to post similar things than Amirm... JFrech, does your TV has 2 inputs? Could you just use two vastly different HDMI, say a Monorprice for like <$20 and the Transparent and look carefully at two still pictures. If the inputs are calibrated the same you shall see the same. Easy test to perform.
In Audio you cannpot freeze anythin and analyze the differences ... in video , you can.

 

[jfrech]

Hi

I was about to post similar things than Amirm... JFrech, does your TV has 2 inputs? Could you just use two vastly different HDMI, say a Monorprice for like <$20 and the Transparent and look carefully at two still pictures. If the inputs are calibrated the same you shall see the same. Easy test to perform.
In Audio you cannpot freeze anythin and analyze the differences ... in video , you can.

My TV does have multiple inputs...my Direct TV receiver only has one output. But guys...we don't need to do this comparison...it's pretty easy to see this. The best analogy is cleaning your windows. The outside image is still the same...but boy does it look better after the window is washed.

 

[FrantzM]

My TV does have multiple inputs...my Direct TV receiver only has one output. But guys...we don't need to do this comparison...it's pretty easy to see this. The best analogy is cleaning your windows. The outside image is still the same...but boy does it look better after the window is washed.

Do yourself a favor and just try it.

 

[amirm]

My TV does have multiple inputs...my Direct TV receiver only has one output. But guys...we don't need to do this comparison...it's pretty easy to see this. The best analogy is cleaning your windows. The outside image is still the same...but boy does it look better after the window is washed.

Do a quick test. Have your wife come in three times and tell you which cable is which. Each time switch cables around (or do nothing) and see if she gets it right all three times.

 

[jfrech]

Do a quick test. Have your wife come in three times and tell you which cable is which. Each time switch cables around (or do nothing) and see if she gets it right all three times.

We're happy. We like the new HDMI cables-watched a movie last night. No more proof needed for my wife and I....it's not subtle to us...it's simply a better image...more 3D like is the biggest thing I notice along with the clarity. Anyone is more than welcome to stop by my home

 

[FrantzM]

We're happy. We like the new HDMI cables-watched a movie last night. No more proof needed for my wife and I....it's not subtle to us...it's simply a better image...more 3D like is the biggest thing I notice along with the clarity. Anyone is more than welcome to stop by my home

 

[Sharp 1080]

I have used three different HDMI cables in my system and they all looked the same on freeze frame. I did the same type of test when I compared black levels on the HDMI cable directly against component RGB into my old projector. The black levels were better with HDMI. White levels at peaks were about equal. The same test with two different HDMI cables yielded no difference in picture quality or black level improvement. The thing with HDMI is it either works or won't work which leaves your screen with the "sparkles" when inoperative. It's funny how some of the audio companies that don't really understand video try and carryover the terminology associated with audio into video.

 

[BlueFox]

Generally, I would agree with the HDMI is HDMI statement. However, I tried it myself, and since I saw it with my own eyes, I can not honestly subscribe to the 'HDMI is all the same' now.

I have done it twice, and both tests were the same. I replaced the stock Oppo HDMI with first an MIT HDMI, and then a Shunyata Venom HDMI. While I cannot say the picture was 'better' with any of these cables, I can say that with the MIT and Shunyata the picture is sharper, more detailed, and with brighter colors. This was an easy to see test, especially with Avatar, which is a color and detail paradise.

In so far as those who think a power cord cannot change the color on either the monitor, or from a Blueray player, I can only say I have tried that, and it did make a difference. I have found with cables it is better to have experience before speaking, rather than making statements based on theory, but no experience.

 

[microstrip]

I am more than fairly definitive .

Video is very different than audio. We can freeze a moment in time and watch it for hours and examine every pixel. We can measure all of them. We can capture them and perform binary comparisons. I am 100% confident that in person I can demonstrate there is no picture quality difference in any HDMI cable that produces the image without pixels loss (which are quite obvious artifacts). In other words, we can match objective data with subjective with video.

I can put up a "pluge" pattern that is just one video level above black. We then switch cables. And I assure you that it will remain just one level above black. We can measure this and see it with our own eyes.

I went to transparent web site and was quite surprised that they make these video claims. I had not seen that from other manufacturers. But look at the features below and it says absolutely nothing as to what improves video. Again for sound there will be lots of claims but for video, they have the same standard stuff everyone else has for their HDMI cables.

There is just no room for picture quality improvements in the HDMI cable. Audio, there could be but not video.

Amir,

Excuse my ignorance about video matters - do we have a "flat" HDMI reference signal in video standards? I mean by flat a digital signal that represents exactly what the engineers put in the source file, without any bit manipulation. Can we ever be sure that two different types of DVD players are outputting the same HDMI data?

 

[amirm]

Amir,

Excuse my ignorance about video matters - do we have a "flat" HDMI reference signal in video standards? I mean by flat a digital signal that represents exactly what the engineers put in the source file, without any bit manipulation. Can we ever be sure that two different types of DVD players are outputting the same HDMI data?

Short answer is yes. That is how all the video reviews are done. We have reference discs and we "know" what a correct signal looks like. We know that because the test patterns are generated by a computer and have precise meaning.

Take a look at this resolution test. These are vertical lines whose spacing gets reduced until it is "one pixel on, one pixel off." A proper system will show this all the way to the one pixel on and off.

Look at how the right quadrant is screwed up. Lines are overlapping and we clearly have lost our clean display.

We have patterns like this for all aspects of display performance. Some require an instrument to measure things but most of them can be used visually for the purpose of this thread.

 

[Joe Whip]

I am sorry but I have been able to run some tests of HDMI cables including some rather expensive one and have found that properly made cables all look the same. ( the tests were run on a D-Nice tweaked Kuro 141) You can quickly see poorly manufactured cables. Sparkles is the first clue. I have not found that expensive power cords attached to a Blu-ray player make any difference in the picture. It does not look brighter. The colors don't change. It does not require a new calibration. I would suggest that the original poster remove the HDMI cable in a week or two and replace it with the cheaper one and tell no one and see if anyone notices.

 

[microstrip]

Short answer is yes. That is how all the video reviews are done. We have reference discs and we "know" what a correct signal looks like. We know that because the test patterns are generated by a computer and have precise meaning.

Take a look at this resolution test. These are vertical lines whose spacing gets reduced until it is "one pixel on, one pixel off." A proper system will show this all the way to the one pixel on and off.

Look at how the right quadrant is screwed up. Lines are overlapping and we clearly have lost our clean display.

We have patterns like this for all aspects of display performance. Some require an instrument to measure things but most of them can be used visually for the purpose of this thread.

I was addressing the digital data, not the visual patterns. Can I consider that two DVD players set to the same resolution send exactly the same digital data to the display through the HDMI cable?

 

[amirm]

I was addressing the digital data, not the visual patterns. Can I consider that two DVD players set to the same resolution send exactly the same digital data to the display through the HDMI cable?

Yes you can.

 

[ErikM]

Just got a new Samsung 4k set.. Replaced an older Audioquest HDMI 3 with an Audioquest Vodka..picture is noticeably better with the Vodka.. Not a huge difference but better.

 

[FrantzM]

Just got a new Samsung 4k set.. Replaced an older Audioquest HDMI 3 with an Audioquest Vodka..picture is noticeably better with the Vodka.. Not a huge difference but better.

Try a a cheap Monoprice HDMI cable ... Put your source on pause/freeze and analyze both pictures .. Tell us after that ...

Sorry guys you can't do that with Audio but in Video we can freeze a picture and analyze it to death ...

 

[JmCamrn]

I'm not sure I agree with this from my past experience. It all started when I was doing video quality comparison between PS4 and Xbox One last year. The biggest immediate difference was that Xbox One had a much more vivid picture compared to the PS4 which looked washed out. I had the first generation Monoprice Redmere on the Xbox and a cheapie (<$5) Monoprice on the PS4. Same video settings on the TV for both. I finally swapped the HDMI cables around and now the PS4 was much more vivid. All of the colors just bloomed.

Just to see that I wasn't going crazy, I took my DSLR camera, set it up on a tripod, put up the colorful home screen of Apple TV and took a picture of the screen. Then I swapped the HDMI cables and without moving anything took another picture of the screen. I uploaded both pictures to: http://screenshotcomparison.com/

This allowed me to just move the mouse back and forth and do a very good quick comparison. The image of the Redmere was brighter and more vivid. The image of the regular Monoprice HDMI was washed out. It was as apparent as night and day. I no longer have these pictures and I'm unable to find them on that site. Not sure if they keep old files.

Just curious on what explanation you might have for what I saw. I have no reason to make any of this up. Both cables were 2m long. Now maybe it's the Redmere technology responsible for the results, but never the less, in my experience HDMI cables make a difference and in this case a significant difference.

 

[amirm]

Washed out colors are usually caused by configuring the levels wrong for that input. Computer levels are 0 to 255 whereas video are 16 to 235. If you set them wrong, you get the effect you mention. Don't see how the cable could cause that change though. If you had two inputs, one of them could have been configured incorrectly. Note that manufacturers have all kinds of funny names for this selection.