Fiber vs. Ethernet sonic differences

StreamFidelity

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Jun 30, 2020
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Because grade B is the best standard:
TRHH brought Grade B fiber optic cable to my attention. And Taiko Audio put me on a new track with their recommendation of the DAC cable because of its low power consumption. I did some tests that may be of interest to others. I connected the cables directly between the Server (NAS and ROON) and the Audio PC (HQPlayer) for testing.

With fiber optic cable, the goal is to achieve the lowest insertion loss and the highest return loss. The best ones are designated Grade A. To my knowledge, only Grade B is available for purchase.

In the picture below, the round UPC shape can be seen on the blue LC connector and the beveled APC shape on the green LC connector.



Now the transceivers have to fit as well. The StarTech can only UPC, the Finisar SFP+ Optical Transceiver FTLX1475D3BTL UPC and APC.

For the test, I chose a piece of music I know well Kyrie by Mercedes Sosa. The spectrogram shows the good dynamics without Loudness War. When Mercedes Sosa's voice gains sharpness and the chorus smears as mush I know something is wrong.



I did two complete runs with each of the cables and also checked for any packet loss. To make a long story short, the evaluation looks the same for all three cables. No packet loss, no degradation in latencies, a jumbo packet at long intervals, and otherwise unremarkable traffic.

No changes from the sound either. I think with UPC Grade B you are very well served with both manufacturers FS and StarTech. The connectors seem to me to be a bit higher quality than the normal product. In the long-term test of APC Grade B, the Finisar transceivers unfortunately became very hot. There were drop outs, probably because of the chip throttling in the transceiver. I can therefore not recommend APC with the Finisar transceiver.

The next test concerns two cables:

10G SFP+ Direct Attach Kable (DAC) consists of a twinax copper cable terminated with SFP+ connectors at both ends. DAC cables can be divided into two categories: passive DACs and active DACs. Both passive and active DAC cables can transmit electrical signals directly over copper cables. The active DAC cables have electrical components inside the transceivers for signal amplification.

10G SFP+ Active Optical Cable (AOC) consists of a multimode fiber optic cable terminated with SFP+ connectors at both ends and requires external power to convert the electrical signals to optical signals and vice versa.

On the left is Cisco's AOC cable; on the right is FS's 10G SFP+ passive twinax copper direct attach cable (DAC).




As expected, there were no differences in terms of data transfer rates and packet loss. Not in terms of sound either. But the temperature development was interesting. The Finisar transceivers get hot even with UPC. In comparison, the AOC cable from Cisco only gets lukewarm. There is hardly any temperature development with the DAC cable from FS.

The approach of Taiko Audio with the recommendation of a DAC cable due to the very low power consumption has something. I could not determine EMI problems with me. But the DAC cable is also short (1m) and hangs in the air. Who is unsure takes an AOC cable with fiber optics. Both are much cheaper than the usual fiber optic transceiver solutions.
 

MarcelNL

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Mar 15, 2021
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interesting results!

I didi not make the observation that the Finisar modules get hot/hotter using APC versus UPC and no smearing of sound either (on the contrary I'd say), I made the observation (preliminary) that APC has a sonic benefit which is now steady for over a week yet I'll do some more A/B later.

The DAC cables are something for short stretches such as in server rooms, not how I use fiber in my home (I need like 15 meters)
 

kennyb123

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If you have 3 meter fiber and SFP 10KM would Attenuator be needed?
I experimented with attenuators a few years back and ultimately concluded that they degrade sound quality. ymmv
 
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kennyb123

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Have now reached the final setup:


View attachment 113106
Torben
I have a Startech FMC. I believe the model number is MCM1110SFP. Replacing this with a Sonore opticalModule brought very worthwhile improvements in terms of naturalness and a more organic sound. This shocked me as it was in use upstream.

 

TRHH

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I have a Startech FMC. I believe the model number is MCM1110SFP. Replacing this with a Sonore opticalModule brought very worthwhile improvements in terms of naturalness and a more organic sound. This shocked me as it was in use upstream.


Than you are running Multimode in your setup. My whole setup is based on Singe-mode.

Torben
 

kennyb123

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Than you are running Multimode in your setup. My whole setup is based on Singe-mode.

Torben
Why make a false assertion instead of seeking clarification? I most certainly was running single mode. Their FMCs should be avoided IMHO.

IMG_0553.jpeg
 
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TRHH

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Sonore opticalModule don't support single mode - only multi-mode. Or has that changed?

Torben
 

kennyb123

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MarkusBarkus

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...at one point, one of the honchos from Sonore posted elsewhere SM/SFP+ would NOT work in the OM, but he was pilloried by 10-15 people who were using it that way at the time, and that was that, as I recall.
 
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kennyb123

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...at one point, one of the honchos from Sonore posted elsewhere SM/SFP+ would NOT work in the OM, but he was pilloried by 10-15 people who were using it that way at the time, and that was that, as I recall.
I believe both sides were correct. The OM maxes out at gigabit so when SFP+ are inserted, they are forced to run at SFP rates. I’m guessing when Sonore made that statement they were unaware of that many SFP+ have a backwards compatibility capability.
 

MarkusBarkus

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...and for me, no concern about the rate. I was trying to harvest any potential advantage with the "better" spec in the SFP+ devices. Anyway, it was all good on my end using SM "cable" and +s in the cages.
 

rDin

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Using SFP+ in my OM. Best sounding setup so far, so also not concerned about what rate they run at. It's amazing how much difference changing even one of the SFP for a different model can make to the sound. You really need to try a bunch of them to find the right sound for your system.
 

Republicoftexas69

Well-Known Member
My system sounds fantastic using SFP+ transceivers. And again my entire house is FO as is our entire community on FO for data and cable. I have 6 inches of cat8 in the system. Using the TaraDak T-S212.
 

kennyb123

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You really need to try a bunch of them to find the right sound for your system.
This is exactly right.
It's amazing how much difference changing even one of the SFP for a different model can make to the sound.
That amazed me as well.
Using SFP+ in my OM.
Which one did you finally land on? I have to admit that I really want to to avoid doing lots of SFP swaps again.
 
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orange55

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This is exactly right.

That amazed me as well.

Which one did you finally land on? I have to admit that I really want to to avoid doing lots of SFP swaps again.
I can advise that I have tried a lot of SPF's and the winner is the Cisco SFP-10G-AOC5M (this is the 5m version). You can pick them up on eBay cheaply used and they sound best. Lush sounding, not sibilance, great sound stage, bass and a really natural sound.

They are listed here also: https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...ch-group-buy-for-audiophilestylecom/#comments
 
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sandz

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Hi Everyone,
This is my first post. I was stunned to hear difference between my DAC connected via laptop, then a raspberry pi based streamer on LPS, then a cheap cat5 and finally a decent cat8 cable. After recently realizing that inputs can make significant differences, I have been going down the rabbit hole of fiber ever since. I was about to pull the trigger on cheap FMCs and cheap Single Mode fiber cable on Aliexpress before I read this thread.

I understand the "CISCO SFP-10G-AOC" (5Meters) sounds great. Which FMC box should I use on either ends?
Can anyone please suggest me a cheap model? Should I try a cheap one from aliexpress or buy one used - just to see if it works well? (If it works well then I could upgrade later to a FMC with superior femto clock.) Also are fiber cables always attached to this cisco model? I found a used one on ebay.
 

Ron Resnick

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Welcome to WBF, sandz!
 
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