Can digital get to vinyl sound and at what price?

[Republicoftexas69]

If SVS is not enough for you, it's not my problemView attachment 113997

LOL That is not science just rubbish.

 

[Al M.]

LOL That is not science just rubbish.

Actually no, the statements about dynamic range for digital media are factually correct. And as far as I can tell, a dynamic range of 70 dB for vinyl is a quite generally accepted number.

A better answer might be, does it matter? If the dynamic range of most *recordings* isn't that high, which appears to be the case, what's the point?

 

[Zeotrope]

True. In an analogous manner, unfortunately those who claim that vinyl is better than digital do their own cause a grave disservice by regurgitating fatal misunderstandings of digital theory ("stairsteps", lack of basic understanding of the Shannon-Nyquist theorem etc).

Instead of quoting theorems, I listen to music and have grown up attending hundreds of live symphonies.
On a lower end or midrange system, digital probably does sound better than vinyl.

 

[Al M.]

Instead of quoting theorems, I listen to music and have grown up attending hundreds of live symphonies.
On a lower end or midrange system, digital probably does sound better than vinyl.

I have decades-long extensive live experience with symphonies, chamber music etc. as well. To my ears vinyl does not have a clear advantage over digital when it comes fidelity to the real thing. And yes, I have heard high-level vinyl playback in other systems numerous times.

You have your opinion, I have mine. The fact that your opinion may be louder ("vinyl blows digital away", per a previous post of yours) does not automatically make it more correct.

 

[SoundMann]

True. In an analogous manner, unfortunately those who claim that vinyl is better than digital do their own cause a grave disservice by regurgitating fatal misunderstandings of digital theory ("stairsteps", lack of basic understanding of the Shannon-Nyquist theorem etc).

The problem with the Nyquist theorem is that it doesn't work as well in the real world, and the stairsteps have always been measureable.

 

[SoundMann]

Actually no, the statements about dynamic range for digital media are factually correct.

Actually it has been a lie since day one!

 

[Republicoftexas69]

Actually no, the statements about dynamic range for digital media are factually correct. And as far as I can tell, a dynamic range of 70 dB for vinyl is a quite generally accepted number.

A better answer might be, does it matter? If the dynamic range of most *recordings* isn't that high, which appears to be the case, what's the point?

As you stated @peraljam5000 point is moot and why are we wasting our time??

 

[Audiophile666]

Also has anyone compared DSD and other hi res files / streaming to vinyl?
It blows away Vinyl so hard it's not even funny .
Actually DSD is the closest to the sound that was recorded in the studio , he can hear no difference to at all
Paul from PS Audio says it himself .
And vinyl "has a sound of it's own " That's a direct quote from him .
Not to mention that vinyl is a copy from the digital master .
Nothing can sound better than the master itself, period .

 

[Republicoftexas69]

Also has anyone compared DSD and other hi res files / streaming to vinyl?
It blows away Vinyl so hard it's not even funny .
Actually DSD is the closest to the sound that was recorded in the studio , he can hear no difference to at all
Paul from PS Audio says it himself .
And vinyl "has a sound of it's own " That's a direct quote from him .
Not to mention that vinyl is a copy from the digital master .
Nothing can sound better than the master itself, period .

 

[Audiophile666]

Lol no amount of facts will change your mind
Enjoy your "superior " format

 

[SoundMann]

Also has anyone compared DSD and other hi res files / streaming to vinyl?
It blows away Vinyl so hard it's not even funny .
Actually DSD is the closest to the sound that was recorded in the studio , he can hear no difference to at all
Paul from PS Audio says it himself .
And vinyl "has a sound of it's own " That's a direct quote from him .
Not to mention that vinyl is a copy from the digital master .
Nothing can sound better than the master itself, period .

Dumb and dumber!

 

[SoundMann]

Enjoy your "superior " format

I do so every time!

 

[tima]

You can stick with what these sheep have to say, but you will never assimilate us!

Baa Ram Ewe -- to your breed, your fleece, your clan be true!

 

[Al M.]

As you stated @peraljam5000 point is moot and why are we wasting our time??

Perhaps

I do think that dynamic range is more critical in digital, because you want to stay away as far as possible from audible quantization noise. But then there's a little thing called dither, which converts it into random noise. A bit like tape hiss.

 

[stnsw]

Just a note to the discussion--often people are talking about streaming versus playing vinyl. If you are playing purchased high-res digital files the comparison changes a bit.

 

[Al M.]

Just a note to the discussion--often people are talking about streaming versus playing vinyl. If you are playing purchased high-res digital files the comparison changes a bit.

Exactly. Thanks for bringing up the point. The comparison also changes with high-quality physical digital disc playback. There is a synthetic quality of sound with streaming that can be avoided, but isn't always in less than optimal implementations (unfortunately this holds for some stationary file playback too, even though perhaps the problem is less pronounced). In the presence of this somewhat artificial timbre I would prefer vinyl too.

 

[the sound of Tao]

Scandinavian Jazz bands are great, what they lack in talent, they make up for with enthusiasm ! And sometimes having only a rudimentary knowledge of English does not hold them back from singing whole albums in said language !

Get together, drink plenty and play music… what’s not to get enthusiastic about tho I do prefer my jazz without the words

 

[AudioHR]

I would agree that digital cannot sound as good as vinyl.
Until my Horizon and tube rolling came along.
I am in heaven.
Now I don't stand up every 15 minutes to flip a record, clean, destatic, find albums, etc.
Call me lazy

Interesting that you should say that.

While my digital is descent I prefer my vinyl and I don't even have one of the really hi end, "best?" analog setups. I would say that has also been true of listening to my audiophile friends extremely good digital setups, they are really good but I dig the sound of vinyl.

Until recently that is ! A friend has an Antipodes Oladra and when he upgraded to the Lampizator Horizon the sound of his already excellent system went to the next level.

It might be time to take more notice of digital!

 

[microstrip]

Instead of quoting theorems, I listen to music and have grown up attending hundreds of live symphonies.

Sorry, it does not help you knowledge of reproduced sound. At best it helps establishing you own preference.

On a lower end or midrange system, digital probably does sound better than vinyl.

Probably implies a statistic. Can you report us how you arrived to such brilliant conclusion?

IMO preference does not depend on price, we can get adequate systems for any media for any price range. But I feel sometimes it is easier to add some euphonic distortions to low price vinyl systems than to digital systems.

 

[microstrip]

(...) You have your opinion, I have mine. The fact that your opinion may be louder ("vinyl blows digital away", per a previous post of yours) does not automatically make it more correct.

In fact, opinions such as kills, blows, eclipse or outshine are espected to be emotional but poorly reasoned.

But we should remember that digital overload sounds hard and brittle, easily identified, while analog overload sounds louder and is harder to note. Probably it is why some vinyl fans like to tell it LOUDER - they got used to it!