Breaking news from DCS….

microstrip

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Hi microstrip, what is your conclusion about Apex ?

Definitively worth getting our units upgraded. None of the fundamental aspects of the dCS Vivaldi have been compromised - it will not sound like vinyl - but surely an improvement.

I have always paired the Vivaldi with what I found adequate preamplifiers to please my preferences - in fact I stay loyal to the Audio Research Anniversary (REF40) to complement it. At this level of performance I want my source to have the full information and be neutral - whichever this really can mean :).

Envelopment, timbre accuracy and a correct large soundstage where I can locate performers and realize their dimensions and relative power - this is a short summary of what I get with the Vivaldi. The APEX is surely more rich in nuance and detail, may be it is why people refer they find it more rhythmic - we feel the performer intentions more easily.

The Vivaldi APEX was now returned to the distributor, fortunately the old version has excellence enough to keep my music flowing without excessive regrets ...
 

Jpspock

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By Respect, I mean accept taste differences without making négative critics. Do you read somewhere dcs owner saying that Wadax, Ch Precision, Esoteric … are bad ? No.
it’s true that dcs is considered as analytical, and ut’s true as it works like a loop. But Music is well present, especially since Vivaldi, Rossini and version 2.0 improvement. Do you think DCS would be on top if it was not musical, not sure of that. Now everyone can make his own choice, and we will Respect it
 

PeterA

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Definitively worth getting our units upgraded. None of the fundamental aspects of the dCS Vivaldi have been compromised - it will not sound like vinyl - but surely an improvement.

I have always paired the Vivaldi with what I found adequate preamplifiers to please my preferences - in fact I stay loyal to the Audio Research Anniversary (REF40) to complement it. At this level of performance I want my source to have the full information and be neutral - whichever this really can mean :).

Fransisco, do you mean you prefer your Apex Vivaldi to your vinyl, or is the Apex Vivaldi surely an improvement over the previous version of Vivaldi? I can read the sentence to mean either case.

Also, I read this second point to mean that you want your DAC to pass on all of the information from the recording AND you want your DAC to be neutral. If this is the case, what do you mean by wanting the preamp to compliment the DAC? Do you want them to compliment each other meaning to balance each other to please your preferences, or do you want both your DAC and your REF 40 to both be neutral so that you can not hear one over the other?
 
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Jpspock

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Hi Peter, glad to read you. Remember, we discussed à few years ago about your predecessor amps xa160.5. I think it is not necessary to confront digital and vinyl, same for cd. All of them can bring you to Music, omho.

If I may give my opinion, a ref40 cannot be neutral as tubes used have their own signature, and all are different. I experimented it with thé ref5Se. Now I can say I have a neutral preamp and he gives a total liberty to the source and amp. It’ s a passive preamp. No tubes, nor transistor…

Congrats for your new setup, must be in heaven
 

microstrip

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Fransisco, do you mean you prefer your Apex Vivaldi to your vinyl, or is the Apex Vivaldi surely an improvement over the previous version of Vivaldi? I can read the sentence to mean either case.

As I have said many times, my individual preference on format is determined by specific recordings. However, considering my listening habits and musical preferences, statistically I prefer digital on the dCS Vivaldi. And yes, the APEX Vivaldi is a real improvement over the previous version. My best vinyl has no digital equivalent and my best digital has no vinyl equivalent. It is an apples versus orange comparison. BTW, you can't compare a vintage LP pressing with a more recent digital version, carried from tapes that needed strong equalization to compensate for aging losses.

Also, I read this second point to mean that you want your DAC to pass on all of the information from the recording AND you want your DAC to be neutral. If this is the case, what do you mean by wanting the preamp to compliment the DAC? Do you want them to compliment each other meaning to balance each other to please your preferences, or do you want both your DAC and your REF 40 to both be neutral so that you can not hear one over the other?

I do not want the preamplifier to be neutral. I want it to mach my preference. Preamps are not neutral - and surely our common Lamm LL1 is not neutral, fortunately it has a sound signature, it is why we pay a fortune for it! ;) And yes, the preamplfier must match the whole system.
 

microstrip

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(...) When you say your preamp is not neutral and that it is chosen to complement the neutral DAC, again I don’t understand what you mean By the word “compliment”. How Is it possible to complement something that is already neutral? Or are you now talking about the rest of the system and not the neutral DAC source component? I’m just trying to understand your earlier post and why you choose to pair the REF40 with the Vivaldi DAC.
Complement - according to dictionaries: a thing that contributes extra features to something else in such a way as to improve or emphasize its quality. I use the word in this sense in stereo - to complement is adding something that subjective improves my own perception of sound quality, with all its emotional consequences. Because as F. Toole wrote:

"The origin of emotion in a listener is the art itself—the music or movie—and not the audio hardware. It is inconceivable that a consumer could feel an emotional attachment to a midrange loudspeaker driver, yet without good ones, listening experiences will be diminished" (end of quote)

Remember that stereo high-end is essentially not neutral - it reflects the individual preferences of its creator.
 

PeterA

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As I have said many times, my individual preference on format is determined by specific recordings. However, considering my listening habits and musical preferences, statistically I prefer digital on the dCS Vivaldi. And yes, the APEX Vivaldi is a real improvement over the previous version. My best vinyl has no digital equivalent and my best digital has no vinyl equivalent. It is an apples versus orange comparison. BTW, you can't compare a vintage LP pressing with a more recent digital version, carried from tapes that needed strong equalization to compensate for aging losses.



I do not want the preamplifier to be neutral. I want it to mach my preference. Preamps are not neutral - and surely our common Lamm LL1 is not neutral, fortunately it has a sound signature, it is why we pay a fortune for it! ;) And yes, the preamplfier must match the whole system.

Thank you Francisco. I found your post ambiguous so thank you for explaining that you both prefer digital vinyl and that the new Vivaldi is better than the old Vivaldi.

Now I understand that you want your preamp to match your preferences but earlier you said you chose it to complement your neutral DAC. This was very confusing to me. The latter implies to me some kind of balancing going on between two components. I think I understand now.

EDIT: I just saw your post. I understand now that you want your preamp to enhance qualities to your preference because you think your DAC is neutral. Thank you.
 

caesar

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Jason Sirinius is reporting in Stereophile website that John Quick has landed with Dynaudio. BEst of luck to him!

Dynaudio Naim is a fun system. More fun than any dCS system I have heard :) , excepting new Acme dCS Vivaldi with the new Avantgarde Trio
 

Lee

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My Rossini Apex upgrade is scheduling very soon. I will report back on what I hear.

Also, I have received my Rossini Transport and I love it. I will report on that as well but I am awaiting some Shunyata Omega cables for the dual AES and third clock cable. That will also take it to another level, based on the Omega clock cables I added to the master clock.

I am shooting a bunch of videos for The Absolute Sound and the Rossini stack before/after the Apex is one of them.
 

andromedaaudio

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Fransisco, do you mean you prefer your Apex Vivaldi to your vinyl, or is the Apex Vivaldi surely an improvement over the previous version of Vivaldi? I can read the sentence to mean either case.

If micro dares to say his DCS sounds better then his Studer with good tapes i ll personally see to it that the whole thing gets shipped to Eternal Arts in germany for a complete machine revision lol
 

caesar

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If micro dares to say his DCS sounds better then his Studer with good tapes i ll personally see to it that the whole thing gets shipped to Eternal Arts in germany for a complete machine revision lol

Extremely dangerous thing, if you don't intimately trust someone's taste or spent many hours listening together with :)
 

microstrip

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If micro dares to say his DCS sounds better then his Studer with good tapes i ll personally see to it that the whole thing gets shipped to Eternal Arts in germany for a complete machine revision lol

Why not simply asking, avoiding speculation? Although I have answered several times to your particular question in other threads I can summarize. In order to be able to say "sounds better" we would need to compare the best analogue recordings with the best digital recordings. Considering that what I consider my reference digital recordings do not exist in analog it is not possible to find a "better". I would say however that some modern recordings carried in digital would not have been possible in analog and I have asked several times for some analog fan to inform me of an LP having the musical complexity of my favorite Savall "Routes de l'esclavage" or an LP pressing that does not show vinyl artifacts at the end of Shostakovitch 5th Symphony. Yes, I know it is unfair to access the LP media at the point of minimal linear velocity ... :rolleyes:

FIY, my Studer A80's are regularly measured, including spectra of Wow and Flutter and indirect measurements of scrape flutter - I once posted data on it in WBF. I tried to learn on the subject from Fred Thale and Dale Manquen, as well as from tape forums.
 
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andromedaaudio

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Why not simply asking, avoiding speculation? Although I have answered several times to your particular question in other threads I can summarize. In order to be able to say "sounds better" we would need to compare the best analogue recordings with the best digital recordings. Considering that what I consider my reference digital recordings do not exist in analog it is not possible to find a "better". I would say however that some modern recordings carried in digital would not have been possible in analog and I have asked several times for some analog fan to inform me of an LP having the musical complexity of my favorite Savall "Routes de l'esclavage" or an LP pressing that does not show vinyl artifacts at the end of Shostakovitch 5th Symphony. Yes, I know it is unfair to access the LP media at the point of minimal linear velocity ... :rolleyes:

FIY, my Studer A80's are regularly measured, including spectra of Wow and Flutter and indirect measurements of scrape flutter - I once posted data on it in WBF. I tried to learn on the subject from Fred Thale and Dale Manquen, as well as from tape forums.

Okay fair enough .
Please do a WADAX - DCS "shoot out " then
 
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Lee

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I just had my Apex upgrade scheduled by dCS. Sending the unit up to the service center in Waltham, MA.

I will let you know what differences I hear in my system once it gets back and broken in.
 

TLi

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I just had my Apex upgrade scheduled by dCS. Sending the unit up to the service center in Waltham, MA.

I will let you know what differences I hear in my system once it gets back and broken in.
I got my Apex upgrade last week. The sound is just improved in every aspect I can think of. The resolution is much enhanced without any harshness. In fact it is smooth and natural.

The Apex DAC is a big step forward over the original Ring DAC. dCS has done a great job, I am very happy with the upgrade and you will not be disappointed. 461BC772-FA03-481D-892E-DEC435583025.jpeg
 

Lee

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I got my Apex upgrade last week. The sound is just improved in every aspect I can think of. The resolution is much enhanced without any harshness. In fact it is smooth and natural.

The Apex DAC is a big step forward over the original Ring DAC. dCS has done a great job, I am very happy with the upgrade and you will not be disappointed. View attachment 95083
Very happy to hear! I am excited As I was impressed by the Rossini Apex at our local dealer.
 
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pleroma

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I got my Apex upgrade last week. The sound is just improved in every aspect I can think of. The resolution is much enhanced without any harshness. In fact it is smooth and natural.

The Apex DAC is a big step forward over the original Ring DAC. dCS has done a great job, I am very happy with the upgrade and you will not be disappointed. View attachment 95083

Great! It's nice to see something on the improvement instead of dCS just bragging about themselves.

Best wishes to John Quick. He was a nice guy and a hard worker.
 

BillK

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One of the really amazing things about this hobby is how often an upgrade is released and you think “this is already great, how much better could it be?”

The APEX is one of those upgrades, completely worth it IMHO.
 
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divertiti

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Definitively worth getting our units upgraded. None of the fundamental aspects of the dCS Vivaldi have been compromised - it will not sound like vinyl - but surely an improvement.

.....

The Vivaldi APEX was now returned to the distributor, fortunately the old version has excellence enough to keep my music flowing without excessive regrets ...
Micro, am I reading your post right that you believe it is worth getting the older DCS dacs upgraded to APEX but you ultimately decided to forego the upgrade and retained your older version? If so, can you give a bit more color on that decision?
 
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