Alexia Setup - Upper Array Adjustment Question

[MadFloyd]

In the off chance someone on this forum has some experience/knowledge with setting up Alexias - specifically the upper cabinet, I thought I'd throw this question out.

The Alexia manual contains a propagation chart in order to adjust the Alexia's upper cabinet (called Upper Array by Wilson) correctly for listening distance and height. There are 4 settings:

- Upper Array Spike Length
- Upper Array Alignment Block Position
- Upper Array Alignment Block Step
- Tweeter Detent Position

The chart lists Ear Height and Listening Distance. My issue is that the granularity is not fine enough and it's not easy to interpolate between them. For example the listening distance lists 11, 12 & 14 feet. If you're at 13 feet you're doing some guesswork and/or trial and error. In my case, I'm at 11.5 feet. The 12' doesn't seem right - it's somewhat dull sounding - and the 11' is too aggressive. I need something in between, but what to change?

My seating height is 36" and here are the values in the propagation chart for the 11 & 12 feet:

.......Spike........Block Pos........Block Step......Tweeter
11'.:...3..............14...................9................4
12'.:...4...............9....................7................5

As you can see it's not easy to interpolate between the two.

Anyone have any experience with this? I'm accepting gut feelings and outright guesses too.

 

[Steve Williams]

I have always followed Wilson's recommendations that the distance from tweeter to tweeter X 1.1-1.3 = listening distance

Have you tried moving your speakers closer together

 

[MadFloyd]

I have always followed Wilson's recommendations that the distance from tweeter to tweeter X 1.1-1.3 = listening distance

Have you tried moving your speakers closer together

I'm currently at 1.32; if I move the speakers closer together that value will increase closer to 1.4.

 

[Steve Williams]

Have you tried sitting closer

I always have my ratio at 1.1 in my setups

 

[LL21]

Hey Madfloyd,

If you're at 11.5 feet, I presume you've tried the mathematical equivalent which is averaging each of the above values...or as close to it as the alexia will allow? 3.5, 11.5, 8, 4.5. If so, what happened?

 

[MadFloyd]

Have you tried sitting closer

I always have my ratio at 1.1 in my setups

I can't move my listening seat (it's at the most neutral spot from a bass perspective) and the speakers are already pretty far out into the room. I forget the last time I tried them further out (I may have to try again) but I feel the bass is pretty good where I have them and you know what happens when you move speakers even an inch or two...

 

[LL21]

...For example the listening distance lists 11, 12 & 14 feet... In my case, I'm at 11.5 feet. The 12' doesn't seem right - it's somewhat dull sounding - and the 11' is too aggressive...

Look on the bright side, it's clear that this speaker is very flexible and it's sound can be tailored to your room and ears!!! Good luck with setup...I sense it will all be worth it in the end.

 

[Steve Williams]

I can't move my listening seat (it's at the most neutral spot from a bass perspective) and the speakers are already pretty far out into the room. I forget the last time I tried them further out (I may have to try again) but I feel the bass is pretty good where I have them and you know what happens when you move speakers even an inch or two...

why not try moving the speakers 6" closer to the front wall

 

[MadFloyd]

Hey Madfloyd,

If you're at 11.5 feet, I presume you've tried the mathematical equivalent which is averaging each of the above values...or as close to it as the alexia will allow? 3.5, 11.5, 8, 4.5. If so, what happened?

No, I haven't tried this. I can't do half-steps on things like spikes or tweeter detent, but I suppose I could do that for the block alignment and block step.

 

[MadFloyd]

Look on the bright side, it's clear that this speaker is very flexible and it's sound can be tailored to your room and ears!!! Good luck with setup...I sense it will all be worth it in the end.

Yep, I do love that about these speakers and they're sounding great, I'm just trying to perfect them.

 

[LL21]

No, I haven't tried this. I can't do half-steps on things like spikes or tweeter detent, but I suppose I could do that for the block alignment and block step.

Perhaps try it on the ones you can...and then leave the others on one end of the scale or the other between 11 and 12. And for final adjustments, play with the resistors. I know you've said its a little confusing...all I know is it really really really worked for me when the distributor changed them for my tweeters (twice) to get them just right in my room.

 

[MadFloyd]

why not try moving the speakers 6" closer to the front wall

I could always go back to that, but I feel 12' is on the outer limits of how far back I'd want to be from these. Every inch closer than 12' seems to be an improvement (less room sound I suppose).

 

[LL21]

I could always go back to that, but I feel 12' is on the outer limits of how far back I'd want to be from these. Every inch closer than 12' seems to be an improvement (less room sound I suppose).

One thing for sure, if you keep changing all the variables all the time, you could end up going around and around in circles. I you like 11.5 a lot, perhaps try a few more things to see if u can make the alexia work for that distance. Wilsons really are quite flexible designs. But you'll need to do it step at a time to understand what each change does and whether it gets you closer or further from where you want to be.

 

[PeterA]

Hi Madfloyd,

If the chart in the manual suggests 11' or 12' and you think that your listening seat is already in the optimal location, but it places the listening distance to each tweeter at 11'-6", then I would start by moving the speakers up or back 6" in a line from your ears. Perhaps then follow the ratio of tweeter X 1.1-1.3 as a basis from which to adjust the upper module according to the manual. It sounds like you are close though. I did attend a demo with Peter McGrath in which he showed how just one click on the step of the upper module altered the sound. I did not think it was a great as he described, but it did make a very subtle difference.

I would also consider your Transparent cables. If they are not configured for your latest round of upgrades (electronics, DAC, phono), those might not be optimized for best sound and could be effecting your results in terms of tonal balance.

Does the manual go into details about toe-in? I'd follow the directions closely and then alter it slightly to suite your own preferences. It sounded pretty darn good when I was last there, and that was before the DAC and phono.

 

[microstrip]

Madfloyd,

I listen typically around 12 feet in a low armchair so my positions are similar to yours 12' 36" 4-9-7-5 .The ratio tweeter separation/ hear distance is 1.2.

Although the position of the speaker in the room is critical, I have found that there is some tolerance in the chair position - I can move it around 1 feet without great changes in tonal balance. Excessive dependence of tonal balance with hear distance can suggest that your speakers are not placed at optimum places in your room - I have found that when the Alexia's are sounding great the listening spot enlarges significantly.

Although the best measured bass zone in my room is around 38% of length measured from the back wall, it is not the zone that gives me the better overall sound. Sometimes simple measurements disagree with reality.

 

[Bruce B]

Mine are pretty close to the front wall. I know they would always round down to the nearest setting. I had to change resistors for my high/mid as well.
For toe-in, I can just barely see the inside of the bottom cabinet.

They first tried all kinds of positions out into the room. It didn't snap into focus until they moved them 3' closer to the front wall.

 

[jap]

Madfloyd,

Did you discuss your concerns with your dealer when the WASP was done?

 

[jfrech]

Hi Madfloyd,

If the chart in the manual suggests 11' or 12' and you think that your listening seat is already in the optimal location, but it places the listening distance to each tweeter at 11'-6", then I would start by moving the speakers up or back 6" in a line from your ears. Perhaps then follow the ratio of tweeter X 1.1-1.3 as a basis from which to adjust the upper module according to the manual. It sounds like you are close though. I did attend a demo with Peter McGrath in which he showed how just one click on the step of the upper module altered the sound. I did not think it was a great as he described, but it did make a very subtle difference.

I would also consider your Transparent cables. If they are not configured for your latest round of upgrades (electronics, DAC, phono), those might not be optimized for best sound and could be effecting your results in terms of tonal balance.

Does the manual go into details about toe-in? I'd follow the directions closely and then alter it slightly to suite your own preferences. It sounded pretty darn good when I was last there, and that was before the DAC and phono.

Hi, I have to agree with Peter if you haven't retuned with the latest electronics. Also, you have the resistors that are easily changed and can/will alter things also. This is one of the best aspects on Wilson speakers...the ability to change lots a parameters for room and other interactions...I've heard the Alexia's..very nice speaker !!!

 

[Kingsrule]

Hi Madfloyd,

If the chart in the manual suggests 11' or 12' and you think that your listening seat is already in the optimal location, but it places the listening distance to each tweeter at 11'-6", then I would start by moving the speakers up or back 6" in a line from your ears. Perhaps then follow the ratio of tweeter X 1.1-1.3 as a basis from which to adjust the upper module according to the manual. It sounds like you are close though. I did attend a demo with Peter McGrath in which he showed how just one click on the step of the upper module altered the sound. I did not think it was a great as he described, but it did make a very subtle difference.


.

What kind of "click" are you talking about? There are no click adjustments on Alexia.
So was it the step block adjustment on the whole upper module, the front and back adjustment on the upper module, or the front and back adjustment on the tweeter?

 

[PeterA]

What kind of "click" are you talking about? There are no click adjustments on Alexia.
So was it the step block adjustment on the whole upper module, the front and back adjustment on the upper module, or the front and back adjustment on the tweeter?

Sorry to be unclear g997. I think Peter McGrath demonstrated that one increment forward and backward on the Alexia tweeter module changed the sound dramatically. I did not think it was dramatic, but it was audible. I can't say if it was a step or a click or a slide, but I seem to remember that the tweeter was moved forward, not tilted up or down, and then moved back again. It might have been back then forward to the original position. I think he was demonstrating the time alignment feature between the tweeter and the midrange. Madfloyd was there. Perhaps he remembers. These are very flexible speakers.