Zero Distortion: Tango Time

[bonzo75]

Btw, just found out that if anyone is interested in buying the Cessaro Liszt for 60k or so GBP, a Cessaro dealer in the UK is selling.

 

[microstrip]

Respectfully, I think you are ignoring the hard question. This begs the puzzling and interesting question/development behind the members who have disconnected entirely their subwoofer systems.

It appears that in some situations not even the best subwoofers in the world can be correctly dialed in to some systems. No matter what the setting of the subwoofers some systems which had subwoofers sound better without them.

IMHO the interesting technical question is why these people disconnected their woofers/ subwoofers. I admitted for sometime that it was due to inadequacy of the room to being bass driven - a add on subwoofer can excite and show problems in the room. But Tang situation is changing my view - as far as I see, I (and it sees no one else) do not have enough technical data on his speakers - he his not diconnecting an add-on subwoofer, he is not using the woofer that is integral part of his speakers, as conceived by the designer.

But the big question, that IMHO will stay unanswered, is how the opinions of Ked and Tango are being inluenced by this choice. Will they have the same preferences in a full range system?

Yes, I know it all subjective, but some people can not forget about the existence of Sabine and Hertz!

 

[bonzo75]

You are right Micro... Mike didn't turn off his sub...
But like Tang admitted he has to build his room to deal with it.

To find out how it affected our opinion, best is to to cross reference with Christian. I already have a confirmation from someone who owned techdas and EMT that the differences are as he heard them in his.

 

[ddk]

IMHO the interesting technical question is why these people disconnected their woofers/ subwoofers. I admitted for sometime that it was due to inadequacy of the room to being bass driven - a add on subwoofer can excite and show problems in the room. But Tang situation is changing my view - as far as I see, I (and it sees no one else) do not have enough technical data on his speakers - he his not diconnecting an add-on subwoofer, he is not using the woofer that is integral part of his speakers, as conceived by the designer.

But the big question, that IMHO will stay unanswered, is how the opinions of Ked and Tango are being inluenced by this choice. Will they have the same preferences in a full range system?

Yes, I know it all subjective, but some people can not forget about the existence of Sabine and Hertz!

Don don donnnnn..... How are Ked & Tango being turned into Pod brains getting manipulated without the boom boxes? Francisco it's the edge of DARKNESS, to Woof or NOT TO WOOF awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww; the mystery of the turned off subwoofers, why, why, whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy ? The thread is beginning to sound like this guy;

 

[microstrip]

Don don donnnnn..... How are Ked & Tango being turned into Pod brains getting manipulated without the boom boxes? Francisco it's the edge of DARKNESS, to Woof or NOT TO WOOF awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww; the mystery of the turned off subwoofers, why, why, whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy ? The thread is beginning to sound like this guy;

Just being analytical, I clearly stated it!

 

[microstrip]

I am sure Mike's ML3s are the at the place of someone who will try and let them go soon given he does not have the appropriate speakers for these amps

Ked,

The MI5 is giving you false information - you should try the CIA!

 

[bonzo75]

 

[ddk]

Just being analytical, I clearly stated it!

Like they say in MI5, I'm clearly taking the piss out of those analytics !

david

 

[microstrip]

Like they say in MI5, I'm clearly taking the piss out of those analytics !

david

I can't imagine a 007 movie without boom boxes - the ladies are not enough to obliterate the need for explosions ...

 

[Tango]

But Tang situation is changing my view - as far as I see, I (and it sees no one else) do not have enough technical data on his speakers - he his not diconnecting an add-on subwoofer, he is not using the woofer that is integral part of his speakers, as conceived by the designer.

The beauty of being able to think outside the box and have this system is I have a choice. Most speakers dont allow you to do this and would just be stuck with the sound. No choice. Not even a chance of knowing alternative sound you can get from your room without buying a new pair. Be positive and think outside the box, thats when you get the most out of your room.

Tang

 

[microstrip]

The beauty of being able to think outside the box and have this system is I have a choice. Most speakers dont allow you to do this and would just be stuck with the sound. No choice. Not even a chance of knowing alternative sound you can get from your room without buying a new pair. Be positive and think outside the box, thats when you get the most out of your room.

Tang

Dear Tang,

IMHO in this case thinking outside the box is trying to understand a situation using proper information and an innovative, unconventional way to analyze it - not just the wow effect that soon dissipates as the enthusiasm peak vanishes. And yes, thinking outside the box is beautiful, I can assure you ...

Apologies this debate is happening in this thread about listening carried in your system - there were a lot of interesting things to discuss.

 

[Tango]

Dear Tang,

IMHO in this case thinking outside the box is trying to understand a situation using proper information and an innovative, unconventional way to analyze it - not just the wow effect that soon dissipates as the enthusiasm peak vanishes. And yes, thinking outside the box is beautiful, I can assure you ...

Apologies this debate is happening in this thread about listening carried in your system - there were a lot of interesting things to discuss.

No apology needed Micro.

I am lucky that my wow never ceased. In fact I am getting ready to wow some more today .

How long lasting your wow on your system and new gears btw. Is it as fast as a decay of drum twack?

Warmest regards,
Tang

 

[microstrip]

No apology needed Micro.

I am lucky that my wow never ceased. In fact I am getting ready to wow some more today .

How long lasting your wow on your system and new gears btw. Is it as fast as a decay of drum twack?

Warmest regards,
Tang

My wow on sound reproduction is constant - otherwise I would get another hobby - perhaps simply listening to music.

Curiously my wow on the XLF's was so great that after having sold them - a stupid move - I found I had to get another pair. And something is arriving very soon to increase it ... No, it is not a screwdriver to take the 15" driver away from the XLF's!

 

[bonzo75]

No apology needed Micro.

I am lucky that my wow never ceased. In fact I am getting ready to wow some more today .

How long lasting your wow on your system and new gears btw. Is it as fast as a decay of drum twack?

Warmest regards,
Tang

The drum thwack on large ported cones takes forever to reach you, and then hangs about the room for a while before leaving

 

[bonzo75]

My wow on sound reproduction is constant - otherwise I would get another hobby - perhaps simply listening to music.

Curiously my wow on the XLF's was so great that after having sold them - a stupid move - I found I had to get another pair. And something is arriving very soon to increase it ... No, it is not a screwdriver to take the 15" driver away from the XLF's!

Did you sell off your JL when you sold off your XLF?

 

[microstrip]

Did you sell off your JL when you sold off your XLF?

Not yet, but I will probably sell the whole system (JL113 mk2's + CR1) as soon as I find a friend who needs them! Some time I will probably want to try Wilson Watchdog subs ...

 

[Mike Lavigne]

The beauty of being able to think outside the box and have this system is I have a choice. Most speakers dont allow you to do this and would just be stuck with the sound. No choice. Not even a chance of knowing alternative sound you can get from your room without buying a new pair. Be positive and think outside the box, thats when you get the most out of your room.

Tang

a few years ago when i fixed my ceiling (closed the ceiling bass traps), it eliminated a significant 10 db bass suck out around 30 hz. this totally messed with all the bass adjustments on my MM7 bass towers from where the speaker designer had set them in his visit the previous year. it caused a very boomy bass as it had been set to compensate for that suck out.

i was faced with learning to adjust the bass towers on my own. my first step was to turn them off, to get a reference of how the passive towers sounded by themselves. then i started to adjust each parameter, check where i wanted each setting by simply turning off the bass towers to see whether i preferred the sound on or off. there were 4 different adjustments and over a month or so i methodically went through each one and then went through them again, and again..........always checking myself by turning the bass towers off.

always; was it better on or off was the question. toward the end of my process i started to really appreciate just how much dialed in lower octaves can add, but also just where over-cooked lower octaves can harm too.

 

[morricab]

The drum thwack on large ported cones takes forever to reach you, and then hangs about the room for a while before leaving

Depends completely on the box design...a vented box can be fast...

 

[Tango]

a few years ago when i fixed my ceiling (closed the ceiling bass traps), it eliminated a significant 10 db bass suck out around 30 hz. this totally messed with all the bass adjustments on my MM7 bass towers from where the speaker designer had set them in his visit the previous year. it caused a very boomy bass as it had been set to compensate for that suck out.

i was faced with learning to adjust the bass towers on my own. my first step was to turn them off, to get a reference of how the passive towers sounded by themselves. then i started to adjust each parameter, check where i wanted each setting by simply turning off the bass towers to see whether i preferred the sound on or off. there were 4 different adjustments and over a month or so i methodically went through each one and then went through them again, and again..........always checking myself by turning the bass towers off.

always; was it better on or off was the question. toward the end of my process i started to really appreciate just how much dialed in lower octaves can add, but also just where over-cooked lower octaves can harm too.

Making baby steps toward audio airvana, sir.
Work in progress.

Kindest regards,
Tang

 

[microstrip]

Ked,

The MI5 is giving you false information - you should try the CIA!

Ked,

Please transmit this CIA image to the MI5!