What do you know about the Bybee story? Do u believe its a fiction? I am assuming so....
The best amps ever made!
- Thread starter asindc
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What do you know about the Bybee story? Do u believe its a fiction? I am assuming so....
Classified
Ha! Isn't that always the case in cyberspace? That facilitates our misbehavior. You scored points for that funny and is probably prudent on your part not to go there.
There is a 1000+ post thread on DIY.com that whips the bybee phenomenon to death. It is gloriously divisive and snippy. I understand your cynicism. Anything with the word "quantum" in it makes audiophiles eyes glaze over and pull out their checkbooks right?
I have a weakness for tweaks. In some strange sense, it represents the cutting edge of audio even though there a lot of cheese and chicanery. I have owned several products with bybee technology involved and "thought" they were effective. I have also screwed around with Synergistic Research's "quantum" fuses and they have an impact. You can argue that the placebo effect is real and who cares. The lines are obviously very blurry in our stupid hobby. Ciao.
My name is Dale Pitcher. I was the director of engineering for Essence when the amplifier that started this thread was developed and marketed. The Generation III amplifiers were the most advanced amplifiers built by Essence. Only eight were built - basically because they were too complicated to put on any type of assembly line. I will post much more detailed information on this specific product soon.
I also have substantial insight on how the military and aerospace industry (as well as universities) have made significant technologies, information and materials available to audio companies and designers. I will post some of the ways I have seen this and will also address other posts on this thread.
I also have substantial insight on how the military and aerospace industry (as well as universities) have made significant technologies, information and materials available to audio companies and designers. I will post some of the ways I have seen this and will also address other posts on this thread.
It is a fact that government funded research, military or otherwise, sometimes* benefits commercial interests. That's one of the first slides researchers show when groveling for grants. It's still utterly ridiculous to push a product claiming, "50% of the parts inside are military secrets. Parts are encapsulated in powdered quartz to sheild RF and make it impossible to steal technology." That is worthy of scorn and there is no way you can worm your way out of it. Scorn! Scorn! Scorn! There, take your licks. Don't spend too much time regretting it. Just don't do it again.
*Edit for "sometimes"
*Edit for "sometimes"
Hi Dale and welcome to WBF! Long time no talk
Look forward to hearing more about your amps.
Let me add my warm welcome to WBF Dale. Look forward to your continued participation.
Members please respect industry experts. They are a great source of information, whether you agree with their choices or not.
It is a fact that government funded research, military or otherwise, sometimes* benefits commercial interests. That's one of the first slides researchers show when groveling for grants. It's still utterly ridiculous to push a product claiming, "50% of the parts inside are military secrets. Parts are encapsulated in powdered quartz to sheild RF and make it impossible to steal technology." That is worthy of scorn and there is no way you can worm your way out of it. Scorn! Scorn! Scorn! There, take your licks. Don't spend too much time regretting it. Just don't do it again.
I have never seen this site so offer me grace as I learn.
I am the one that placed the Craig's list ad and was quite surprised that audiophiles look at these sites. My goal was to expose people that consider Kenwood to be high end to a world they don't realize that exists.
First off, over the years I have never heard anything but praise from the mouth of Dale Pitcher towards Shunyata. Regarding my claims in the ad. I stand by them. I have sold high end for 33 years with a very wide range of products that later became legends. Hafler, Futterman, NYAL, Lazurous, Berning, Goetz, Counterpoint, just to name a few.
I have yet to hear any amp do so many things so well hooked to so many speakers. As I stated in the ad, there are a handful of "perfect matches" that will always be the exception. My statement about "50% parts are military secrets" is a generalization. I don't know exact percentages nor do I know if some are no longer secrets now vs. 10 years ago when it was built. My statement about the parts being encapsulated in Quartz and resin for RF shielding and to prevent people stealing the design is true based on what I have been told over the years.
Anyone is welcome to email me further.
Thanks for listening.
I have never seen this site so offer me grace as I learn.
I am the one that placed the Craig's list ad and was quite surprised that audiophiles look at these sites. My goal was to expose people that consider Kenwood to be high end to a world they don't realize that exists.
First off, over the years I have never heard anything but praise from the mouth of Dale Pitcher towards Shunyata. Regarding my claims in the ad. I stand by them. I have sold high end for 33 years with a very wide range of products that later became legends. Hafler, Futterman, NYAL, Lazurous, Berning, Goetz, Counterpoint, just to name a few.
I have yet to hear any amp do so many things so well hooked to so many speakers. As I stated in the ad, there are a handful of "perfect matches" that will always be the exception. My statement about "50% parts are military secrets" is a generalization. I don't know exact percentages nor do I know if some are no longer secrets now vs. 10 years ago when it was built. My statement about the parts being encapsulated in Quartz and resin for RF shielding and to prevent people stealing the design is true based on what I have been told over the years.
Anyone is welcome to email me further.
Thanks for listening.
Hi Duane,
I didn't realize that was your ad that got imported here; it's been a long time since we spoke. I made no claim in my post related to anything Dale may or may not have said about us to others, so no need to mention or defend that. My interest in responding was to correct Myles' quoted report that the Hydra was anything other than Caelin's original design. Our long product history and the his related patents should confirm that. Dale designed and produced the original chassis-- which as many commented, was a one of a kind work of art. Certainly, that helped identify the product in the marketplace and contributed to the original model's success. I've owned Essence products, pre-amp and amps, and know them to be exceptional, so sometimes we all have to ignore the fuss from those that are not aware of them and react only to what's written.
My earlier comments were not meant to imply that anything was stolen from Caelin, nor from us as a company by Dale. It wasn't. Nor am I implying that there is anything wrong with the way his business runs. We haven't worked with Dale for some 13 years, so I'm out of the loop there. He appears to have had continued success, so there's obviously sound business practice there or that wouldn't be the case in this economy. Our two companies did go different ways in 2001 over a matter related to intellectual properties, materials and their use and sale, which is not uncommon in this business. The matter was resolved and we both moved on. My brief characterization was unfairly stated and in hindsight, it should not have been mentioned. I understand why you, or others who commented, including Dale, would take offense to that oblique reference. I apologize for the poorly worded comments. Normally, I'm sharper than that, so it was not one of my more lucid moments.
Call when you get the chance, Duane. I hope all is well with you.
Grant
This forum has gone in a lot of different directions, and I look forward to addressing a few posts.
Since I know this amplifier inside-out, I can give you a fairly accurate description of the concepts, materials and technology that led to its' development.
First, let me address the post that led to this thread - "The best amps ever made". I might have phrased that "One of the better solid state amplifiers made in the Midwest" - I'm not into bravado. That aside, I do feel that this product featured a number of concepts and innovations not previously addressed by the industry. So here is some information about this product.
The Series III Amplifiers were companion products to the Jasper and Jasper Reference Preamplifiers ($9850 and $16,850) and featured many of the same concepts and technologies. While 27 of the preamps were made, only 8 of the amplifiers were completed; 5 - Emerald III Stereos @$28,500, 1 - Jasper III Stereo @ $48,500 and 2 pair of the Jasper III Mono Blocks @ $68,500. Although we had geared up to produce many more amplifiers, we only built 8. The reason for this is two-fold:
1) The amplifier was based on deceptively simple circuitry, with very little feedback. It exhibited an extremely wide bandwidth. It is relatively easy to make an amplifier stable - just add feed-back. Anyone that has experience in circuit design can tell you that designing a wide-band amplifier with little or no feedback can be quite a challenge. While we had geared up to build these amps on a production line, they ended up being so difficult to build that all 8 were built in my lab - with three of us getting them to work.
2) I micro-managed the production on both the Gen III Amplifiers and the Preamplifiers, looking over people's shoulders a lot of the time - especially on the amplifiers (which we were still figuring out). In hindsight, this proved to be a serious mistake on my part. I was backpacking - picked up a tick - and contracted Lyme Disease. For the next year, I was only able to be at work about 2 hours each day - so this project, and for that matter Essence Electro Acoustics as well, just sort of wilted. I was driven to try to bring the company back for years when I should have just let it go.
Well, I know you probably all have tears in your eyes at this point, so back to the amp.
The amplifier gain stages were designed by Jeff Polan. Jeff's real job was designing sonar circuitry. He is one of the smartest people I've ever met. I regret that I have not publically given him the appropriate amount of credit due to him for his contribution in the design of these amplifiers.
The amplifier topology is Bi Polar Semiconductor - Class AB, highly biased in Class A. It is an exceptionally simple circuit, but requires a very high grade of components for it to be stable. An example of this are the resistors - oil-bath bulk foil @ .1% tolerance with 2ppm temperature co-efficients (did I spell that right). Even the 10 Watt emmitter resistors are constructed out of these components (thats a lot of money).
All semiconductors were burned in, and then curve-traced at full current to match the Beta gains. Curve-trace matching under full load is one of the easiest ways for an amplifier manufacturer to turn a really good product into an exceptional product.
All electrical parts and most mechanical parts were then deep cryo treated twice. No ferrous materials were used anywhere in the amplifiers.
The quartz-cast power supply for these amplifiers had several innovations:
The electrolytic capacitors had a unique topology. Electrolytic capacitors (except Black Gates [not technically electrolytics] - which are superior in every way) typically have very high ESR (resistance) and ESL (inductance). This means that at higher frequencies the behavior is closer to an inductor than a capacitor. We took apart a few capacitors, and devised some innovations. We sent out blueprints to several capacitor houses. Only one - Mepco Electra, would build them. Measurably, they were far better than any we had tested, and sonically we felt they were a lot better.
The grounding scheme for the amplifiers took a long time for us to figure out - well beyond the typical star-center system. The Litz bundles were different for each "load" they were referenced to. All of these were referenced to a central silent ground pool through Faraday shield assemblies and devices that were precursors to my current work in the Theorem Suspension Bridge - the power conditioner that I am currently working on (this will sell for about $20,000 - I hope to have units out yet this year).
Many stages were cast in Quartz to provide a mechanical mass that could then be vibrationally isolated, and then mechanically grounded into "loads". The aspects of vibration isolation and mechnical grounding were highly addressed in this product.
That's a short overview of this amplifier. If anyone is interested in further information, feel free to e-mail me @ mosaicaudio@yahoo.com.
One last thing: All Essence products are long out of warranty. I will be glad to help anyone that has developed an issue with an Essence speaker, or for that matter, wants to know ways to make them even better. I am not in a position to repair any Essence electronics, however. I have sent Alpha Tech in St. Louis; schematics, matched devices and power supplies for testing. They have repaired several pieces of electronics, including Preamplifiers and Generation III amplifiers. Depending on the complexity of the repair issue, it has cost people anywhere from $300 to $1500 to bring these products back on line.
I hope this answers most of the questions on this post.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
Since I know this amplifier inside-out, I can give you a fairly accurate description of the concepts, materials and technology that led to its' development.
First, let me address the post that led to this thread - "The best amps ever made". I might have phrased that "One of the better solid state amplifiers made in the Midwest" - I'm not into bravado. That aside, I do feel that this product featured a number of concepts and innovations not previously addressed by the industry. So here is some information about this product.
The Series III Amplifiers were companion products to the Jasper and Jasper Reference Preamplifiers ($9850 and $16,850) and featured many of the same concepts and technologies. While 27 of the preamps were made, only 8 of the amplifiers were completed; 5 - Emerald III Stereos @$28,500, 1 - Jasper III Stereo @ $48,500 and 2 pair of the Jasper III Mono Blocks @ $68,500. Although we had geared up to produce many more amplifiers, we only built 8. The reason for this is two-fold:
1) The amplifier was based on deceptively simple circuitry, with very little feedback. It exhibited an extremely wide bandwidth. It is relatively easy to make an amplifier stable - just add feed-back. Anyone that has experience in circuit design can tell you that designing a wide-band amplifier with little or no feedback can be quite a challenge. While we had geared up to build these amps on a production line, they ended up being so difficult to build that all 8 were built in my lab - with three of us getting them to work.
2) I micro-managed the production on both the Gen III Amplifiers and the Preamplifiers, looking over people's shoulders a lot of the time - especially on the amplifiers (which we were still figuring out). In hindsight, this proved to be a serious mistake on my part. I was backpacking - picked up a tick - and contracted Lyme Disease. For the next year, I was only able to be at work about 2 hours each day - so this project, and for that matter Essence Electro Acoustics as well, just sort of wilted. I was driven to try to bring the company back for years when I should have just let it go.
Well, I know you probably all have tears in your eyes at this point, so back to the amp.
The amplifier gain stages were designed by Jeff Polan. Jeff's real job was designing sonar circuitry. He is one of the smartest people I've ever met. I regret that I have not publically given him the appropriate amount of credit due to him for his contribution in the design of these amplifiers.
The amplifier topology is Bi Polar Semiconductor - Class AB, highly biased in Class A. It is an exceptionally simple circuit, but requires a very high grade of components for it to be stable. An example of this are the resistors - oil-bath bulk foil @ .1% tolerance with 2ppm temperature co-efficients (did I spell that right). Even the 10 Watt emmitter resistors are constructed out of these components (thats a lot of money).
All semiconductors were burned in, and then curve-traced at full current to match the Beta gains. Curve-trace matching under full load is one of the easiest ways for an amplifier manufacturer to turn a really good product into an exceptional product.
All electrical parts and most mechanical parts were then deep cryo treated twice. No ferrous materials were used anywhere in the amplifiers.
The quartz-cast power supply for these amplifiers had several innovations:
The electrolytic capacitors had a unique topology. Electrolytic capacitors (except Black Gates [not technically electrolytics] - which are superior in every way) typically have very high ESR (resistance) and ESL (inductance). This means that at higher frequencies the behavior is closer to an inductor than a capacitor. We took apart a few capacitors, and devised some innovations. We sent out blueprints to several capacitor houses. Only one - Mepco Electra, would build them. Measurably, they were far better than any we had tested, and sonically we felt they were a lot better.
The grounding scheme for the amplifiers took a long time for us to figure out - well beyond the typical star-center system. The Litz bundles were different for each "load" they were referenced to. All of these were referenced to a central silent ground pool through Faraday shield assemblies and devices that were precursors to my current work in the Theorem Suspension Bridge - the power conditioner that I am currently working on (this will sell for about $20,000 - I hope to have units out yet this year).
Many stages were cast in Quartz to provide a mechanical mass that could then be vibrationally isolated, and then mechanically grounded into "loads". The aspects of vibration isolation and mechnical grounding were highly addressed in this product.
That's a short overview of this amplifier. If anyone is interested in further information, feel free to e-mail me @ mosaicaudio@yahoo.com.
One last thing: All Essence products are long out of warranty. I will be glad to help anyone that has developed an issue with an Essence speaker, or for that matter, wants to know ways to make them even better. I am not in a position to repair any Essence electronics, however. I have sent Alpha Tech in St. Louis; schematics, matched devices and power supplies for testing. They have repaired several pieces of electronics, including Preamplifiers and Generation III amplifiers. Depending on the complexity of the repair issue, it has cost people anywhere from $300 to $1500 to bring these products back on line.
I hope this answers most of the questions on this post.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
Mr. Pitcher,
I remember the Audiogon ad on the Jasper monoblocs. The seller touted the amount of capacitance in the power supply.
I believe he said the amps would play for 2 minutes, after being unplugged.
Is this true?
Thanks!
I remember the Audiogon ad on the Jasper monoblocs. The seller touted the amount of capacitance in the power supply.
I believe he said the amps would play for 2 minutes, after being unplugged.
Is this true?
Thanks!
Hi Daniel,
The power supplies in all Essence amps were very large, even by todays' standards. Most of the stereo amps would play at full level for about 40 seconds. In the larger mono blocks, it was close to two minutes.
I'd have to go back to my documentation on the Gen III mono blocks. The DC servo stage in the feedback loop must be fully powered at all times when the amp is in operation or things will go crazy. In fact, we incorporated a DC offset monitoring circuit that - if it were to sense DC at the output more than .005 VDC - would put the amp in mute, disconnect input power and engage relays that were connected to high power resistor arrays across the energy storage capacitors. This system would bleed the power supply almost completely down within 2 to 3 seconds, and then disengage. If there were issues in the driver or output stages the power fuse would blow. If the power fuse was blown, the user would need to contact us. If not, they would then switch the amp back to off and recycle the switch back to operate. If the amplifier sensed excessive DC offset in the signal input from the preamp, it would not fire-up.
All of that is to say that the Gen III may have had circuitry incorporated in it that would instantly mute the amplifier if it was switched off or unpluged.
This post reminds me that a great deal of credit is due to Sam Lord. We designed the DC sensing and power-down circuitry together. I would describe what needed to be achieved, possible issues and a few suggestions. He ran with this and designed the circuitry – and we did troubleshooting together.
Hope this answers your questions.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
The power supplies in all Essence amps were very large, even by todays' standards. Most of the stereo amps would play at full level for about 40 seconds. In the larger mono blocks, it was close to two minutes.
I'd have to go back to my documentation on the Gen III mono blocks. The DC servo stage in the feedback loop must be fully powered at all times when the amp is in operation or things will go crazy. In fact, we incorporated a DC offset monitoring circuit that - if it were to sense DC at the output more than .005 VDC - would put the amp in mute, disconnect input power and engage relays that were connected to high power resistor arrays across the energy storage capacitors. This system would bleed the power supply almost completely down within 2 to 3 seconds, and then disengage. If there were issues in the driver or output stages the power fuse would blow. If the power fuse was blown, the user would need to contact us. If not, they would then switch the amp back to off and recycle the switch back to operate. If the amplifier sensed excessive DC offset in the signal input from the preamp, it would not fire-up.
All of that is to say that the Gen III may have had circuitry incorporated in it that would instantly mute the amplifier if it was switched off or unpluged.
This post reminds me that a great deal of credit is due to Sam Lord. We designed the DC sensing and power-down circuitry together. I would describe what needed to be achieved, possible issues and a few suggestions. He ran with this and designed the circuitry – and we did troubleshooting together.
Hope this answers your questions.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
I have never said that any of my products have 50% military secrets, nor do I recall ever claiming that they contain any military secrets at all. But the products have had the benefit of a fair amount of military and AeroSpace input. I go into some of the ways I have able to obtain special materials and technologies in the following post.
And no, I am not a "presumably ex-militay EE". I was working toward a major in Marine Biology. I had owned a high end audio store from 1972-1974. We carried IMF, Tannoy, Crown, Stax, Transcriptors, EPI and various other good brands for that time. I liked a number of other brands; Radford, Quad, ARC - etc; but they were tied up with another store. In 1973 I built several pair of speakers. The first of these was a 20" diameter concrete sphere with a 10" Tannoy coaxial driver in it. It didn't sound that great. Later in the year, I started work on what became the Essence 8a which heavily borrowed from: IMF (I loved the Monitor III) which had kits at that time, and an Audionics speaker. Both used the KEF B139. Interest in the 8a convinced me to quit college and go into audio full time.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
And no, I am not a "presumably ex-militay EE". I was working toward a major in Marine Biology. I had owned a high end audio store from 1972-1974. We carried IMF, Tannoy, Crown, Stax, Transcriptors, EPI and various other good brands for that time. I liked a number of other brands; Radford, Quad, ARC - etc; but they were tied up with another store. In 1973 I built several pair of speakers. The first of these was a 20" diameter concrete sphere with a 10" Tannoy coaxial driver in it. It didn't sound that great. Later in the year, I started work on what became the Essence 8a which heavily borrowed from: IMF (I loved the Monitor III) which had kits at that time, and an Audionics speaker. Both used the KEF B139. Interest in the 8a convinced me to quit college and go into audio full time.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
Last edited:
"Military Secrets"
Well, one more post, and I have to get back to work.
This addresses the “50% military secret??!” post earlier in this thread.
Very early on (1973 – I was 18) in my audio career (?) - when I was designing my first Essence speaker (the 8a), I had a lot of help from Bob Eckles. He was an engineering student at that time. He later provided much knowledge and insight into the first amplifiers Essence built – around 1978. We experimented with several different types of filters – 2nd and 3rd orders; even a sixth order Gaussian, as I recall. We settled on first order Butterworth, and I have used this topology ever since. He introduced me to some of the engineering help that the university could provide.
It became quite apparent to me that if I was ever able to master anything in this field that I would have to tap into people that were a lot smarter than me. When I developed questions, I chased around till I found someone who could answer it. They would often asked why I was trying to do it this way – heres' a better way. They supplied me other contacts. This snow-balled to the point that I was probably paying out $400 to $500 every month in phone bills – a lot of that international calls. I wasn’t that smart – just tenacious.
Some of these events put me in touch with people that were, in my view, brilliant (Jeff Polan is one). Some of these became collaborators with me in developing new products. I ended up with a lot of aerospace and military companies and contacts – which also brought with it materials. I also started going to NASA Technology Transfer conferences.
I’ll give one example of creating a "secret". We used film/foil capacitors from Component Research Corporation, but with all OFHC leads and non-metalic housings. I visited the factory on a couple of occasions and met Dave Kellerman, the president of the company at that time. He took time to sit down with me, and after we discussed the type of products we were really looking for, said He would get back to me. A few weeks later a box arrived from him with capacitors. I tried them out. They were a LOT better than the film/foil Teflon capacitors we had been using. When I called Dave, he would only say – they are not Teflon, I won’t tell you what they are, but there is a special coating involved. Several months later we had an electrical damping issue. I called Dave and asked him if there was any way that he could supply us with a little bit of his coating to try. He said no, but said “Heres' a company you might want to check out.” The company turned out to be a manufacturer of aerospace coatings – I still use some of their products. And no, I won’t tell you the name of the company.
Is this a top military secret? Of course not – anybody with a search engine could figure out a number of companies that might supply similar coatings today, but then they would have to wade through a bunch of different coatings to figure out which ones’ would work for their applications.
I have had the fortune to find a number of these suppliers over the years. If you search long enough and experiment long enough they will they will be your secret too.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
Well, one more post, and I have to get back to work.
This addresses the “50% military secret??!” post earlier in this thread.
Very early on (1973 – I was 18) in my audio career (?) - when I was designing my first Essence speaker (the 8a), I had a lot of help from Bob Eckles. He was an engineering student at that time. He later provided much knowledge and insight into the first amplifiers Essence built – around 1978. We experimented with several different types of filters – 2nd and 3rd orders; even a sixth order Gaussian, as I recall. We settled on first order Butterworth, and I have used this topology ever since. He introduced me to some of the engineering help that the university could provide.
It became quite apparent to me that if I was ever able to master anything in this field that I would have to tap into people that were a lot smarter than me. When I developed questions, I chased around till I found someone who could answer it. They would often asked why I was trying to do it this way – heres' a better way. They supplied me other contacts. This snow-balled to the point that I was probably paying out $400 to $500 every month in phone bills – a lot of that international calls. I wasn’t that smart – just tenacious.
Some of these events put me in touch with people that were, in my view, brilliant (Jeff Polan is one). Some of these became collaborators with me in developing new products. I ended up with a lot of aerospace and military companies and contacts – which also brought with it materials. I also started going to NASA Technology Transfer conferences.
I’ll give one example of creating a "secret". We used film/foil capacitors from Component Research Corporation, but with all OFHC leads and non-metalic housings. I visited the factory on a couple of occasions and met Dave Kellerman, the president of the company at that time. He took time to sit down with me, and after we discussed the type of products we were really looking for, said He would get back to me. A few weeks later a box arrived from him with capacitors. I tried them out. They were a LOT better than the film/foil Teflon capacitors we had been using. When I called Dave, he would only say – they are not Teflon, I won’t tell you what they are, but there is a special coating involved. Several months later we had an electrical damping issue. I called Dave and asked him if there was any way that he could supply us with a little bit of his coating to try. He said no, but said “Heres' a company you might want to check out.” The company turned out to be a manufacturer of aerospace coatings – I still use some of their products. And no, I won’t tell you the name of the company.
Is this a top military secret? Of course not – anybody with a search engine could figure out a number of companies that might supply similar coatings today, but then they would have to wade through a bunch of different coatings to figure out which ones’ would work for their applications.
I have had the fortune to find a number of these suppliers over the years. If you search long enough and experiment long enough they will they will be your secret too.
Regards,
Dale Pitcher
Last edited:
I need to apologize for generalizing and assuming things I have heard over the years and drawing my own conclusions. I know I was not technically accurate but thought I was close. I just as often assume conservatively like claiming the retail to be $60,000 when it was $68,850.
My assumptions were often validated by others. When I was at Rocky Mountain and Dale Pitcher was talking about what he does in his audio cables , a reviewer in the room said that the gentleman that was with him was his BS meter. His friend works at Cheyenne Mountain and is a physicist for the military. The friend said that Dale Pitcher was working with the same things they are and that Dale was dead on accurate.
I guess I will only advertise on Craig's list when I am selling sex like everyone else. LOL
My assumptions were often validated by others. When I was at Rocky Mountain and Dale Pitcher was talking about what he does in his audio cables , a reviewer in the room said that the gentleman that was with him was his BS meter. His friend works at Cheyenne Mountain and is a physicist for the military. The friend said that Dale Pitcher was working with the same things they are and that Dale was dead on accurate.
I guess I will only advertise on Craig's list when I am selling sex like everyone else. LOL
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