Good to know. I am waiting on my first Gamma PC. I ordered it 6 weeks ago. Shunyata must be in demand.
Shunyata Theta/Gamma Lines - Do they surpass the Delta/Venom of the previous generation?
- Thread starter Mcbrion
- Start date
Yes, the guys at the Cable Co are excellent. Great to hear the Gamma PC for your REL is working out well for you. I haven't heard the Theta NR PCs yet, but the new Theta XLR IC is superb, using one as my main IC right now, as with my current setup presently, I only need one IC (not counting my phono stage).
Cheers.
Hi, I'm curious - have you owned Cardas Clear and / or Cardas Clear Reflection? I wonder how that would present compared to Theta XLR & Speaker. I am putting together those 3 setups.
I have Clear speaker cables and 2 pairs of Clear XLR here now.
Today, 2 pairs of Clear Reflection XLR showed up... now I need Clear Reflection speaker cables.
I'm actively looking for Theta XLR to pair with the Theta speaker cables so I can compare all 3 setups... and sort it out for what I like best.
I am trying to balance how much RESOLUTION comes thru... it's like Kelvin temperature with lighting... there is a visceral thing going on I suspect. Sometimes a little gravy makes everything taste better and I suspect one can go thru an arc of chasing extreme resolution and then coming back around the corner to a bit more relaxed delivery.
I'm trying to settle on what I will like long term, and it could be that I need keep a certain second setup around... for emergencies!
No. Before discovering Shunyata's cables, I was using Audoquest. I've only owned and used Shunyata cables since then. If you'd like to compare Shunyata's cable directly to the Cardas cables, my recommendation would be to rent in the cables you're interested in from The Cable Company, and determine for yourself the anwers to your questtions with real data in your room and system. I'll just that if Shunyata cables weren't available, I'd most likely be using Cardas.
Cheers.
Beginning in January, I began replacing either a stock power cord (power amp) or Delta NR v2 (server, DAC) on the bedroom system's active components with a Theta NR, one at a time as budget permitted. Each of the first two changes (in January and February) effected an immediate improvement in sonic performance (greater transparency, extension of perceived scale, dimensionality, and heft).Yesterday, I completed the cycle by replacing the DAC's Delta NR v2 with an already partially burned-in Theta NR. And got my socks knocked off within the first 10 seconds of David Amos conducting the London Symphony Orchestra in the first movement of Morton Gould's Folk Suite for Orchestra (Harmonia Mundi CD rip). I was breathing performance venue air in my listening position at the apex of a six-foot-sided equilateral triangle as the speakers pulled off a disappearing act like none I've heard before from this system. Yeah, the soundstage expanded, the mid-bass grunted viscerally, and there was more "there" there top to bottom. But it was the sense of being sucked into the performance that caught me most off guard. And that result was not limited to the Gould as I delved deeper into the music stored on my server's SSD.
It's an improvement that in its scope and sense of presence exceeds the already-substantial improvements achieved with the first two Theta NR PCs. I don't know whether to attribute the scale of the latest improvement to the specific mating of DAC and power cord or to what I'd call the "symmetry" of having all of the system's active components fed by Theta NRs. (Note: An Alpha XC v2 feeds the Delta D6 power distributor from the wall.) But whatever the reason, the Theta NR clearly bests the Delta NR v2 in getting "more" out of the components it feeds.
In the product lineup, the move from Delta v2 to Theta is "lateral". The scope of improvement, however, is anything but. At least in this system.
I have several pairs of Cardas Clear and Clear Reflection XLR. Cardas Clear Speaker and Theta speaker. Still getting to know all of this stuff.
The Cardas Clear speaker have been in quite a while as I really need to figure out if they are going to stick around. When I put the Theta in recently I was extremely impressed... just more and better of everything. The Cardas Clear also does magic, but I have a hunch that too much of it can almost be too much of a good thing. It can be a "different kind of magic / clarity" that can be very close to being DRY.
All of my gear is Ayre Acoustics R series (KX-R / MX-R / QX-5). So, I've been missing a pair of Shunyata Theta XLR to really get a taste of that compared to the Cardas stuff I have. Well a used pair just arrived today. I'm redoing the room setup / room treatment and the MX-Rs are out of the system, so isthe KX-R.
It's a cobbled setup. I am running direct from the QX-5 Twenty to a simple Ayre AX-7e running in Pass Thru mode (as an amp). Keeping it simple helps for this too, I suspect.
Well, this Theta XLR with the Cardas Clear Speaker... WOW. Instantly it's just "more right". It's full / musical, but with a hint of detail that is just the right amount and not fatiguing.
With some cables it seems they can trend so transparent that it creates discomfort and fatigue.
For instance, I can handle some straight up espresso...but not all the time. In the morning I make an Americano (or 3) with just a bit of half and half and 1 Truvia... I think I like my music presentation the same way.
Full bodied with just a little bit of detail sweetness.
So far, Theta = Smart Money... Big Time.
I am definitely in the market for another pair of Theta XLR... possibly longer than 1M to run to my MX-R monos because this wire may really be sticking around. If I HAD to use Theta and get rid of all Cardas, I would have no problem with that.
So, now trying to sort thru "better" with this stuff and not mistake that for just "different"... I will leave with each for a month or so and see what I miss... and what makes me forget about wire altogether.
The Cardas Clear speaker have been in quite a while as I really need to figure out if they are going to stick around. When I put the Theta in recently I was extremely impressed... just more and better of everything. The Cardas Clear also does magic, but I have a hunch that too much of it can almost be too much of a good thing. It can be a "different kind of magic / clarity" that can be very close to being DRY.
All of my gear is Ayre Acoustics R series (KX-R / MX-R / QX-5). So, I've been missing a pair of Shunyata Theta XLR to really get a taste of that compared to the Cardas stuff I have. Well a used pair just arrived today. I'm redoing the room setup / room treatment and the MX-Rs are out of the system, so isthe KX-R.
It's a cobbled setup. I am running direct from the QX-5 Twenty to a simple Ayre AX-7e running in Pass Thru mode (as an amp). Keeping it simple helps for this too, I suspect.
Well, this Theta XLR with the Cardas Clear Speaker... WOW. Instantly it's just "more right". It's full / musical, but with a hint of detail that is just the right amount and not fatiguing.
With some cables it seems they can trend so transparent that it creates discomfort and fatigue.
For instance, I can handle some straight up espresso...but not all the time. In the morning I make an Americano (or 3) with just a bit of half and half and 1 Truvia... I think I like my music presentation the same way.
Full bodied with just a little bit of detail sweetness.
So far, Theta = Smart Money... Big Time.
I am definitely in the market for another pair of Theta XLR... possibly longer than 1M to run to my MX-R monos because this wire may really be sticking around. If I HAD to use Theta and get rid of all Cardas, I would have no problem with that.
So, now trying to sort thru "better" with this stuff and not mistake that for just "different"... I will leave with each for a month or so and see what I miss... and what makes me forget about wire altogether.
Last edited:
What is the timing for publishing your review of the Gamma line?
Not sure yet, just about to submit it to the folks at Shunyata for the review fact check. It could be a month or so before it goes live. I'll post back here when it's up.
Your results of the Theta sound promising. I wonder how a full Theta loom, phono, ICs, speaker cables, and power would sound.
Are you doing any reviews of the Alpha or Sigma X lines. It seems as if no one has reviewed the new Sigma X QR. That would be very interesting.
Any comments or thoughts on how the theta speaker cables fit in here? Are they pushing too much towards resolution and potentially short term wow factor or easy to live with.
I have a set of TQ Black II that I'm looking to replace with either the theta or audience au24 but I'm unable to demo either due to requiring custom lengths (4m) so it's a bit of a gamble either way... Or finding out the hard way that the rest of the system has been voiced around the TQ as they have been part of my system for 3 years
Full disclosure: I have never heard Thetacables, and I am familiar with Audience and have a dealer friend who is very keen on the Audience brand. They are excellent cables. That said this dealer friend of mine was sent a full loom of Cerious Technologies’s loom cables and he chose to bring the line in as an alternative claiming he’d never heard anything sound quite as good.
I personally have the full loom in my system and suffice to say for me it represented a game changer, particularly the power cords and specifically with digital gear, and also of course, the speaker cables, which were significantly better in every respect than the Nordost Heimdall cables I have been using. And your point about customization, he absolutely can customize.
Graphene Lumniscate – Speaker Cables – Cerious Technologies
cerioustech.com
I have sold the Cardas Clear - multiple XLR pairs and Speaker.
I still have Cardas Clear Reflection XLR in 1.5m and 3.5m. I want to play more with the Clear Reflection and it is working well even with Theta as I've also mixed in. And the Cardas 3.5m length I snagged is a unique length I could do something creative with. I may also have it re-terminated and share with another friend who wants some. I think Clear Reflection is better than Clear, for me. #1 choice is Theta.
~ I have used Theta speaker & XLR with QX-5 Twenty direct to MX-R Twenty. I want for nothing.
~ I have used Theta speaker & XLR & with QX-5 Twenty direct to Pass Labs XA30.8. Same.
~ I have used Theta speaker & XLR with QX-5 Twenty to Pass Labs XA200.5, which I traded my MX-R Twenty amps for. (That is another story that I am very happy with the result of). Very fortunate to have that opportunity and the XA200.5 are very special things.
~ I have used Theta speaker & XLR via adapters (yeah...) to First Watt SIT-3 amp, which is single ended input only.
Theta sounds fuller in mid-bass and just more "right". I told friends it sounds "Analog". Ease, no grain, detail when you don't think it is capable of sprinkling detail in because the mid-bass / midrange as sooo good. However, I think it is more about the XLR than speaker cables. I will share what I mean by that after sharing this.
I am building a pair of Duelund Coherent Audio Monitors. Tony Gee did the design. They will be my special, similar speaker to my Wilson Audio Duette that have the custom crossovers Danny did. I and a good friend are each building pairs. I plan to wire the speakers / build the crossovers with Duelund wire and thought it would be fun and certainly appropriate to try that wire with Duelund drivers. The crossovers will have Duelund parts. So I bought Duelund tin copper, oiled cotton wire in 16ga, 12ga, and 10ga. Tin-plated Stranded Copper
Well, I just had to test the Duelund stuff right? - so I left the Theta XLR in and swapped out the Theta speaker with Duelund Dual DCA12GA Series 2x12 awg, Tin-plated Stranded Copper wire. The oiled cotton wire. At first it was a bit grainy and edgy... but then... after about a week (as I recall) things started to ease and I was just as happy with Theta XLR and Duelund 12 ga wire for speaker. (Music is play about 8 hours per day on the system, no kidding. Music is always on in our home. I will also try the Duelund 10ga and expect great things as well. I am very happy with how that turned out. Even so, I will keep the Theta speaker cables. I need to continue to live with those, and I think I will always like them. No sense in selling them and I would like to think I cannot lose either way. I could be ignorant, but I'm happy!
If I had to choose between buying Theta interconnects or speakers cables first because of expense, I would buy interconnects first before the speaker cables. I'd use Duelund wire and maybe end up pretty happy for a long time. I consider that a good thing, not bad - my goal is to Be Happy.
Also of note IMO, because I think some things hint to other things, could be telling in some ways.
Shunyata cables fit, finish, and overall quality is much better than Cardas. It is a frustrating thing to receive even "Demo" Cardas Clear with print smudged down the entire length. I knew it was "Demo", I didn't think it was going to be "dragged down the hall on carpet" in appearance. It is also frustrating when you seem to care more about that than the people who make it. Disappointed to be told "most people just wipe the cable with Acetone to remove with print." Well, why bother with it then? Leave it off and put a band somewhere near one of the cable... like Shunyata does. I like at least trying my best to keep things nice and these are special things. This is serious money being spent, and they need to do better - period, IMO. I wish manufacturers weren't complacent about thinking it's OK to send something like that out without at least giving someone a heads-up. "Get the order, ship it, done with that one..." I like Cardas and the people there, but I think they have room to improve on that issue. I will leave "Cardas" at that. If Cardas Clear is George's Most Enduring Achievement, do a better job of protecting that achievement for years to come. Conversations were had about this, it seemed like something was going to be done about it, but the loose end was never tied up. It was just as well. I think Theta is better and I will leave it at that.
It is frustrating to type that, I like those people - but "If you aren't coaching it, you are letting it happen". And the money goes elsewhere... SERIOUS MONEY goes elsewhere.
Bottom line for Theta, I mentioned to a buddy that "Theta has made me stop thinking about cables." I was thinking about cables, a lot... because various cables I've tried were doing things to make me think about them. Not anymore.
Well, I guess I am still thinking about cables... I am probably competing with several of you lunatics (I am too) for good deals on more! Even at SRP, it's a fraction of Clear. I am not buying on price... but it's great to have a WIN-WIN, and it seems to me that is exactly the point Caelin had for Theta... performance that betters cables at multiples of their price.
That is exactly what I have experienced.
I think this is also notable about Shunyata Research, in general. Those guys are Pros. Period. I guess I'm not bad at making friends and I reached out to them (because you don't know unless you ask). I reached out because they don't mentioned selling bulk wire. Why not? "Hey guys, I have a Line Array project going on... got any 16ga wire that I can use to wire them up, wire up the crossovers?" They will be special and I think their wire is special. I wanted some. Well, Richard and Scott at Shunyata could not have been more helpful and engaging. They thought it was a cool project and were glad to help. Chris in Ops looked thru wire and found some 16ga VTX wire in white and clear. I have 140' of that wire coming to arrive next week, along with some custom length Theta jumpers I will incorporate into the outboard crossovers.
I'm excited about this so I'll share whether people care or not.
I have a pair of Epiphany Audio 20/21 Line Arrays heading this way (hopefully soon). Danny Richie designed them years ago and has a NOS pair in Rosewood that were never assembled. 20x4" Tang Band / 21x Neo 3 planar tweeter. 7' tall. 96db. Very special. I am very excited.One last thing that may be of interest... the reason I tried Cardas and Shunyata, notwithstanding their reputations and advice from friends including Jake Forsyth at Ayre, I pay attention to things that are Patented. Different, for a reason.
How does someone sort thru hyperbole when buying cables? I would like you to tell me WHY you think it's better. Tell me about the design, as best you can as I understand there are some things that maybe can't be discussed. Anyone can write or hire something to write hyperbole. People with patents can get a description written... people without patents can't write a patent number that doesn't exist. I may very well be overlooking other options that are wonderful, and that's fine. This approach may very well be flawed, and I know guys like Nelson Pass have commented that patents can be a hassle.
Still, it appears this has worked for me, and results matter. Besides, I have to draw the line somewhere!
As for me, I am moving forward with Shunyata Research Theta wire, for everything.
What a relief this is drawing to a conclusion. (Yes Jimmy Mac, please stop rambling!
). Well, things about a passion are important. Some of you know what I mean... you're having Crazy Fun too.If this matters... current setup:
Ayre Acoustics QX-5 Twenty --> Ayre Acoustics KX-5 Twenty --> First Watt SIT-3 --> Wilson Audio Duette with custom crossovers. 1 pair Rythmik F8 subs.
I hope this is helpful to you and others. I am staying on the gas.
HAVE FUN!
Last edited:
Similar threads
 | Steve Williams Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator |  | Ron Resnick Site Owner | Administrator |  | Julian (The Fixer) Website Build | Marketing Managersing |