Receivers: They come in all flavors and prices...

WLVCA

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Nov 2, 2012
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I can vouch for the Onkyo TX-NR818 and Audyssey XT-32.

I moved a couple of months ago. My new home theater set up is in a 20 x 30 family room / kitchen with 18 foot ceilings and a terrazzo tile floor. Its also partially open to the entry hall and the living room / dining room - definitely not an ideal arrangement. My expectations were low given the room limitations.

I was stunned after I installed the equipment and ran Audyssey. It sounded much better than I had any right to expect and that's with the previous owners Bose jewel cube surrounds that are ceiling mounted - hate to admit that. :eek:

Haven't replaced the surrounds yet but, given the layout, they'll have to be in-ceiling or ceiling mounted.

Previously had an external amp connected to the Onkyo but haven't felt the need to do so to this point.
 
Feb 8, 2011
18,958
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
And furthermore Davey, you have right here all the best helpers for Audyssey to be fully optimized (best performance), including Kal, and I. :b

BTW, NAD is also a supporter of Audyssey Room Correction & EQ system. ...And NAD is into quality Sound. ...So is Marantz.
Onkyo/Integra? Absolutely!

Yamaha Aventage, Pioneer Elite? Of course, they are just more independents in some of their choices regarding DSPs, Video Processing, Auto Room EQ systems, DACs (ESS & Wolfson), etc.

* The NAD T748 uses Cirrus Logic (Crystal) DACs. ...Does it have Audyssey? I don't think so, only the higher up models.
 
Feb 8, 2011
18,958
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Davey, I just did a bit of goggling around:

* http://hometheaterreview.com/nad-t-748-av-receiver-reviewed/
{Very basic review, from only one reviewer's opinion (biased and paid), without much weight.}

* http://hometheater.about.com/od/aud...-7-1-Channel-Home-Theater-Receiver-Review.htm
{No multichannel analog input. For me, in 2013, I still want the option.}

>>> http://www.avsforum.com/t/1432959/nad-t748-problems
{I figured that the v2 must be problem-free now; but still, NAD is not reliable enough to consider their products seriously. I'm with Amir on that, and I should have mentioned this earlier. ...I did not realize that they were still stuck with issues even recently.}
 

DaveyF

Active Member
Aug 1, 2010
5,751
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38
La Jolla, Calif USA
Guys, all great info...thanks. I was not aware of the reliability issues of the NAD gear. I do think that the sound ( at least to my ears) was in the upper echelon of these receivers. I have not heard the Onkyo TX NR-818 and I will now put this on my short list. My main goal is sound quality and then secondarily the ability to support multiple sources via HDMI. I was talking this weekend to a Sony rep, who told me to look into 4K pass-through...only thing is the Sony receiver's are the only ones to offer this...and I don't like them much.
Bob, the theater system is Totally secondary to my main two-channel...NOT going to be in the same league at all. However, I think the B&W's could shine with the right front end. As you say, they are fairly inefficient, so a decent amp section is warranted. ( which is why i was looking at the NAD). The room for the theater is actually much larger than my dedicated audio room, BUT will have no room treatment ( unlike my audio room)...reason...NO WAF;) So, Audyssey might be a plus:confused:
Any thoughts on the Pioneer Elite gear?
 
Apr 3, 2010
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Seattle, WA
I have a Pioneer Elite that is powering our living room in our vacation house. Love the cool running amp. It is class-D which I think is appropriate since it provides more power for all the channels through higher efficiency. Down side is that the EQ has fixed frequency so the room correction in it is not great.

Hope to evaluate the Yamaha Avantage with similar class D amps.
 
Feb 8, 2011
18,958
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Guys, all great info...thanks. I was not aware of the reliability issues of the NAD gear. I do think that the sound ( at least to my ears) was in the upper echelon of these receivers. I have not heard the Onkyo TX NR-818 and I will now put this on my short list. My main goal is sound quality and then secondarily the ability to support multiple sources via HDMI. I was talking this weekend to a Sony rep, who told me to look into 4K pass-through...only thing is the Sony receiver's are the only ones to offer this...and I don't like them much.
Bob, the theater system is Totally secondary to my main two-channel...NOT going to be in the same league at all. However, I think the B&W's could shine with the right front end. As you say, they are fairly inefficient, so a decent amp section is warranted. ( which is why i was looking at the NAD). The room for the theater is actually much larger than my dedicated audio room, BUT will have no room treatment ( unlike my audio room)...reason...NO WAF;) So, Audyssey might be a plus:confused:
Any thoughts on the Pioneer Elite gear?
1. You care about sound quality first; your main goal. ...Me too and him/her too. :b

2. Multiple HDMI inputs; Onkyo/Integra, Pioneer Elite, Marantz/Denon, Yamaha, ...they all have that.

3. 4K pass-thru ... The Onkyos were supposed to be, including the 818 I believe, but according to experts they aren't! That was a blow, an actual deceptive discovery.
BUT! I think that their newer models are now. Onkyo was aware of this and got their axe together.
- Do some quick research and you shall receive. ...But do not get a Sony receiver, it is not their specialty (video and 4K and front projectors are).

4. I know that your home theater is separated than your 2-channel stereo system.
And that Onkyo TX-NR818 (THX Select2 Plus certified) will take care of your B&W speakers; no worry here. ...It has the juice required (current, non-limited).
And besides, you can add an external stereo power amp (a spare one you have and like) to the front L & R preouts, if you want to experiment further.
And that NAD T748 receiver won't have anything more (power wise) than the Onkyo 818. Sound quality? The Onkyo has that in spade, and more so than the NAD! Why? Because it's for Home Theater (movies) duties, and the best sound quality for that is in that Onkyo 818 receiver (with Audyssey MultEQ XT32). Nothing like it in the NAD receiver.

5. Your home theater room consists of 5 speakers and one sub (I recommend another sub, eventually); that Onkyo 818 receiver has seven power amps, so if you're using only five of them it means less demanding requirement from the power transformer. And because it is THX Ultra2 certified it means good for rooms up to 2,000 square feet at reference level. Plus, able to drive 4 Ohm speaker loads across the front (6 Ohm rear). But this is just a rough THX guide. That receiver has all the juice necessary for your full speaker's arsenal. Also, you're going to cross them all at 80 Hz anyway. ...Add another sub to rock that room! :b ...And with XT32 it will balance that bass so superbly that you're going to be blown away. Trust me, Audyssey is a big plus, for your untreated room, and mine as well. It'll do things good for you you just won't believe! And that, is the knack! ...The smack of the matter.

6. Pioneer Elite?
- Blu-ray players; no more, they are way superceded now (Oppo, Sony, Samsung, Panasonic).
- HDTV plasmas (KURO); gone.
- Speakers; low-end but rejuvenated thanks to Andrew Jones, speaker designer extraordinary.
- Subwoofers; nil, only lower end.
- A/V receivers? ...Class D amps, their higher-end ones have always great reviews, well received praises, and their lower end ones are generally great budget value with innovative features.
--> ASR MCACC Auto Room EQ and Correction system, manually adjustable Parametric EQ, and Phase Control, plus more. ...From AIR studios at Abbey Road in London.
* Me? Class D amps, from the best experts audio reviewers, are missing some. ...But with each newer generation Pioneer is getting better and better at this.
People in Germany, they love Pioneer Elite and Yamaha Aventage AV receivers, because you can manually adjust their Parametric EQualizers from their Auto Room Correction & EQ systems (MCACC and YPAO respectively).
But now, more and more they are giving the due respect to Audyssey MultEQ XT32, about goddamn time! ...Because in the USA, in Canada, in France, in the UK, in Italy, in Japan, in Russia, in Brazil, ...they all love Audyssey MultEQ XT32. ...I'm not sure why the German audio people are so afraid of everything Automatic; probably because they trust no one else but themselves (they like to do things their way, and not being dictated).

+> Anyway Davey, I just spoke my honest mind and soul. None is better, only you are. And what is available in your area or not I don't know that.
But if you can audition or test or get a loaner, keep in mind that Onkyo TX-NR818 AV receiver (I think it's $699 at most best places), and check some of those Marantz receivers while at it, with Audyssey MultEQ XT (because XT32 starts at two grands with Marantz). And Marantz, even without THX certification has a good reputation for quality sound. But Marantz receivers at the lower end are not known for having the required power with more demanding speakers; fact.
Marantz has a newer receiver for $899, the SR5008, and with Audyssey MultEQ XT; you can check that one too. But I'm still quite confident (enough so that I would purchase it for myself) that the Onkyo TX-NR818 is more suited in all aspects of a great quality home theater sound system (high-end) at a bargain price.

You asked for it!
 
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DaveyF

Active Member
Aug 1, 2010
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La Jolla, Calif USA
Great info Bob, Many Thanks. I'm going to seek out the Onkyo NR-818. Not sure if it is still available here in the US? Seems to have been superseded by the new NR-828. However, it looks like the newer model has done away with the Audyssey MultiEQ XT32 in favor of another Audyssey suite? I'm no longer interested in the NAD...too little power and reliability issues are a concern to me.
 
Feb 8, 2011
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Great info Bob, Many Thanks. I'm going to seek out the Onkyo NR-818. Not sure if it is still available here in the US? Seems to have been superseded by the new NR-828. However, it looks like the newer model has done away with the Audyssey MultiEQ XT32 in favor of another Audyssey suite? I'm no longer interested in the NAD...too little power and reliability issues are a concern to me.
Forget it! The 828 is a major degradation over the 818. ...And you should be able to still find the 818.
Check NewEgg.com (on every Saturdays only, when everything is on sale). * Most folks paid $699 for it (brand new).
Accessories4less (A4L) is another place (and don't worry about refurb, you still have full warranty).
Anyway, that part is your job to find it. Then you can ask me. ...Or ask WLVCA up there where he got his from, and for how much.
 
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Feb 8, 2011
18,958
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Bob, I looked up the Onkyo TX NR-818 and it looks like a winner. However, it seems that it may have been superseded by the TX NR-828.
Any thoughts/impressions on this model?
Up there, just above. :b ...It only has Audyssey MultEQ, two notches down from the 818's MultEQ XT32.
 
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Feb 8, 2011
18,958
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Me I am simply and totally blown away by that Onkyo TX-NR818 AV receiver with Audyssey MultEQ XT32, ISF video certification Pro ready, THX certified (Select2 Plus), and so much more, plus excellent sound, and for only $699 (street)!
This is absolutely mind blowing, and the least expensive way to get on with the program (XT32). ...I cannot emphasize that enough.

___________________


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- Someone might have separates (SSP & mutich amp) that cost $7,000 and might not even have Audyssey at all, even less MultEQ XT32.
Or if he/she has, he/she might have 5% more better sound quality overall. ...If. ...And without Audyssey MultEQ XT32 I highly doubt it (unless Room Perfect or another great EQ system). ...Talkin' movie theater sound quality here.
 
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Feb 8, 2011
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A short Tutorial (video) on AV Receivers | For people who can use such visual info ++


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* And this one's on Audyssey's Best Mic Positioning & Calibration Setup:


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* Audyssey Calibration & EQ Demo: <<< Caution: Be Ready! >>> :b

 
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DaveyF

Active Member
Aug 1, 2010
5,751
17
38
La Jolla, Calif USA
Bob, thanks again for all the info on the NR-818. I have ordered one and it is on the way. BTW, the dealer tells me that the unit has been dis-continued, in favor of the NR-828 ( consequently, it is getting very hard to source). Apparently, Onkyo added a 4K pass-through and WiFi to the NR-828 and as you alerted me...they cheapened up on everything else! No more Audyssey MultiEQ32! I'm a little concerned that the 4K passthrough is not on the NR-818, but I think I can get around that with the 4K upscaling that is included.Everything else about the NR-818 seems to be top-notch.
 
Feb 8, 2011
18,958
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Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
Davey,

1. You need eagle's eyes and a large screen (projector screen) to be able to distinguish the 818's 4K not 100% pass-thru. ...It's not night and day.
2. Onkyo do claim 4K pass-through for the 818, but video expert people, with expensive video instrumentation, found out that it wasn't the case.
3. It won't affect you in any way, so don't sweat it.

4. The 828 is so disappointing, audio wise (just Audyssey MultEQ; not even XT, and even less XT32), that it's best to not even think about it!
5. Wi-Fi, what's that? ...Is it a life changer? ;)

Davey, I forgot, what type of display is in your home theater room? Is it a large screen (more than 100") with 4K Ultra High Definition (resolution)?
And what video source (your main one) are you using there. ...Cable TV with less than VHS picture quality?

* You do know that if you have an Oppo Universal BD player you use one of its HDMI output directly to your display (4K, 3D, and all) for pristine picture quality (100% perfect pass-thru and all), and the other HDMI output directly to the 818 for pristine sound quality, right?
...And the same for a Sony BD player with two HDMI outputs (4K, 3D), that cost no more than $200. ...Got the picture now?

____________________

You are going to have fun with that 818. :b ...Be prepared to jump in another brand new world, much improved over the last one.
 

DaveyF

Active Member
Aug 1, 2010
5,751
17
38
La Jolla, Calif USA
Bob, that's interesting about the 4K pass through. I'm going to be using the Onkyo with my 50" Pioneer plasma...which is by no means a 4K TV. OTOH, I happen to really like the old dear:rolleyes: I think the Pioneer has a better picture than most of the newer 1080p LED sets...but not as good as the 4K TV's.
Since the old dear may be on her last legs ( I hope not) ...my upgrade path would be to 4K or, depending on price, oled. I really do appreciate you turning my thoughts around in regards to the NAD piece...it would NOT have had the power to drive the B&W's and the reliability issue was definitely a concern.
I did know about the Oppo and other two HDMI output players, however...If and when there is 4K programming from the cable co's...this is a potential concern,( no 4k pass through).BTW, do tell us what you are currently using for HT? I'm sure it must be really good.
 
Nah, I'm using everything low-end.

Integra 80.3 pre, Rotel multich amps, Oppo 103, Image & Paradigm speakers, Def Tech subs, Sammy 60" (3D) plasma.

________________

Yes, a BD player (with 4K true pass-thru) with two HDMI outputs (Oppo, Sony, Panasonic, Samsung) makes your receiver's 4K pass-thru totally irrelevant. Besides, your Kuro is no 4K, no 3D, and only a small 50" TV.

EDIT: {Your cable box, just plug it into one of Oppo's two HDMI inputs.} ...Like I said, 4K pass-thru is totally superfluous in a receiver.
And besides, it'll take a very long time till we get the stuff. It most likely will start from Internet Ultra HD video downloading, another eternity from now! And forget physical software (Blu-ray), it is already imprinted in the tomb's stone.


You want the best for your situation; it has already been ordered and on its way (818). :b
And that is what this thread is all about.

P.S. Today's Panasonic plasma HDTVs (65") cost much less than your Kuro 50" and beats it in everything, even equals its black level!
Time perhaps to get on with the 3D program and all that new video jazz. :b
 
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DaveyF

Active Member
Aug 1, 2010
5,751
17
38
La Jolla, Calif USA
Nah, I'm using everything low-end.

Integra 80.3 pre, Rotel multich amps, Oppo 103, Image & Paradigm speakers, Def Tech subs, Sammy 60" (3D) plasma.

________________

Yes, a BD player (with 4K true pass-thru) with two HDMI outputs (Oppo, Sony, Panasonic, Samsung) makes your receiver's 4K pass-thru totally irrelevant. Besides, your Kuro is no 4K, no 3D, and only a small 50" TV.

You want the best for your situation; it has already been ordered and on its way (818). :b
And that is what this thread is all about.

P.S. Today's Panasonic plasma HDTVs (65") cost much less than your Kuro 50" and beats it in everything, even equals its black level!
Time perhaps to get on with the 3D program and all that new video jazz. :b
I'm not so sure that today's Panasonic beats my Pioneer. ( Although I think they are from the same engineering team). OTOH, the Sony 4K that I was looking at last night sure does. The price of the Panasonic is IMO a steal...it sure beats most of the LED's and LCD's out there. Only problem I have found with Plasma is the energy usage....mine sucks juice from the wall like nobody's biz....local power Co. loves me:rolleyes:
 
I'm not so sure that today's Panasonic beats my Pioneer.
I do. :b

... The price of the Panasonic is IMO a steal...it sure beats most of the LED's and LCD's out there.
You got that right; absolutely agree with you.

Only problem I have found with Plasma is the energy usage....mine sucks juice from the wall like nobody's biz....local power Co. loves me:rolleyes:
Today's newer plasmas are more efficient than yesterday's Kuros. Are you going to cry for paying roughly $25 more a year for today's newer plasma sets versus LCD LED sets?

P.S. You're off topic, this is a Receivers thread. ;)
 

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