More on the Q5s

[Jeff Fritz]

Again my experience with Q5 revealed exemplary bass response. It does require a hefty well designed amplifier.

I think it has to be said that if you are accustomed to hugely humped-up bass, and then you hear more linear bass, it may leave the impression that something is missing. However, what it really means is that something was added, but that the "added" something is preferable to you. The latter is not high-fidelity.

I can say this after doing many, many in-room measurements and calibrating my expectations to more linear response (which I had in spades with the Rockports).

 

[Robert]

The Q5 does not have the most cohesive, lowest, or weightiest bass. It does other things admirably well. In my opinion, the bass was not what I would want for a speaker north of $50k. If you like the speaker, then great. But I don't see why there is a need to rationalize or intellectualize the sound. It just is what it is.

 

[JackD201]

I've been invited to evaluate a pair next tuesday. I'll report in afterwards.

 

[Jeff Fritz]

The Q5 does not have the most cohesive, lowest, or weightiest bass. It does other things admirably well. In my opinion, the bass was not what I would want for a speaker north of $50k. If you like the speaker, then great. But I don't see why there is a need to rationalize or intellectualize the sound. It just is what it is.

I have not heard the Q5 extensively, but I have heard the Q3 as I stated, and it had superb bass.

But I'm trying to understand your point of reference. So, compared to what? Based on what?

The Stereophile Q5 measurements show it down, quasi-anechoically, -5dB at 20Hz (very low). It also shows smooth, linear FR, meaning the drivers sum correctly (cohesive).

 

[Robert]

We all have different priorities for bass performance. I want to be convinced that there is an orchestra with 100 musicians on stage in front of me. To do this, it needs to be very linear and cohesive, and convey a sense of weight and proportion. Does the cello section sound 'weightier' than the 1st violin section? Does the violin section sound 'larger' than the cello section? The bass needs to go low, but not super low. I'm also not looking for 'slam' or 'fast' bass.

Like you, I have only demoed the Q5, and have not lived with a pair. Knowing how fussy bass can be to positioning and cabling, it may be possible to tune the Q5 to give the realistic bass I describe.

 

[Jeff Fritz]

Like you, I have only demoed the Q5, and have not lived with a pair. Knowing how fussy bass can be to positioning and cabling, it may be possible to tune the Q5 to give the realistic bass I describe.

I'll let you know what I think of the Q3 in my room. The room is very linear acoustically -- flat speakers stay fairly flat. And it does support deep bass. It was designed by Terry Montlick and obtained his Alpha Certification for acoustic neutrality. I use in-room measurements and other listeners (like fellow SoundStage! Network writer Randall Smith) to help confirm my setup and listening impressions. The Q3s should be on the way next week.

 

[microstrip]

(...) I want to be convinced that there is an orchestra with 100 musicians on stage in front of me. (...)

We share the same needs - but I would be happy with 99 musicians ,,,

Although bass is needed to give the sense of power I also feel that the sense of weight and proportion of the orchestra sections is a priority in classical music reproduction.

My speakers (Soundlab A1 PX) have limited measured bass response in my room - they show a sharp cut bellow 28 Hz - but as they have large area they can convey the power of a symphonic orchestra much better than other speakers with fantastic bass I hosted in my room. The 450 watts of the VTL MB750 also help a lot!

But, until today, the "The Sonus Faber" one hour demo at our distributor was the best example I ever had of weight and proportion of the orchestra sections.

 

[LL21]

Hi Microstrip,

Although i am no longer an SF owner (traded my Strads in recently), i am curious to know more about the SF one-hour demo you refer to...was this the Fenice?

 

[Robert]

- but I would be happy with 99 musicians ,,,

One benchmark for conveying a large performance is Mahler #8 by Tennstedt. While some performances use 900ish musicians, I believe Tennstedt 'only' used 500ish. But for this type of recording that already has an unprecedented scale, more really is less. While I have too many Mahler 8s, this one is among the most musicial, exciting, and emotional, and in my opinion, the best recorded of the bunch. The singing is gorgeous from everyone.

Another favorite big piece is Wagner's Gotterdamerung, Act II, by Solti. HOLY CRAP that's big. When I play it for people, they are just in shock. Perhaps one of the best moments of recorded history.

So many good things to hear, so little time...

 

[LL21]

Wow! i did not know this...i had heard of both pieces of course, but never actually heard them. funny thing is i got Solti's Gotterdamerung as a gift and not being an opera fan, left it in the classical section on my shelf...guess what i'll be playing in a minute? i will have to go find Mahler...never listen to Mahler before, so will be good education.

 

[LL21]

another one is Pie Jesu from JOhn Rutter and Turtle Creek Choir...REference REcordings...Smokes!!! that is breathtaking on a full range system...

 

[Robert]

Lloyd,

Solti's Ring cycle deserves my vote for the greatest recording of all time. I have a half-dozen ring cycles, and the singing and sonics here are stellar. Highlights include the entire first act of Walkure, with some of the most beautiful and sensitive singing by Regine Crespin I have ever heard.

For Gotterdamerung, try the 3rd disc, #5, with Hagen calling out the townsfolk with the Wagnerian horns. And also go to the death of Siegfried and funeral march on the 4th disc, #10-11.

 

[LL21]

great!!! i will play them later tonite! thanks!

 

[audioguy]

Like you, I have only demoed the Q5, and have not lived with a pair. Knowing how fussy bass can be to positioning and cabling, it may be possible to tune the Q5 to give the realistic bass I describe.

You left off the most important component: The room. Not just positioning in the room but the room itself. Great speakers in a less than great room = less than great speaker.

Michael Fremer didn't like the Q5 bass because his reference were the Maxx's in much too small a room with a mild bass hump.

As Jeff Fritz noted, unless an individual has lived with accurate bass, he may not like it when he hears it. In my days of installing digital room correction systems that had the ability to provide incredibly accurate bass, MANY prospective users were taken back and wanted to know where the bass was.

I've never heard that Q5 but I would take any reference to lack of/incoherent bass with a very small grain of sand --- very small -- until such time as I heard them in a spectacular room (and I should be able to do that sometime in March).

That said, not everyone will like the speaker even in the perfect room.

 

[MylesBAstor]

You left off the most important component: The room. Not just positioning in the room but the room itself. Great speakers in a less than great room = less than great speaker.

Michael Fremer didn't like the Q5 bass because his reference were the Maxx's in much too small a room with a mild bass hump.

As Jeff Fritz noted, unless an individual has lived with accurate bass, he may not like it when he hears it. In my days of installing digital room correction systems that had the ability to provide incredibly accurate bass, MANY prospective users were taken back and wanted to know where the bass was.

I've never heard that Q5 but I would take any reference to lack of/incoherent bass with a very small grain of sand --- very small -- until such time as I heard them in a spectacular room (and I should be able to do that sometime in March).

That said, not everyone will like the speaker even in the perfect room.

Have you ever been to Michael's room and listened to his system? Come to think of it, have you heard the Q5s?


There might be a reason that Alon made changes to the speakers since the Q5s.

Otherwise it's pure conjecture.

 

[Robert]

Actually, the room was among the best in the US (Goodwins in MA). And the amps should be among the best for bass (Boulder 2050). But I am admitting that cables may possibly make the difference to close the gap.

Magico tends to pair their speakers with several $100ks of components and cabling at shows. Just add-up that MIT cabling. Who uses cables more expensive that speakers? And the Solution amp and preamp retail for $80k. So, whether the Q3 has superb bass for Jeff's review is not a forgone conclusion.

 

[mep]

Who uses cables more expensive that speakers?

That would be Nicholas-see earlier threads on the forum.

 

[MylesBAstor]

That would be Nicholas-see earlier threads on the forum.

Well actually the speaker cables that I use are equal to or close to the price of my Martin Logan Summits eg. KS Emotion, MIT Magnum, Transparent Ref MM2 or AudioQuest K2 The Cable Research Labs are the least expensive of the group.

 

[mep]

Guess he should have said who uses speakers cables more expensive than a $54K pair of speakers to put things in better perspective.

 

[MylesBAstor]

Guess he should have said who uses speakers cables more expensive than a $54K pair of speakers to put things in better perspective.