Entreq Vibb Eaters: Isolation for the BACK of Wilson X1 upper modules!!

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#21
Interesting post & doesn't surprise me. I suspect Wilson made some advances in vibe control from the X1 => X2's...hence your different results...

I continue to find that vibration control is a major influence on superior sound. Even in cables and power. It's shocking just moving my Shunyata Typhon off my rack to the floor...it's like I broke my system...
Thanks for that...do you dampen/isolate your cables? Particularly your (new!) Opus MM2 SCs?
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
4,957
40
48
North Shore of Boston
#22
Interesting post & doesn't surprise me. I suspect Wilson made some advances in vibe control from the X1 => X2's...hence your different results...

I continue to find that vibration control is a major influence on superior sound. Even in cables and power. It's shocking just moving my Shunyata Typhon off my rack to the floor...it's like I broke my system...
John, totally agree about vibration control. You just know that Typhon needs two or three Stillpoint Ultra 5s under it.:D And I wonder about the Opus modules, though those carbon enclosures are designed to address this.
 

MadFloyd

Member Sponsor
May 31, 2010
2,399
6
38
Mass
#23
I can definitely feel my Alexia upper modules vibrate, even with classical strings that don't have much bass so this interesting.
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#24
I can definitely feel my Alexia upper modules vibrate, even with classical strings that don't have much bass so this interesting.
Hey MadFloyd,

Hope your system is coming together nicely. I have been following your posts in various threads, and it seems to have been progressing steadily. On the Alexias, if you do trying any damping that's 'lying around the house' do let me know what happens. It took some experimenting, but this solution does seem to work for me. I have had the Entreq Vibb Eaters in for about 2 weeks, but 'pounding it like clay' to really wedge it in their only occurred to me about 24-48 hours ago. So far so good.

I have gone back to several reference recordings. On Clapton Unplugged, the triangle on Track 1 is by far the clearest I have ever heard it with distinct triangle notes throughout much of the track, and this the extends down through the 2nd guitarist on Track 2 becoming a more distinct player, and the 'gravel' in Clapton's throat along with nuances in his singing are all more noticeable.

Its not mid-forward or treble-forward per se...its that these elements which are already there are much firmer, more solid in presentation, and the tail-ends of notes don't blur as much...which gives me more to listen to in this range.
 

jfrech

VIP/Donor
Sep 3, 2012
1,539
1
38
Austin
#25
John, totally agree about vibration control. You just know that Typhon needs two or three Stillpoint Ultra 5s under it.:D And I wonder about the Opus modules, though those carbon enclosures are designed to address this.
Peter after your experiment on your networks, I think I'll try something soon. Want to wait until these cables stop moving around from break in...I was surprised at the size of these networks...substantially larger (2x the size of my ref mm networks)..so either more components inside and/or more vibe control stuff...
 

MadFloyd

Member Sponsor
May 31, 2010
2,399
6
38
Mass
#26
Hey MadFloyd,

Hope your system is coming together nicely. I have been following your posts in various threads, and it seems to have been progressing steadily. On the Alexias, if you do trying any damping that's 'lying around the house' do let me know what happens. It took some experimenting, but this solution does seem to work for me. I have had the Entreq Vibb Eaters in for about 2 weeks, but 'pounding it like clay' to really wedge it in their only occurred to me about 24-48 hours ago. So far so good.

I have gone back to several reference recordings. On Clapton Unplugged, the triangle on Track 1 is by far the clearest I have ever heard it with distinct triangle notes throughout much of the track, and this the extends down through the 2nd guitarist on Track 2 becoming a more distinct player, and the 'gravel' in Clapton's throat along with nuances in his singing are all more noticeable.

Its not mid-forward or treble-forward per se...its that these elements which are already there are much firmer, more solid in presentation, and the tail-ends of notes don't blur as much...which gives me more to listen to in this range.
Yes, things are progressing well for me, thanks for asking. Lloyd, can you take photos of how you wedged in those Vibb Eaters? I'm curious and would like to get a better understanding.
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#27
Yes, things are progressing well for me, thanks for asking. Lloyd, can you take photos of how you wedged in those Vibb Eaters? I'm curious and would like to get a better understanding.
Hi MadFloyd,

Hope you got it from my berry or below. I'm not good with these things. In case not, imagine a gourd filled with shot pellets...or the 'rat' since someone else managed to place a photo of them here. I have the rat wedged on the back of the speaker directly facing the upper midrange module. I then 'punched' and shaped the rat so that its 'head' sits against the back of the upper midrange module, its 'stomach' is against the speaker terminals and the top/back edge of the tweeter terminal, and its 'butt' is on top of the back section of the speaker.
 

Attachments

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2011
4,957
40
48
North Shore of Boston
#28
Lloyd, is that a rear firing tweeter in the photo? If so, it looks like the damping bag is covering it and effecting some of the original purpose of that driver.
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#29
Lloyd, is that a rear firing tweeter in the photo? If so, it looks like the damping bag is covering it and effecting some of the original purpose of that driver.
I knew people were going to spot that, and hope people don't crucify me for it. Basically, what I noticed is that since the back wall (entire room actually) is untreated, there is a bit of treble echo off that wall. Because the X1 has 2 super-tweeters per tweeter, the top one (facing up to ceiling) is completely unobstructed, and the back one (facing back wall here in photo) is better with a little obstruction due to a reduced 'echo'.

I actually had the rat the other way (face down) originally so both super tweeters were entirely unobstructed, and I actually found I preferred it this way instead...yes, it is a smidgen more 'closed in'/less air but with a lot less of the treble echo.

I have NO doubt in a treated room, I would find this configuration a problem...but here, a slight obstruction works. Probably same with the weight in the bass port...in fact, it might be the speakers interaction with this back wall generally. I have seen many pictures with large Wilsons in corners like this setup...where people have placed traps or some other kind of treatment in the corner/back wall...I have none but am about to get some from Stillpoints (their new Apertures).
 
Last edited:

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 21, 2010
9,483
0
0
#30
Lloyd, is that a rear firing tweeter in the photo? If so, it looks like the damping bag is covering it and effecting some of the original purpose of that driver.
This is getting wacky. We're worrying about some small amount of vibration blurring that last nth of decay resolution and yet we are now covering up the rear firing tweeter which I would think is doing more damage to the signal integrity. Something seems wrong here. I would love to hear what Dave Wilson would say about this.
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#31
This is getting wacky. We're worrying about some small amount of vibration blurring that last nth of decay resolution and yet we are now covering up the rear firing tweeter which I would think is doing more damage to the signal integrity. Something seems wrong here. I would love to hear what Dave Wilson would say about this.
I will say, when we partly blocked the backfiring super-tweeter WITHOUT damping the back chassis, I still found this better than totally unobstructed.

That said, I do NOT recommend this generally (unlike things like Ultra 5s or the damping which I do recommend) BTW, Wilson's official word in my experience is they do not recommend tweaks/changes to their speakers. I called to ask and they discouraged me from trying Ultra 5s, or biamping).

This is a peculiarity of my room where there is clearly something going on in those corners. My local dealer also tried it both ways and came to the same odd conclusion...better partly blocking 1 of the 2 super tweeters. It is not the amount of energy coming off that back super-tweeter...its more like what happens when that energy comes off the back wall.

I have seen photos of setups (like CJ's old ref room setup) where people use traps in those back corners. Does a trap have a similar effect of damping noise/echo coming off the back corner? Perhaps this is me starting to find that a similar thing would be helpful...unfortunately, this is also the living room so hiding something in the back is better (by far) than a big tube trap. I am about to experiment with Stillpoints Aperture which I can [kinda] get away with behind the speaker.
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#32
Oh one other point...I DID try Entreq Vibb Eaters wedged into the back with the 'head' down so as to totally stay out of the path of either super-tweeter. The effect of solidity of signal was the same...in fact, I tried it this way FIRST and really liked what I heard AFTER pounding and really wedging it in there. The signal 'shimmer' was gone, and details snapped into place nicely.

But after hearing what the dealer did with partially blocking the super-tweeter, I ended up stacking 1 CD box on top of each Vibb Eater and I preferred it. THAT is when I flipped the Vibb Eater over to its current configuration.

So if one wishes to focus on damping without blocking any super-tweeters, THAT I do recommend trying. (BTW, most of the newer Wilsons have just the 1 super-tweeter firing up, so I do not think this will be an issue for most Wilson owners today.)
 

XV-1

Active Member
May 24, 2010
1,587
13
38
Sydney
#33
Lloyd

I love your dedication in getting the absolute best out of your speakers and gear.

Everything in this hobby makes a difference and if it makes a positive difference in your system, it is an improvement - period. Despite what the naysayers have got to say. Certainly less than a new set of speakers ;)

Anyway, I went to the back of my speakers to see if I had any vibrations - none playing Dire Straits at least. Will play some dynamic electronic music like Monolake or Trentemoller when the family is out.

I envy the two supertweeters on your speakers as I feel that is something I miss a little sometimes with the Maxx's over my old Strads. So I picked up a used pair of Townshend supertweeters and will give them a listen for a while.
In first night as someone famous said - do no harm, they don't :D


Cheers
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,572
3
38
#34
Lloyd

I love your dedication in getting the absolute best out of your speakers and gear.

Everything in this hobby makes a difference and if it makes a positive difference in your system, it is an improvement - period. Despite what the naysayers have got to say. Certainly less than a new set of speakers ;)

Anyway, I went to the back of my speakers to see if I had any vibrations - none playing Dire Straits at least. Will play some dynamic electronic music like Monolake or Trentemoller when the family is out.

I envy the two supertweeters on your speakers as I feel that is something I miss a little sometimes with the Maxx's over my old Strads. So I picked up a used pair of Townshend supertweeters and will give them a listen for a while.
In first night as someone famous said - do no harm, they don't :D


Cheers
Thanks for that...I have been coming to you for advice for almost 10 years...can you believe it? Incredible! Good news on the Maxx3s and vibration...yours are pretty much 'generation 6' relative to my Generation 1...your Maxx3s are contemporaneous with the Alex 2.

Let me know if you feel anything along the back, underneath or anywhere else during deep house or electronica. On my end, as I continue to listen to various albums, I can clearly hear a more sure-footed delivery in the treble/upper mids from electronica to Pink Floyd to Clapton to larger scale orchestral. Fun.
 

About us

  • Founded in 2010 What's Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing