best thing i have read in a very long time....

Mike Lavigne

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Apr 25, 2010
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that guy Musk.....

When a fan on Twitter asked Musk to address people who think going into work is an antiquated concept, he replied “They should pretend to work somewhere else.”

the concept of remote work is destroying society from the inside out. not by itself, but a significant part of it.

if this is too political and mods delete it, so be it.
 

dminches

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Oct 22, 2011
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that guy Musk.....



the concept of remote work is destroying society from the inside out. not by itself, but a significant part of it.

if this is too political and mods delete it, so be it.

I don't know that I would go as far as saying it is destroying society but I completely agree that young people don't realize the benefit from working close to someone with experience and how much they can learn. You are not going to fully develop in your profession working by yourself and staring at a video screen all day. Some of the best lessons I learned and taught were done "at the water cooler" or just by having a 5 minute conversation in person.

Having said that, we are still in a transition period as we emerge from the pandemic. It will take 2-3 years for a new steady state to emerge. This will likely be a hybrid of the old way where people aren't in the office or the new way of being at home 5 days per week.
 

Mike Lavigne

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I don't know that I would go as far as saying it is destroying society but I completely agree that young people don't realize the benefit from working close to someone with experience and how much they can learn. You are not going to fully develop in your profession working by yourself and staring at a video screen all day. Some of the best lessons I learned and taught were done "at the water cooler" or just by having a 5 minute conversation in person.

Having said that, we are still in a transition period as we emerge from the pandemic. It will take 2-3 years for a new steady state to emerge. This will likely be a hybrid of the old way where people aren't in the office or the new way of being at home 5 days per week.
the idea of putting the genie back in the bottle is wishful thinking. the break down of the work ethic culture, and public dole expansion, and then 'other' lowering of protections under the law combined are dragging us into the abyss. and each part undermines the other part.

i hope i'm wrong.
 

dminches

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Oct 22, 2011
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the idea of putting the genie back in the bottle is wishful thinking. the break down of the work ethic culture, and public dole expansion, and then 'other' lowering of protections under the law combined are dragging us into the abyss. and each part undermines the other part.

i hope i'm wrong.

I am not sure what protections you are referring to. Most companies are making their own decisions. I only have anecdotal information but my kids and nieces and nephews have all returned to the office part time.

Some of this is also generational. Even if COVID hadn't happened things are continually changing.
 

Leekg

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Jan 17, 2022
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that guy Musk.....



the concept of remote work is destroying society from the inside out. not by itself, but a significant part of it.

if this is too political and mods delete it, so be it.
Remote work destroying society is news to the millions of us who work from home or vehicle offices, or get things done in coffee shops or diners. Me, I'll happily skip the rehash of last night's game or looking busy in exchange for going/being home early.

Commuting is a tax on the employee as well - a 1/2 hour commute is 2.5 eight hour days out of a person's life every month. Multiply that times all the people sitting in traffic....

Lee
 
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ACHiPo

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Remote work destroying society is news to the millions of us who work from home or vehicle offices, or get things done in coffee shops or diners. Me, I'll happily skip the rehash of last night's game or looking busy in exchange for going/being home early.

Commuting is a tax on the employee as well - a 1/2 hour commute is 2.5 eight hour days out of a person's life every month. Multiply that times all the people sitting in traffic....

Lee
I see it from both sides. I personally have enjoyed the autonomy and flexibility over the past two years, as well as saving an hour plus per day not commuting. My company has flourished the past two years, as have our peers and competitors. People are definitely being effective remotely. That said, I ”donate” much more than that hour saved daily by working longer due to inefficiencies brought on by remote work. I suspect that is common. There are social costs as well to remote work, not to mention the lost opportunity of being able to pop into an office or cube to ask a simple question. I really miss seeing and talking to my coworkers.

I don’t believe remote work is the end of society, but I do believe that it is a seismic shift.

As an aside the streets around Tesla (and throughout the Bay Area) is littered with campers of employed people that can’t afford to live in the area, yet presumably can’t get an equivlent job where they do live. Housing affordability is a huge issue here and elsewhere. Remote work can ease this.
 
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Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
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Remote work destroying society is news to the millions of us who work from home or vehicle offices, or get things done in coffee shops or diners. Me, I'll happily skip the rehash of last night's game or looking busy in exchange for going/being home early.

Commuting is a tax on the employee as well - a 1/2 hour commute is 2.5 eight hour days out of a person's life every month. Multiply that times all the people sitting in traffic....

Lee
agree that remote work in and of itself, in pockets of specific private sector businesses, can be a positive. if it fully serves the aims of that business.

unfortunately remote work applied across society becomes a whole different kind of thing. i've said all i care to say about this and i do respect that many disagree.
 
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dminches

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Oct 22, 2011
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agree that remote work in and of itself, in pockets of specific private sector businesses, can be a positive. if it fully serves the aims of that business.

unfortunately remote work applied across society becomes a whole different kind of thing. i've said all i care to say about this and i do respect that many disagree.

I don't see it being applied across society. It is prevalent in the financial services industry and tech but obviously will never be in most service professions, law enforcement, education, medicine, etc etc. The majority of people in the US have been "going to work" non-stop during the pandemic. Only about 20% of people work remotely.
 

Leekg

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As an aside the streets around Tesla (and throughout the Bay Area) is littered with campers of employed people that can’t afford to live in the area, yet presumably can’t get an equivlent job where they do live. Housing affordability is a huge issue here and elsewhere. Remote work can ease this.
This is a very important point - the workers on the bottom of the income scale bear the brunt of this, forcing them into long commutes, over-crowded housing, or living as you describe. The NIMBY crowd want their labor but don't want them living next door, so in effect these workers are subsidizing their employers by living like this.

We are conditioned to be on the look-out for public dole, but have a hard time acknowledging, or even seeing, private subsidies for the wealthy. I've been as blind as the next person - thankfully my vision is improving.

Lee
 

BlueFox

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Nov 8, 2013
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that guy Musk.....



the concept of remote work is destroying society from the inside out. not by itself, but a significant part of it.

if this is too political and mods delete it, so be it.
How is remote work "destroying society from the inside out"?
 
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ddk

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May 18, 2013
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that guy Musk.....



the concept of remote work is destroying society from the inside out. not by itself, but a significant part of it.

if this is too political and mods delete it, so be it.
Sadly Mike the dire implications of remote work and free money will only fully manifest in the next few years, then everyone will understand what happened.:(

david
 

bonzo75

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Remote work is good for the audio industry, sit at home and work while listening to hifi
 

Lagonda

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andromedaaudio

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Regarding the topic i think the main issue is that the fed has kept interest rates at 0 for 10 + years .
Great for people/ banks with assets , but its desasturaus for the average blue collar worker / starter / youth
Now with inflation finally picking up due to easy money policy , its tough times ahead.
Coming back to Musk i think he has a point , but its up to the employer to decide afaik
 

Fred Crane

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Apr 23, 2020
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Sadly Mike the dire implications of remote work and free money will only fully manifest in the next few years, then everyone will understand what happened.:(

david
Apprenticeship was such a cogent wonderful system. My Uncle, (now in his early 90's, and still tinkering in his garage) and his son have been life-long engineers in the aerospace industry. The idea that they could do what they do (did) without daily cooperative/interactive work and years of apprenticeship is unthinkable. My cousin is working on the Bezos rocket. Do you think he confers with his Dad and a group of others who came before him after all of these years...you bet.
 

Leekg

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Coming back to Musk i think he has a point , but its up to the employer to decide afaik
Actually, with a near full employment labor market, employees have increasing say about who they work for and how they work. Makes many industries (like my industry of agriculture) nervous when they don't hold all the marbles. We all love the free market until it comes to labor.
 
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