Best sound in Munich

gian60

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2016
2,027
944
228
#1
I visit all in Munich for whole 2 days and for me the best sound,besides Living Voice was ESD Acustic,an horn speaker 5 way driven by 10 transistor mono amp.
and external active crossover.
Efficiency more than 110 db,bass with true horn,,carbon fiber horn,Field Coil driver and Beryllium Diaphragms.
I love beryllium diaphragms because many years ago i was with Yamamura that change in my friend system the diaphragms of ALE drived from titanium to Beryllium and sound was more pure and natural

I was laughing when enter in this room because this is a Chinese company,so i was thinking disaster sound because they can copy well but no experience,but i was shocked,sound was similar to the ALE 6 way system of my friend,sound very relaxed and fast,that go out from speaker easily, listen chamber music and other 2/3 song and sound was fantastic.

Listen also in the afternoon,was playing hotel california and listen less but always good
Price usd 237.000
 

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gian60

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2016
2,027
944
228
#2
Sorry i forgot,
sure speaker with Ale,Goto,YL,Kanno,Tad,Vitavox,WE,Gip,are better and sound more natural,but this i think for few time i listen seems very good
Need 2/3 days to listen well and understand well
 

Audiophile Bill

Well-Known Member
Mar 23, 2015
2,805
1,224
260
UK
#3
Sorry i forgot,
sure speaker with Ale,Goto,YL,Kanno,Tad,Vitavox,WE,Gip,are better and sound more natural,but this i think for few time i listen seems very good
Need 2/3 days to listen well and understand well
Hi Gian,

How do the crossovers in this system work? Is it a digital dsp based active multi-way?
 

Audiophile Bill

Well-Known Member
Mar 23, 2015
2,805
1,224
260
UK
#6
Its a crossover 5 way with external power supply pure analog.
Slope selection 12/18/24 db per octave
Oh very cool :cool:

Any analogue front end?
 

Audiophile Bill

Well-Known Member
Mar 23, 2015
2,805
1,224
260
UK
#7
The best sound FOR ME,besides horn speaker was absolutely the Gobel,sound very natural and liquid,due i think for 95 db and the high quality driver
I tell for me,because every one can have different taste
I liked those previous years also - lovely sound from those bending wave drivers
 

Audiophile Bill

Well-Known Member
Mar 23, 2015
2,805
1,224
260
UK
#9
Front end digital,
tomorrw i post photo of cd,amp and crossover,i have depliant
Gian,

Not tempted to go back to the dark side again? This could be your final system :eek::Do_O
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
4,382
994
358
Switzerland
#10
I visit all in Munich for whole 2 days and for me the best sound,besides Living Voice was ESD Acustic,an horn speaker 5 way driven by 10 transistor mono amp.
and external active crossover.
Efficiency more than 110 db,bass with true horn,,carbon fiber horn,Field Coil driver and Beryllium Diaphragms.
I love beryllium diaphragms because many years ago i was with Yamamura that change in my friend system the diaphragms of ALE drived from titanium to Beryllium and sound was more pure and natural

I was laughing when enter in this room because this is a Chinese company,so i was thinking disaster sound because they can copy well but no experience,but i was shocked,sound was similar to the ALE 6 way system of my friend,sound very relaxed and fast,that go out from speaker easily, listen chamber music and other 2/3 song and sound was fantastic.

Listen also in the afternoon,was playing hotel california and listen less but always good
Price usd 237.000
Well I can agree on the Living Voice being one of the best at the show but not the Chinese horns, which IMO were an incoherent mess despite the nice drivers.
 

gian60

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2016
2,027
944
228
#11
This chinese system is the perfect reproduction of how has to be a horn system,5 way,multi amplified ,field coil and with bass horn,is perfect.
and is very very interesting and driver seems enough good.
Was incoherent because set up fast in one day,for example Yamamura setup in some months the system ALE 6 way of my friend,they did in 1 day.
Then sure has no the right experience,i think,to setup this very difficult and complicated system,.

Consider also that the amp are Chinese transistor and the price list is 12.000 usd mono for pair,while all other system amp was from 150.000 euro minimum

Set up this very well with better amp,then all will be surprised
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
4,382
994
358
Switzerland
#12
This chinese system is the perfect reproduction of how has to be a horn system,5 way,multi amplified ,field coil and with bass horn,is perfect.
and is very very interesting and driver seems enough good.
Was incoherent because set up fast in one day,for example Yamamura setup in some months the system ALE 6 way of my friend,they did in 1 day.
Then sure has no the right experience,i think,to setup this very difficult and complicated system,.

Consider also that the amp are Chinese transistor and the price list is 12.000 usd mono for pair,while all other system amp was from 150.000 euro minimum

Set up this very well with better amp,then all will be surprised
I read a lot of speculation about what could be but the reality at the show was something else.
 

User211

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2014
2,082
560
358
#13
Comedy Mickey Mouse horns that are a lot of fun if you don't take them seriously. Not really hi-fi.

The Mickey Mouse ears can bang out serious bass on electronica. The sort of speaker ideal for the rich man's kids playroom I reckon.

And in there on two successive days the impression was the same.
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
11,439
2,316
603
E. England
#15
Any feedback on the Wilson Benesch GMT One tt?
If the bumpf is to be believed, it's not belt, DD, idler or rim.
Some kind of variation on "mag drive" utilised by Kodo The Beat.
Any SQ impressions, tech info, price details?
 
Last edited:

heihei

Well-Known Member
Jul 24, 2017
162
101
113
#16
The GMT One wasn't playing. They'd hoped to have it ready, but still some work on the software side.

Drive system is a mag-drive, but has it's own licensing agreement so differs from anything currently out there.
Tech-wise, there is a huge amount going on. As well as the drive system (which ensures there is nothing physically connecting the motor to the platter), there is an air-based self-leveling system built in, a remote-controlled VTA adjustment on the fly, and lots of innovative materials usage in tonearm etc.
By all accounts, the vinyl experts were very impressed by the technology.

No specifics on price yet and think there will be a number of entry points. Expect big-bucks though.
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
4,382
994
358
Switzerland
#17
Any feedback on the Wilson Benesch GMT One tt?
If the bumpf is to be believed, it's not belt, DD, idler or rim.
Some kind of variation on "mag drive" utilised by Kodo The Beat.
Any SQ impressions, tech info, price details?
no idea if the TT was playing but the sound was very thin and seemed to have little bass despite two of those Torus subs being there as well as a lot of drivers on the main speaker.
 

CKKeung

Well-Known Member
Jun 18, 2011
1,985
1,238
520
Hong Kong
#18
The GMT One wasn't playing. They'd hoped to have it ready, but still some work on the software side.
Drive system is a mag-drive, but has it's own licensing agreement so differs from anything currently out there.
Tech-wise, there is a huge amount going on. As well as the drive system (which ensures there is nothing physically connecting the motor to the platter), there is an air-based self-leveling system built in, a remote-controlled VTA adjustment on the fly, and lots of innovative materials usage in tonearm etc.
By all accounts, the vinyl experts were very impressed by the technology.
No specifics on price yet and think there will be a number of entry points. Expect big-bucks though.
I heard rumours that the msrp of the GMT One may not be very much cheaper than that of an Air Force Zero.
o_O
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
4,382
994
358
Switzerland
#19
For me the best sounds at the show:

Overall technology independent and in no specific order:
Aries Cerat
Living Voice with Vox Palladians (I also heard the small speakers sounding good but not ultimate)
Western Electric/Silbatone
Odeon/NEM (I think it was NEM)
Alsyvox/Omega
Diesis Audio (Italian open baffle/horns)
Goebbel + Enstrom + Kronos
Wiener Lautsprecher Manufaktur (new model was stunning with Tchaikovsky symphony...a real surprise)
Supravox + Line Magnetic

By category:
Best Planar: Alsyvox. Hands down the best sounding planar at the show and perhaps the best sounding one ever. I would love to hear what this thing can do with good tube amps. This might be the least colored speaker I have heard and now it is a planar with the attack and dynamics of a speaker with high sensitivity pro drivers...not quite the level of a top 100db+ horn system but not far off.

Best Horns: It was close this year, IMO, between Aries Cerat and Living Voice. Living Voice was slightly off from last year because A) It was the Vox Palladian, which so far has not convinced me it is as good as the Olympian and B) the bass was lumpier than usual and not as well integrated. Still, it was still very realistic in many of the most important ways.
Aries Cerat was super transparent, ultra dynamic and had a nice overall tonal balance. The addition of bass horns this year gave additional weight to recordings that made it sound truly full range. The transient response was the best I heard at the show and only approached by the Alsyvox speakers. With a good recording you felt you were there.

Honorable mentions: WE/silbatone. Rolled off in the highs and the bass...but it didn't matter! This system sounded very lifelike in all the right ways but was clearly more colored than than the two above. Nevertheless, it delivered the emotion and the speed was astounding so that deliniation of rapid runs on the piano were effortlessly and SOTA resovled. I don't think I have ever heard the workings of the piano so clearly resolved and yet still integral to the wholeness of the sound. Not a setup for all genres of music and thus honorable mention.
Odeon/NEM: Very transparent and dynamic...perhaps a touch bright at times. Still, it was very well resolved and dynamic and the balance of the speaker was very good. I think a better source than the Reed TT would have elevated it even further.

Best open baffle:
Diesis Audio: These are reallly open baffle/horn hybrids but they were pretty awesome! Fast, punchy and with very realistic highs. Great tone as well and really a superb system.

Supravox/ Line Magnetic: Stuck in a small room on the ground floor, nonethless they were dynamic and fluid with great tone. Not quite as resovled or quite as dynamic as the Diesis Audio speakers; however, they were very organic and detail and transparency were more than adequate. The best part is the price, around 10K euro for the speakers.

Best "conventional" speakers:
Goebbel Divin + Engstrom: While this speaker has an AMT tweeter, I put it in the conventional category. It is using high sensitivity pro drivers (at least that is what they look like) and thus is getting around 95db/watt. This time coupled with a good tube amp, the speakers really sang and were quite coherent, especially for a multi-driver speaker. Fast, dynamic and uncongested sounding (unlike the majority of cone/dome speakers I heard), if I was in the market for a top notch conventional speaker I would probably look here rather than YG, Magico, Wilson, Von Schweikert etc.

Live Act Audio: Again with profi drivers and a horn tweeter (coax) but otherwise conventional. They live up to the name with a huge and punchy sound. Perhaps not hte most neutral or the most transparent on this list but damn do they rock. Live recordings do a good facsimile of sounding live. I think they are pricey for what they are but in today's price climate I guess it is still ok for the performance you get. This could be the ideal speaker for someone who plays a lot of rock music but also wants Jazz and classical to perform.

WLM: Surprised me with a new model this year. Looked like a simple two-way on top of a dedicated subwoofer (which was top and bottom firing woofers). The system was about 94db and had a papyrus woofer (light and fast) with an AMT mounted into a wooden wave/guide. This blew me away on big classical making huge space but still retaining good image focus. Also, tonality was very good as was transparency. For about 25K euro I thought this was one of the best buys along with the Supravox speakers. Not sure what the electronics were in this room but they were not WLM (which I think was mainly rebranded Trafomatic).
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
11,439
2,316
603
E. England
#20
Brad, are these Erevus basshorns an add-on to the Symphonias, or replace the stock basshorns?
 

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