A Plea For High-End Audio Manufacturer Honesty and Transparency

[tima]

If you have been around financial regulation and politics, you immediately recognize what Wilson is doing is called an availability cascade. I’m not a fan of the tactic.

And Wilson has been a successful manufacturer for years. Through buy-backs they make it very easy for customers to move up their line. They also bring a technology cascade whereby features from top-end models regularly trickle down to the lower tier.

 

[andromedaaudio]

The whole thread tittle should be changed:

A Plea For High-end Dealer / reviewer Honesty and Transparency.​

 

[bonzo75]

Through buy-backs they make it very easy for customers to move up their line.

Policies that encourage noob linearity

 

[treitz3]

Yes, but aren't you glad you did. Just having the MA-3 on offer must be its own satisfaction.

View attachment 157124

108 total tubes, 54 in each channel
1/4 Farad per channel power capacity
500 Watts of OTL glory.

Thanks Tim. My A/C bill went up twofold, just by me looking at that!

Please excuse me while I get a towel to wipe me brow....

Tom

 

[tima]

Policies that encourage noob linearity

I can see that. I went through three iterations as a reviewer and could have gone four, but the scales fell from my ears.

 

[Geardaddy]

The whole thread tittle should be changed:

A Plea For High-end Dealer / reviewer Honesty and Transparency.​

100%....my most recent and toxic experiences in audio have been facilitated by dealer/distros with an assist from one unscrupulous manufacturer.

 

[Atmasphere]

Thanks Tim. My A/C bill went up twofold, just by me looking at that!

Please excuse me while I get a towel to wipe me brow....

Tom

That amp has bank-switched power tubes, so you can run 1/3rd or 2/3rds of them- and the unused tubes aren't even lit. But when you build an output section that large, its efficiency is quite high compared to other OTLs so even though its class A2 the tubes run cooler.

Also if you have an amplifier of that sort of scale then you probably have the budget to modify the room in which it resides. By simply venting the ceiling to the outside world with an inexpensive squirrel cage fan the room can remain quite pleasant without air conditioning. I was at the home of a customer who owns a set of these in a tropical environment so I know this first-hand.

 

[Lagonda]

The buyer also has to do his / her own due diligence .
I would never pre pay for a product myself.....

Come to think of it
Ok 1 exception FMA but it ll be for a existing product that i have heard myself

I only prepay half, from old reputable companies and only for specialty products. My first set of M. L Statements were not built until i ordered them. I would never pay in advance from small companies.

 

[Audiohertz2]

Yes, but aren't you glad you did. Just having the MA-3 on offer must be its own satisfaction.

View attachment 157124

108 total tubes, 54 in each channel
1/4 Farad per channel power capacity
500 Watts of OTL glory.

Imagine when having to ReToob such a device …!

Matching toobs anyone

 

[Atmasphere]

Imagine when having to ReToob such a device …!

Matching toobs anyone

We've never matched the power tubes. But there is a built-in tube tester in case someone wanted to do so.

95% of the distortion of most of our OTLs (except the little S-30) arises in the Voltage amplifier, which is the only stage of gain in the amp and so has to swing a fairly high Voltage. That's a big ask; if the internal sections of the tubes in that stage aren't matched distortion can be quite high. Matching can thus reduce distortion drastically.

 

[Geardaddy]

High-end audio isn’t different from other industries, most start with one to two people.

We all have direct contact with manufactures in a variety of areas. I regularly visit the Ping factory to have my golf clubs worked on.

Do high-end manufacturers really care much about testing their products? I’s a subjective largely self-taught hobby why bother?

I tend to agree, especially since most of them are are not real engineers so they know little about QC and the design and testing towards that end.

 

[Ron Resnick]

High-end audio isn’t different from other industries, most start with one to two people.

true

Do high-end manufacturers really care much about testing their products?

That's a positive question. I'm going to give you a normative answer.

My personal opinion is that they should care! When you're charging tens of thousands of dollars and, today, in many cases, hundreds of thousands of dollars, I think the manufacturer has a responsibility to test the product in a variety of electrical infrastructure and associated component environments.

 

[Al M.]

I tend to agree, especially since most of them are are not real engineers so they know little about QC and the design and testing towards that end.

What is "most of them"? I would contend that all manufacturers of my gear (see my signature) are engineers and do testing and proper QC.

 

[Elliot G.]

true


That's a positive question. I'm going to give you a normative answer.

My personal opinion is that they should care! When you're charging tens of thousands of dollars and, today, in many cases, hundreds of thousands of dollars, I think the manufacturer has a responsibility to test the product in a variety of electrical infrastructure and associated component environments.

I cant speak for all companies but I know for sure that the companies I represent and want to represent test and stand behind what they manufacture. If there are companies in the high end that do that they certainly don't deserve the support of the community.

 

[Audiohertz2]

We've never matched the power tubes. But there is a built-in tube tester in case someone wanted to do so.

95% of the distortion of most of our OTLs (except the little S-30) arises in the Voltage amplifier, which is the only stage of gain in the amp and so has to swing a fairly high Voltage. That's a big ask; if the internal sections of the tubes in that stage aren't matched distortion can be quite high. Matching can thus reduce distortion drastically.

Unmatched output tubes were very much a necessity before auto Bias , if not , run away output tube is a thing …

Are you auto biasing ..?

 

[Atmasphere]

Unmatched output tubes were very much a necessity before auto Bias , if not , run away output tube is a thing …

Are you auto biasing ..?

Yes- there's a servo control.

 

[microstrip]

Unmatched output tubes were very much a necessity before auto Bias , if not , run away output tube is a thing …

Are you auto biasing ..?

If we measure the distortion in most push pull tube amplifiers we get better figures if we use matched tubes.

BTW we can match tubes in IP (plate current) and GM (transconductance) . Auto bias only solves one the IP issue.

 

[Atmasphere]

If we measure the distortion in most push pull tube amplifiers we get better figures if we use matched tubes.

That is true in our OTLs too, but in our case means the input tubes rather than the power tubes. This is because there is no Voltage gain in the driver and output sections so they really don't contribute much to distortion. This is very easy to demonstrate if a distortion analyzer is available.

 

[Rt66indierock]

I tend to agree, especially since most of them are are not real engineers so they know little about QC and the design and testing towards that end.

The number people in high end audio who know how to test is very small. I don’t know if there are many actual electrical engineers. I do know for sure there are very few who are Professional Engineers. A credential similar to my CPA license.

 

[Rt66indierock]

What is "most of them"? I would contend that all manufacturers of my gear (see my signature) are engineers and do testing and proper QC.

Tell me about Steven Norber, I only see 35 years in high end audio.