Are We Doomed?

[Asamel]

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/nation_world/20140626_ap_5bc443856e144f189d00d33b4e252dca.html?c=r

In addition to the medical issues mentioned here I was amazed by the attendance numbers of these festivals. What kind of music are these kids going to listen to down the road? Will there be a need for good sound?

 

[JackD201]

These are the Woodstocks, The Dead and The Phish events of this generation. If we're doomed, it started a long time ago.

Personally, I have no worries. We "Gen Xers" grew the underground rave movement of which these festivals are direct descendants. Look at where we are now. We are competing with you for Jazz, Classical, Blues and Rock at the record bins both real and virtual!

As for the medical issues, blame it on the drugs and alcohol. Even in the late 80's it was not unheard of for people to literally overheat because of drugs like MDMA. Even without the drugs you can imagine how such an environment could be extremely hostile from a hydration standpoint.

 

[FrantzM]

These are the Woodstocks, The Dead and The Phish events of this generation. If we're doomed, it started a long time ago.

Personally, I have no worries. We "Gen Xers" grew the underground rave movement of which these festivals are direct descendants. Look at where we are now. We are competing with you for Jazz, Classical, Blues and Rock at the record bins both real and virtual!

As for the medical issues, blame it on the drugs and alcohol. Even in the late 80's it was not unheard of for people to literally overheat because of drugs like MDMA. Even without the drugs you can imagine how such an environment could be extremely hostile from a hydration standpoint.

+1

 

[rockitman]

nothing new here. It's been going on as long as there have been rock concerts. The only real difference is the music, ecstasy and baby pacifiers.

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

Nothing new is correct. There are dumb kids who go to these kinds of things to get too high and make the scene, and there are smart kids who are deep into music. In that regard, Gen X is awesome. I have two of them in my band -- a 32 year old and a 26 year old -- and they know, and appreciate, everything from Charlie Parker to Modest Mouse. The smartest, most musical people of that generation have none of the generational limitations boomers suffered from. "Rock" music in all its variety has been on a continuum since the mid 1950s. They don't look back at their parent's music and see, as we did, a completely different genre (crooners and swing). They see the visible, audible roots of the music they invent, play and appreciate today. The generation gap is closed. These kids - at least the ones I play with and my own daughter - are wide open minded and listen to six decades of popular music.

And when they create it, they create it with that perspective. If you think the music of the younger generation sucks, you're listening to sucky music. Stop it. Go find the good stuff.

Tim

 

[TheMadMilkman]

Gen X is awesome.

Yes we are, but your bandmates are Gen Y

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

Yes we are, but your bandmates are Gen Y

Right you are. Sorry got my lettered gens crossed. What I said about my bandmates and daughter applies to most GenX-ers as well. The most musically aware of them can see three generations of popular music, and it's connections laid out before them with little prejudice. Most boomers, by contrast, initially rejected the music of our parents' generation, and tend to dismiss the music of our children. It's pretty limiting.

Tim

 

[Asamel]

I posted this mostly because of huge size of the crowds at these EDM events. I've read the industry pundits who say that that kids go for the scene more than the music. Indeed much, if not all, of these shows are not live. This music sounds fine on earbuds and mp3s. Why will any of these kids ever need a high quality system? I don't think they will.

 

[TheMadMilkman]

I have a few friends who have attended the Electric Daisy Carnival in Las Vegas, which is where the attendance numbers in the article were pulled. It really is the Woodstock of EDM. And, like every large music festival, it brings in people who are there for the music, but also people who are there for the drugs, sex and booze.

And while the numbers seem huge, 134,000 people a night for a once-a-year festival isn't really all that big. The University of Alabama fills their 100,000+ stadium every weekend in the fall.

 

[TheMadMilkman]

I posted this mostly because of huge size of the crowds at these EDM events. I've read the industry pundits who say that that kids go for the scene more than the music. Indeed much, if not all, of these shows are not live. This music sounds fine on earbuds and mp3s. Why will any of these kids ever need a high quality system? I don't think they will.

Yes, some of the DJs prerecord their mixes. Not all of them do. My friends went last year specifically to see Fatboy Slim, who makes it a point to do his mixing live.

Do you listen to EDM at all? The music can be very complex, and definitely benefits from better sound reproduction. Soundstaging and other audiophile qualities may not matter, but it's disingenous to say that any type of music doesn't benefit from higher-fidelity reproduction.

 

[Asamel]

I'm making my comments based on my kids and their friends. With the exception of Beats headphones none of them have anything but earbuds and small Bluetooth speaker systems.

I'm not comparing this to football but to other music events. To my mind EDM is very popular in that demographic and I can't see these kids buying high end gear - ever. Compare that to my friends growing up who ALL have mid to high end sound systems or home theater set ups.

Yes the drug stuff isn't new but this seemed a bit excessive. Not really the point I was trying to make though.

 

[TheMadMilkman]

It's not really a large number, though, when compared to festivals for other genres. The Chicago Blues Festival sees attendance of roughly 500,000 over 3 days. Coachella is capped at 99,000 attendees per day, so roughly 300,000 over the course of the festival. The CMA Music Festival reports 80,000 per day, so 360,000 for the full event. 400,000 for Electric Daisy isn't out of line.

I also think that basing your findings on the group of friends you had growing up skews your viewpoint somewhat. I would bet that if you extended your view to include, say, your entire highschool graduating class, you would find that very few of them have invested in more than maybe a Bose Wave Radio or some basic computer speakers for listening to music.

I'd also wager that a substantial number would state that they want good sound quality when they listen to music, but very few of them would know what it means.

 

[Joe Whip]

My son is a musician (piano, vocals and songwriting) who loves EDM and orchestrates many of his songs for that style of music. However, he very much enjoys my 2 channel rig and appreciates great sound. He loves to play his stuff that he writes and records through my DAC via his computer. He understand the loudness wars and the value of his hearing and will be a stickler for sound when he goes in the record his CD.

 

[Atmasphere]

Uh, just FWIW, you get that many people together for any event and even with no drugs/alchohol (which really isn't going to happen with that many people involved) that many people will likely be hospitalized as a matter of course. Nothing to see here.

 

[Joe Whip]

Oh and the address the original question, yes we are all doomed. No one gets off the earth alive, at least permanently.

 

[JackD201]

You might be surprised Asamel. The top acts like Avicii, Van Buuren, Tiesto, play using LPs or 24/96 files. The minimum is 16/44.1. The lesser DJs who have no access to their label's vaults are limited to 16/44.1. They aren't sourcing music from iTunes but rather from places like Beatport. Rule of thumb when performing is no file played should be below 320kbps, ever. You will find thin written in CDJ manuals by Pioneer, TAD's parent company which is serious about sound quality. You will also find this recommendation made by Traktor (one of the most used software database and performance pllatforms). Perversely, these kids are actually being exposed to high resolution playback albeit for the producers and performance the need for higher resolution is a competitive advantage. Given that the SR systems are arrays with kilowatts of power behind them, you can imagine what would happen if they played low quality files.

That said there is one genre that will peel paint of the walls. It came and went very quickly. Twice actually. The equivalent of post-modern architecture in dance music. LOL. Yes I do NOT like Dubstep! House is deeply rooted in Jazz and Funk while Trance and Progressive house is deeply rooted in classical music in terms of layer structure. Synth samples are derived from polyphonic samples of actual instruments. One of the songs that put Tiesto on the map (he was mentioned in the article) was his take on Barber's Adagio for Strings. Really

I personally went into Jazz and Classical because I was retracing influences and found the roots to be oh so fulfilling. I'm in no way an isolated case. I think the need to broaden choices in innate. I like what Tim said. If you don't like it, you're listening to the wrong thing so go find the good stuff. The problem with new music is that the gems are still buried under a lot of crap. Old music has the advantage of being curated over time. The cream having risen to the top so to speak.

 

[JackD201]

This is Above & Beyond playing at Ultra Miami. Look at the sheer Joy of the audience. You guys don't have to watch the whole thing.

They are in the top 10 of the DJList ranking. They've won practically everything and are the founders of one of Dance Music's most successful labels Anjunabeats.

Now, do these guys below look familiar?

 

[asiufy]

Cool, Jack!

That first piece/introduction on the acoustic video sounds like a post rock band, with the mood and the crescendo... Nice!

As for the electronic stuff, I'm sure you're familiar with the grandaddy of them all, Tangerine Dream, right?

alexandre

 

[JackD201]

You betcha Alex

 

[FrantzM]

You might be surprised Asamel. The top acts like Avicii, Van Buuren, Tiesto, play using LPs or 24/96 files. The minimum is 16/44.1. The lesser DJs who have no access to their label's vaults are limited to 16/44.1. They aren't sourcing music from iTunes but rather from places like Beatport. Rule of thumb when performing is no file played should be below 320kbps, ever. You will find thin written in CDJ manuals by Pioneer, TAD's parent company which is serious about sound quality. You will also find this recommendation made by Traktor (one of the most used software database and performance pllatforms). Perversely, these kids are actually being exposed to high resolution playback albeit for the producers and performance the need for higher resolution is a competitive advantage. Given that the SR systems are arrays with kilowatts of power behind them, you can imagine what would happen if they played low quality files.

That said there is one genre that will peel paint of the walls. It came and went very quickly. Twice actually. The equivalent of post-modern architecture in dance music. LOL. Yes I do NOT like Dubstep! House is deeply rooted in Jazz and Funk while Trance and Progressive house is deeply rooted in classical music in terms of layer structure. Synth samples are derived from polyphonic samples of actual instruments. One of the songs that put Tiesto on the map (he was mentioned in the article) was his take on Barber's Adagio for Strings. Really

I personally went into Jazz and Classical because I was retracing influences and found the roots to be oh so fulfilling. I'm in no way an isolated case. I think the need to broaden choices in innate. I like what Tim said. If you don't like it, you're listening to the wrong thing so go find the good stuff. The problem with new music is that the gems are still buried under a lot of crap. Old music has the advantage of being curated over time. The cream having risen to the top so to speak.

Great Post !!!

I am not in dance and trance and the likes really but listen to almost everything else and Yeah including hip-hop ... I wonder however if this hasn't always been the case: For each Bach, Beethoven, Haydn, Miles Davis, Charlie Parker, etc .. Do we know or realize how many played the same music and deserve to be forgotten ..Is all Jazz music great, all Classical, all any genre??

BTW Jack you are an "Old Soul"