For those who have great rooms and systems, does this song sound sibilant to you?

[Nuprin]

Is it just my ears, system or is it the recording that makes this Holly Cole song "I can see clearly now" very sibilant? The "S" sound is very piercing to my ears.
My system is sounding great with the bass really dialed in and have no complaints with just about every other aspect except the sibilance in many recordings that I would expect to be very well recorded. It's not true of every artist and recording, but certainly on many, including a few male vocalists. Instruments like cymbals and violin sound really good and not bright or harsh at all.

For example, Chesky's classic "Spanish Harlem" by Rebecca Pidgeon even has it. I would assume David would record his tracks well and the sibilance shouldn't be there?

 

[treitz3]

What is your source/version on the second one (Rebecca)?

Tom

 

[Nuprin]

I have heard it both from streaming (Apple Music) and the Raven CD. Don't have a vinyl set up.

 

[chuck]

The 2006 David Chesky produced SACD "The World's Greatest Audiophile Vocal Recordings" includes the Rebecca Pidgeon, it does not have the sibilance. It sounds excellent. Playback Designs MPT8/MPD8, Boulder 1110/3060, YG Sonja XVi.

 

[Al M.]

Have the Rebecca Pigdeon Chesky CD. No sibilance.

 

[Nuprin]

Have the Rebecca Pigdeon Chesky CD. No sibilance.

Just the regular cd?

I have attended a few shows and I do hear sibilance in some rooms/systems and not others. Even a few hifi stores I hear sibilance on their systems that are "high end". Maybe I am more sensitive to sibilance than other audiophiles I know but is this a case of inferior source component CD Player/Streamer, DAC?

On the other hand, I was at a show and heard top of the line Conrad Johnson Mono Amps and Preamp with Kharma Exquisite Midi with a 20 year old entry level Cambridge Audio CD with built in DAC that probably cost a couple hundred dollars back in it's day. There was no sibilance in that system.

 

[Alrainbow]

Try headphones , and you don't need 10k to use them
Even good Bluetooth non apple buds is a good idea to adjust a system

 

[Rexp]

Try headphones , and you don't need 10k to use them
Even good Bluetooth non apple buds is a good idea to adjust a system

Bluetooth! I think not..

 

[Robh3606]

If it's in the recording you should hear it on every system. I could hear it on my laptop. If some do and some don't the ones where you can't hear it I would be wondering why. And it's not a good thing.

Rob

 

[Kingrex]

Simbilance is something I noticed when comparing a all copper panel to an aluminum one. The amount of hash and Simbilance when the stereo was powered with an off the shelf SqD QO panel was very audible. When changed to all copper it completely went away. On the magnitude of adding an isolation transformer.

Having said that, power from the wall, filtration and cables could all impact Simbilance. A high dollar system does not mean a well set up system. So what if the owner bought unobtanium cables and such. They may not match well with the equipment or whats coming from the wall. Could even be a poor duplex to power cord match.

 

[Nuprin]

Hmm, I have not considered the panel. There's many parts the chain leading up to the preamp is where I think is the issue is in my system.

 

[Kingrex]

Not just the panel. The duplex to cord plating materials. The interconnects. Any metal to metal contacts. Try cleaning all your electrical contacts with Caig Deoxit G100. Get the 2oz needle dropper and use QTips and cottton pipe cleaners to go over everything.

Spray down all your electrical panel with Caig Deoxit DN5S. I think you can only get the 5oz can. Everything. Grounds, neutrals, back of circuit breaker. Not a bad idea to pull every breaker and wipe the bus as well as swipe inside the circuit breaker foot. Flip the main 200A off when doing this work. Have a good flashlight set up to see well. Very thin film. Never leave build up. Wipe it off. Wiping off is also removing the oxidation that the DN5S lifted from the metal. If you don't wipe it away, its going to settle back into place.

 

[sbnx]

Sibilance is very often a speaker placement issue. Small positional changes typically eliminate sibilance.

One test track to use for this is The Cowboy Junkies, "Mining for Gold". This song can really highlight sibilance issues, but Margo should be singing clearly without any sibilance. Does this song sound sibilant on your system?

 

[Al M.]

Just the regular cd?

Yes.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

So, do we know if the original recording has the sibilance (not defined) or not? Or is it a playback variable?

 

[Robh3606]

So, do we know if the original recording has the sibilance (not defined) or not? Or is it a playback variable?

How could it not originate on the recording? What mechanism could create sibilance and only sibilance in an audio system?

Rob

 

[Nuprin]

Sibilance is very often a speaker placement issue. Small positional changes typically eliminate sibilance.

One test track to use for this is The Cowboy Junkies, "Mining for Gold". This song can really highlight sibilance issues, but Margo should be singing clearly without any sibilance. Does this song sound sibilant on your system?

I hear somewhat harsh "S" around the 1:10 - 1:15 mark in the song. The first minute of the song I don't hear it, but it's not as bad as some other albums. The sibilance is a bit worse on the Rebecca Pidgeon "Spanish Harlem" and way worse on the "I can clearly see now" Holly Cole song.

Here's a strange observation: I talk to customers daily in my business, face to face and once in a while there's a female with a super sibilant voice. It hurts my ears every time they say word with a "S" in it.

I have moved my speakers around many times, many hours spent with position and toe-in without much improvement. Absorption at first reflection on the side walls and recently installed ceiling diffusion panels. There's a large carpet on the hardwood floors where I sit so I've covered all my first reflections. The side panels did reduce some of the sibilance impact but the ceiling diffusion panels didn't do too much except it surprisingly improved bass quality and output by a good margin.

I should also mention with the room analysis and correction using BACCH ORC, it improved the sibilance a little, but I'm still getting about a 5db or so bump in the 3k-4k range but everything else measures pretty flat. The ORC did instantly resolve bass problems I've been working on for years in the room.

 

[Nuprin]

So, do we know if the original recording has the sibilance (not defined) or not? Or is it a playback variable?

That's what I don't know for sure and why I'm asking people with really dialed in systems if they hear the same thing I'm hearing.

 

[Nuprin]

How could it not originate on the recording? What mechanism could create sibilance and only sibilance in an audio system?

Rob

Well, I have heard songs I know well on my system at shows and dealers where is sounded very harsh and thus sibilant on female vocals. In the original post, I mentioned the Conrad Johnson/Kharma system where I did not hear sibilance. One song played there was:

and the trumpets sounded glorious and never harsh or bright.

I was then at a dealer showroom in DC with the Wilson Alexia, a full DCS stack with Momentum Amps and heard the same Count Basie song and it was harsh and bright - very very detailed but those trumpets were harsh.

 

[thedudeabides]

Sounds like OCD to me. Try some "time out". Might help. Good luck.