MSB Cascade compared to Wadax Studio

[Alrainbow]

Did anyone leave out the part where this person says it's the one box solution to beat. Clearly his admission to direct compares to other brand flagship one box solution, seems below the studio .
so if you really want to understand his compare I feel it must start at his comments at the end from him .
I think his reasoning for doing the compare is to push wadax to release the external psu and clock. He does seem to be pushing this narrative I felt .
He even said his view in Spanish lol .
Now I have heard both separately and can say the cascade is good , but so is the far cheaper all in one box solution wadax studio .
Another point is while the cascade maybe good it needs additional investments of even more money for a server . This becomes in my world a kick at msb. Is this the most boxes wins ? I'm guessing if wadax does release an external clock and cable , no upgraded psu used does this get you on par with cascade ?? Again a one box solution verses a multi box far more expensive product that still can't play and sacd or CD disks.
I can't understand other then financially motivated posters would make comments at all.

 

[Tripoint Audio]

so how would you do that with your product that is over 5- 10 times the price of the competition?

I judge every component and system the same, by listing their attributes or cons. This can be very tricky due to the fact than when listening a component you’re basically judging an entire system, room, and calibration. This is why you must audition same component under the same system when A-B. Luckily I have listened to Wadax with very familiar components and many systems worldwide. Heavily calibrated systems speaker positioning, room acoustics, extreme grounding, AC parameters,
Extreme mechanical isolation.

 

[Elliot G.]

I judge every component and system the same, by listing their attributes or cons. This can be very tricky due to the fact than when listening a component you’re basically judging an entire system, room, and calibration. This is why you must audition same component under the same system when A-B. Luckily I have listened to Wadax with very familiar components and many systems worldwide. Heavily calibrated systems speaker positioning, room acoustics, extreme grounding, AC parameters,
Extreme mechanical isolation.

that's wonderful but you didn't answer the question I asked. I asked about YOUR products versus the competition where you are priced a 5 -10 the multiples of theirs.
I accept you have an opinion and I wasn't asking your process or methodology

 

[Tripoint Audio]

that's wonderful but you didn't answer the question I asked. I asked about YOUR products versus the competition where you are priced a 5 -10 the multiples of theirs.
I accept you have an opinion and I wasn't asking your process or methodology

I judge my own Tripoint products the same way, by attributes. I have never used numbers to differentiate from the different models. I also don’t use numbers on competitors products when asked.

 

[Elliot G.]

I judge my own Tripoint products the same way, by attributes. I have never used numbers to differentiate from the different models. I also don’t use numbers on competitors products when asked.

I guess you don't want to address my question but thanks anyway.

 

[Tripoint Audio]

I guess you don't want to address my question but thanks anyway.

Please explain what I didn’t address. I was very clear with my last statement.

 

[godofwealth]

I often suggest to people here that price is only slightly positively correlated with sound quality.

If I told any of my engineering friends that audiophiles buy power cords that sell for over 10 grand, they’d laugh their heads off and strongly advise these folks to see a psychiatrist. Being a high end audiophile for forty years has inured me to the price sticker shock, but since I have an engineering background, there are some bridges that are too far for even me to cross. I could easily afford to buy a power cord for 10 grand, but I would never been able to make peace with my left brain. Ditto buying a media server for six figures. Or a high end loudspeaker for half a million dollars.

I’d rather spend that money on yearly symphony concerts or La Scala opera tickets with a nice stay in some comfy hotel in Milan for many years. But I’m old enough to realize everyone is free to spend their hard earned money however they choose. There’s no rationality in high end audio. Never was and never will be. It’s an all consuming passion and only the purchaser of such products has to justify its purchase to himself or herself.

 

[spiritofmusic]

If I told any of my engineering friends that audiophiles buy power cords that sell for over 10 grand, they’d laugh their heads off and strongly advise these folks to see a psychiatrist. Being a high end audiophile for forty years has inured me to the price sticker shock, but since I have an engineering background, there are some bridges that are too far for even me to cross. I could easily afford to buy a power cord for 10 grand, but I would never been able to make peace with my left brain. Ditto buying a media server for six figures. Or a high end loudspeaker for half a million dollars.

I’d rather spend that money on yearly symphony concerts or La Scala opera tickets with a nice stay in some comfy hotel in Milan for many years. But I’m old enough to realize everyone is free to spend their hard earned money however they choose. There’s no rationality in high end audio. Never was and never will be. It’s an all consuming passion and only the purchaser of such products has to justify its purchase to himself or herself.

Yes, but when that session starts, and the music is just magical, you forget about all those invoices, lol.

 

[Audiocrack]

I guess you don't want to address my question but thanks anyway.

Your question is totally irrelevant as regards the topic of this thread and seems - to me - to be an ad hominem attack.

 

[microstrip]

I often suggest to people here that price is only slightly positively correlated with sound quality.

I say that this correlation strongly depends on competence and expertise of the buyer. If you wisely spend more you can get a better sounding system.

Surely sound quality is a system property, we can't focus on poorly matching components.

 

[caesar]

I often suggest to people here that price is only slightly positively correlated with sound quality.

Price is correlated to quality for people who find a certain product that meets their preferences and they enjoyable.

If someone doesn't' find Wilson audio enjoyable, they will likely think of they guys who bought the Wamm with many d'agostinos as an idiot who overpaid...

likely here we will find guys who prefer the msb sonic signature as not overpriced when the dac near $100k, while others who find their sound too smoothed over think those guys have been ripped off... and same for wadax...

 

[microstrip]

If I told any of my engineering friends that audiophiles buy power cords that sell for over 10 grand, they’d laugh their heads off and strongly advise these folks to see a psychiatrist.

Well, engineers are involved in the project and building of ultra expensive products that are no indispensable to mankind. They should be prepared to understand such products and human behavior. I taught engineers and demoed them the effect of such ultra high price cables - engineers should be able to admit that they can't know everything and reality is complex.

Being a high end audiophile for forty years has inured me to the price sticker shock, but since I have an engineering background, there are some bridges that are too far for even me to cross.

My major bridge is budgetary - I accept that this hobby is essentially superfluous, and there are limits on how much I want to spend in it.

I could easily afford to buy a power cord for 10 grand, but I would never been able to make peace with my left brain. Ditto buying a media server for six figures. Or a high end loudspeaker for half a million dollars.

If I bought power cables for 10 grand each I could not afford other expensive components. I have rational reasons behind my budget splitting.
But I admit I have tried a set of power cables costing about 30k each in my system - I was curious.

I’d rather spend that money on yearly symphony concerts or La Scala opera tickets with a nice stay in some comfy hotel in Milan for many years. But I’m old enough to realize everyone is free to spend their hard earned money however they choose. There’s no rationality in high end audio. Never was and never will be. It’s an all consuming passion and only the purchaser of such products has to justify its purchase to himself or herself.

For me this hobby is more than just music. Music is surely part of it, but evaluating, set-up and changing, as well as social life are part of the hobby.
But when I can I can I go to concerts.

 

[microstrip]

Price is correlated to quality for people who find a certain product that meets their preferences and they enjoyable.

Isn't it the objective of the hobby?

If someone doesn't' find Wilson audio enjoyable, they will likely think of they guys who bought the Wamm with many d'agostinos as an idiot who overpaid...

Only if they do not have the minimum knowledge about the high-end and preference.

likely here we will find guys who prefer the msb sonic signature as not overpriced when the dac near $100k, while others who find their sound too smoothed over think those guys have been ripped off... and same for wadax...

No reference to dCS? I feel disappointed ...

 

[caesar]

If I told any of my engineering friends that audiophiles buy power cords that sell for over 10 grand, they’d laugh their heads off and strongly advise these folks to see a psychiatrist. Being a high end audiophile for forty years has inured me to the price sticker shock, but since I have an engineering background, there are some bridges that are too far for even me to cross. I could easily afford to buy a power cord for 10 grand, but I would never been able to make peace with my left brain. Ditto buying a media server for six figures. Or a high end loudspeaker for half a million dollars.

I’d rather spend that money on yearly symphony concerts or La Scala opera tickets with a nice stay in some comfy hotel in Milan for many years. But I’m old enough to realize everyone is free to spend their hard earned money however they choose. There’s no rationality in high end audio. Never was and never will be. It’s an all consuming passion and only the purchaser of such products has to justify its purchase to himself or herself.

Where would this world be if people couldn't choose for themselves?

 

[caesar]

Isn't it the objective of the hobby?



Only if they do not have the minimum knowledge about the high-end and preference.



No reference to dCS? I feel disappointed ...

Hahahaha. dCS is not my cup of tea , taste and preference wise. But I greatly respect them as engineers. Look at how huge those boxes are for taiko olympus - made by a semi-clueless DIY guy, vs the size of dCS

 

[caesar]

Isn't it the objective of the hobby?

Isn't it the objective of the hobby?

Yes for some but not for Unfortunately, not for many folks. I have met a lot of guys who lack confidence to buy what they like. And it's a different hobby for everyone. Some people feel more assured buying what everyone else has. It not only gives them a peace of mind of owning a product from a more "stable" company but also helps them engage and socially connect with others who have them same thing, which is pleasurable in its own right.

 

[gleeds]

Both DACs stand as excellent examples of what's possible at the price point from reputable companies. I have a client who bought the Wadax Studio and loves it. Knowing his desire for products with exceptional build quality that also represent high value for money, the Wadax was an obvious choice.

I heard an early version of the Cascade at Munich 2024, and its quality was immediately apparent. Vassil of Taiko NA was kind enough to facilitate our use of a Taiko Olympus with the internal DAC in our room at the recent California Audio Show, allowing Ron and me to experience it. To my ear, it was among the best digital I have heard. I also loved the sound of Steve Williams' Taiko/Horizon XDMI. I spent time listening to Elliot's and Robert Harley's Big Wadax rig. Unfortunately, in each case, the rooms, speakers, and electronics were different, so other than to say they were all enjoyable, it's challenging to make precise comparisons.

I agree 100% with Elliot and Synaxis that anyone who invests in audio at these levels must ensure the loudspeaker set-up is optimized if they expect to achieve anywhere near the full potential of their system. In my experience, loudspeaker set-up and system optimization are very much an art born of time, expertise, and a keen ability to listen.

Thankfully, we are not arguing about vinyl vs. digital again. Today, numerous digital products are available at various price points that can bring us closer to music.

 

[caesar]

... facilitate our use of a Taiko Olympus with the internal DAC in our room at the recent California Audio Show, allowing Ron and me to experience it. To my ear, it was among the best digital I have heard. I also loved the sound of Steve Williams' Taiko/Horizon XDMI. I spent time listening to Elliot's and Robert Harley's Big Wadax rig. Unfortunately, in each case, the rooms, speakers, and electronics were different, so other than to say they were all enjoyable, it's challenging to make precise comparisons.

..

sorry to hear that. taiko internal dac is an embarassment to my ears... lampizator is better with taiko, but dynamically challenged. thanks for revealing that. I guess it's good to know our tastes do not match... imagine how much better your room would have sounded if you guys used digital from talented digital engineers.

 

[Kingrex]

but I would never been able to make peace with my left brain.

For a long time I have pondered what keeps me from buying something that is well within my price range. I think your spot on. There is that little left brain questioning why. I have plenty of cash at this time. But I am very restricted in what I purchase. Across all hobbies and wants. Part of the left brain recognition is seeing all the Junk I have accumulated over the years. If moving teaches you one thing, its how much stuff Americans buy. I have no room in my 3 bay RV garage. Its packed. And I have a additional 2 car garage that is pretty stuffed. Unloading the stuff is a headache. I hate throwing it out.

Maybe I should thank the Ahole Bob Foster who use to go to all the shows with me pitching my panels. You know, the guy who dresses like he thinks he's the Audiophile Junkie. He stole some equipment from me and we have no communication now. Oddly its one less component I have to box up and sell.

 

[rau]

sorry to hear that. taiko internal dac is an embarassment to my ears... lampizator is better with taiko, but dynamically challenged. thanks for revealing that. I guess it's good to know our tastes do not match... imagine how much better your room would have sounded if you guys used digital from talented digital engineers.

I tried the taiko DAC and it wasn't for me , I'm told with 400 hours of break in it really shines . Problem is I couldn't listen that long . I did get around to hooking up my horizon 360 with KBL XDMI cable and was very impressed. Taiko is supposed to release a v2 DAC card , I would be willing to try at that time .