DSD 256fs and beyond.....

[Bruce B]

Much ballyhoo has been written about the new availability of being able to capture sound at 11.2MHz There have been a few files trickling around the internet touting native DSD256fs but in reality, all we've seen are files that have been upsampled.
A few months ago 5/4 Productions captured the first commercial recording in DSD256fs, but as I recall, this was just from a back-up unit. The "real" recording was done at DSD64fs.

There are a couple of DAC's and even a couple of ADC's that can pass native DSD256fs. One being the Horus, though this could only be done for the first time just a couple of months ago. The exaSound DAC and the Ayre QA-9 can operate up to DS256fs as well.

So, is DSD256fs all that it's cracked up to be? From what I've heard and read so far, not really. I can not tell the difference between DSD128fs and DSD256fs. I've tried and failed. Either I have tin ears, or some people have expectation bias. DSD256fs was developed to better facilitate Post Production. Long has been the problem of HF build-up working in DSD, especially using multi-track. DSD256fs pushes that HF noise up another octave so multi-track recordings will have a better chance at staying under the Scarlet book specs for HF noise.

In my studio, using music recorded from tape and location, I still think the Grimm AD1 at DSD64fs and the Horus at DSD128fs are the best DSD recording available. Which you prefer is up for debate. What I will be doing is taking my Pyramix/Horus unit to RMAF and you can listen for yourself what DSD you like the best. For me, I'll still hang on to my Grimm....

 

[cjfrbw]

I seem to remember the lady engineer at CAS 2013 stating that the 256f advantage was for editing purposes, mainly.

 

[Bruce B]

Yes, that is correct. I see so many posts over at CA and SA-CD.net stating that DSD256fs sounds so much better than 64/128fs (night/day... whatever adjetive you want). That's hogwash! DSD128fs and DSD256fs are essentially the same exact file with just the ultra high frequency changing. DSD256fs was developed to get around the problems associated with multi-track mixing and such.

 

[tailspn]

Yes, that is correct. I see so many posts over at CA and SA-CD.net stating that DSD256fs sounds so much better than 64/128fs (night/day... whatever adjetive you want). That's hogwash!

Hey Bruce,


It would be interesting to see you post this over there, it would drive them nuts!

AND THANKS!

Tom

 

[Bruce B]

Hey Bruce,


It would be interesting to see you post this over there, it would drive them nuts!

AND THANKS!

Tom

I've been banned at CA and Zeus has a pretty tight reign at SA-CD. You don't think I've been beat up enough already??

 

[tailspn]

In retrospect, you're absolutely right. Why spoil the party. DSD has been so maligned in the past with falsehoods and technical ignorance, it deserves some breathing room until greater studio adoption produces greater broad based content.

 

[Julf]

I've been banned at CA

Just curious, whet did you get banned for?

 

[cpp]

Just curious, whet did you get banned for?

Bruce no doubt told the truth

 

[tailspn]

Bruce no doubt told the truth

Stephen Best, owner of sa-cd.net has several site rules. One of which is there will be NO discussion tolerated about ripping SACD's. Bruce commented once that it not only can be accomplished, but he did so professionally, and detailed the hardware used. Blammo, instant ban!

 

[Bruce B]

Stephen Best, owner of sa-cd.net has several site rules. One of which is there will be NO discussion tolerated about ripping SACD's. Bruce commented once that it not only can be accomplished, but he did so professionally, and detailed the hardware used. Blammo, instant ban!

And also, I had just spoken to Claude Cellier at CES when he came to my room explaining to me about the Emotion architecture and also about the Mykerinos cards that Chris C. had over at CA. When I tried to "correct" Chris and explain what Claude had told me.... Blammo.... again!

I guess just as well.... I took a pretty hard beating over there when the HDtracks fiasco started up.

 

[Steve Williams]

And also, I had just spoken to Claude Cellier at CES when he came to my room explaining to me about the Emotion architecture and also about the Mykerinos cards that Chris C. had over at CA. When I tried to "correct" Chris and explain what Claude had told me.... Blammo.... again!

I guess just as well.... I took a pretty hard beating over there when the HDtracks fiasco started up.

you're safe here with us Bruce

 

[Julf]

I guess just as well.... I took a pretty hard beating over there when the HDtracks fiasco started up.

Ah, yes. I am sure you are glad to know that they have mostly moved away from spectrograms (relying on your ears rather than spectrograms is a good idea, but preferably the conclusion should be "if even an upsampling sounds really good, maybe that hi-res thing isn't so important" rather than "even if your numbers and graphs claim it is an upsampling, my ears tell me that it clearly isn't"), and now seem obsessed with measuring dynamic range

 

[cpp]

And also, I had just spoken to Claude Cellier at CES when he came to my room explaining to me about the Emotion architecture and also about the Mykerinos cards that Chris C. had over at CA. When I tried to "correct" Chris and explain what Claude had told me.... Blammo.... again!

I say nothing to lose sleep over..

 

[Bruce B]

I say nothing to lose sleep over..

That's for sure. I'm very appreciative of Steve and Amir to have given me a platform here to talk about new and correct information.

 

[Steve Williams]

I can honestly say that I've personally learned a lot from your threads here Bruce.

Kudos

 

[Ron Party]

I can honestly say that I've personally learned a lot from your threads here Bruce.

Kudos

A very sincere +1 from me as well.

 

[microstrip]

I can honestly say that I've personally learned a lot from your threads here Bruce.

Kudos

Also learned a lot, and enjoyed most of his posts. He is one our real experts.

 

[Nevillekapadia]

I would say the same for Bruce too. His knowledge, experience and industry credentials are tops in my books.

 

[Bruce B]

For anyone interested, I'll be playing DSD256fs tape transfers at RMAF in room 8000, JPS Labs. You'll be able to hear finer details with the Abyss Headphones.

I believe this may be the first show where native DSD256fs files are played!

 

[mep]

I'm looking forward to it Bruce.