Visit to Henk van der Hoeven -- Apogee Acoustics Re-builder/Restorer

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
12,924
3,572
763
E. England
So, having heard a wide range of fully SS amped systems, and other than one, struggling to see how I could live without tubes in the chain, how does one consider Scintillas?

Even KeithR using Ampzilla on YGs isn't saying their warm presentation is tube-like.
 

User211

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2014
2,612
867
383
In a 35 by 14 foot rectangle, which model would you go for Graz - just by your personal pref.
 
Of all the classic Apogee's, properly restored with sensible options, and used properly amped in suitably sized rooms to allow for proper breathing and with a solid back wall - the FR and Scintilla would be my top choices from yesteryear. Duetta Signatures can work very well in smaller rooms also, Diva when modified with a FO MR, and driven with class A power that can handle the modification without effort. Tube lovers - a tube pre in the chain with class A power is fine imho. All original Apogee panels that have never been restored are overdue the full service...

I am right on the edge of release of a new serious Diva, the first pair is going to a client with 400w tube power amps actually...
 
My listening room at home is 13x39, I have heard classic Scintilla, Diva and Duetta Signatures work well in that room among others - FR are too big for it to get into their stride.

I have an interesting new amp and it's designer coming for a play date within the hour in the (larger) main development room on the new metal chassis Apogee Diva A9's, one of those days I really look forward to! :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: christoph

User211

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2014
2,612
867
383
I regard that as seriously good news Graz.

I also have an approx 60 by 28 room but the chances of the wife accepting FR in that are slim and not having them saves an awful lot of money.

Good to know DS will work.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
16,298
6,027
1,215
London
Flo, who owned all the apogee models, too rated it as grands, FR, scintilla, then diva, in that order.
 
In the UK you could open a roller rink in such a room, perhaps a compromise your wife could live with? :)

Start = Halcro CD/PSA DSD/Nuvista M3/ Apogee Diva Advance 9's
Guest = PC with USB cable (digital in) or Halcro/PSA (RCA in) into the Heschl HAL 350 / Apogee Diva Advance 9's

Interesting day meeting new people and hearing a new perspective on the new Diva A9's. Guests were an amp/dac with the Heschl people, a new brand made down here. A most positive experience, and the people behind it were interesting to speak to also - beyond hifi.

PC into the Heschl dac direct won out over analog in, a clear lead. Very neutral, joining a very short list of truly neutral amplifiers with near vanishing signatures I have experienced. Fast rise, effortless power, with excellent panel control. Great space around all performers, comfortable across the musical spectrum. The time passed fast (4 hours), and in that time absolute extrapolation of an absolute amplifier signature was far from obvious. Beyond that I will have to think about the experience further, but the product is certainly most promising...

https://heschl.com.au/

Graz
 

christoph

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2015
3,108
2,278
470
Principality of Liechtenstein
So, having heard a wide range of fully SS amped systems, and other than one, struggling to see how I could live without tubes in the chain, how does one consider Scintillas?

The ime best sounding amps for the Scintillas (and we tried dozens!!) are the Lamm M1.x hybrid mono blocks with a very good tube preamp in front.
They drove the Scinnies with ease while sounding VERY good

On the Studio Grands I prefer my KR Audio SETs over the Lamms though
 

User211

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2014
2,612
867
383
Gotta ask Christoph. Why did you keep the Studio Grand and lose the Scinnies? Amp practicality?
 

christoph

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2015
3,108
2,278
470
Principality of Liechtenstein

christoph

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2015
3,108
2,278
470
Principality of Liechtenstein
Gotta ask Christoph. Why did you keep the Studio Grand and lose the Scinnies? Amp practicality?
I'm almost embarrassed to say :oops:
A friend of mine wanted exactly that pair of Scinnies REALLY really badly so I let him have them :cool:

My wife didn't like that move at all as the Scinnies were her favorite speakers I had at that time :eek:

But Henk assured me that he would gladly make me a new pair ;)
...and I still have those Lamms, just i case :D


scintilla_studio grand.jpg
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: cjfrbw

User211

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2014
2,612
867
383
I still think Scinnies are insane. Which of course they are. But insanity is always fun in hi-fi.

Maybe take Henk on that offer one day.

Jon is just finishing some Scinnies FWIW. Some of that Scinnie's design will have as a feature something we have been discussing together for a very long time.

I think they are going to be a very good pair of Scinnies and their new owner is going to be a lucky man.
 

christoph

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2015
3,108
2,278
470
Principality of Liechtenstein
I think they are going to be a very good pair of Scinnies and their new owner is going to be a lucky man.
What amps will he use on them?
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
12,924
3,572
763
E. England
I still think Scinnies are insane. Which of course they are. But insanity is always fun in hi-fi.

Maybe take Henk on that offer one day.

Jon is just finishing some Scinnies FWIW. Some of that Scinnie's design will have as a feature something we have been discussing together for a very long time.

I think they are going to be a very good pair of Scinnies and their new owner is going to be a lucky man.
Justin, I was talking to Jon and the prospective owner over 2 years ago on those. Rome obviously wasn't built in a day. Owner was stressing that Gryphon amps might not be sufficiently powerful.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
16,298
6,027
1,215
London

christoph

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2015
3,108
2,278
470
Principality of Liechtenstein
He owns the gryphon mephisto with AR ref 6 or ref 10 preamp
If those Gryphons can handle the 1 ohm flat impedance of the Scinnies, that might sound pretty good

I just checked on their webpage:
1.4k watts RMS per channel into 1 Ohm and 6k watts peak per channel into 0.5 Ohm :eek:
That should suffice :cool::p
 
Last edited:

User211

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2014
2,612
867
383
Yeah. More than pussy power.

1.2kW is enough. So that's overkill!!!:)

Achievement.
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
12,924
3,572
763
E. England
So why did the prospective owner doubt his Gryphons? He was looking at Colosseum monos.
 

christoph

Well-Known Member
Dec 12, 2015
3,108
2,278
470
Principality of Liechtenstein

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing