Vishay Z-Foil vs Audio Note Non-Magnetic Resistors

[adrianywu]

Not to worry. I give parts a large margin of safety when I spec them.

Caddock makes excellent parts, great choice. Mind one thing, they are not as resistant (hehehe) to overloading. This is common for all film resistors. Wirewounds are durable since their resistive element is thicker and has more thermal mass

 

[AMR / iFi audio]

Not to worry. I give parts a large margin of safety when I spec them.

That's great I dropped the warning just in case. Different technologies have their ups and downs. All of the foil resistors are the cleanest sounding.

 

[E.simpson]

Hey guys. what do you think about using 1/2w z foils, audio note silver tantalum or silver niobium resistors after the rca input, then volume pot to coupling capacitors on the input rca stage? Currently I swapped some takman reys that are 0.25w, to audio note silver niobium’s 0.5w and it became quite a bit more powerful to the point where my amp is losing some volume and it enters clipping a bit earlier from the extra power of bass. The sound however is much more detailed even at low volumes and each sound is individually represented with great dynamics maybe a bit too much, but, it would be good for live music or strictly voices and live instruments with bigger speakers.

Im wondering if any other resistor will do exactly the same as what the takman rey does but just better in every way, is very musical, but doesn’t increase the bass anymore than a takman rey resistor. The leads just about fit into the holes with the silver niobium’s and they really project the music as big but not shouty, smooth and warm but clear. It did also sound tuby on some songs, also the transient and soundstage became more of it’s a real sound now, it doesn’t wrap around your ear fully and into your soul, it doesn’t create that mystical presence that digs into you with its transients and stereo projection. It probably isn’t as wide but I have not burned it in fully because I think It would be better to just remove it due to the increase of bass.

So does anyone have any advice on what’s best? Is the Vishay z foil a good option right after the capacitors? I have an ss small amplifier and the values of the next small 0.25w resistors, which are also takman rey literally are next to the tripath chip and have values that don’t match these best audio resistors.

 

[adrianywu]

Hey guys. what do you think about using 1/2w z foils, audio note silver tantalum or silver niobium resistors after the rca input, then volume pot to coupling capacitors on the input rca stage? Currently I swapped some takman reys that are 0.25w, to audio note silver niobium’s 0.5w and it became quite a bit more powerful to the point where my amp is losing some volume and it enters clipping a bit earlier from the extra power of bass. The sound however is much more detailed even at low volumes and each sound is individually represented with great dynamics maybe a bit too much, but, it would be good for live music or strictly voices and live instruments with bigger speakers.

Im wondering if any other resistor will do exactly the same as what the takman rey does but just better in every way, is very musical, but doesn’t increase the bass anymore than a takman rey resistor. The leads just about fit into the holes with the silver niobium’s and they really project the music as big but not shouty, smooth and warm but clear. It did also sound tuby on some songs, also the transient and soundstage became more of it’s a real sound now, it doesn’t wrap around your ear fully and into your soul, it doesn’t create that mystical presence that digs into you with its transients and stereo projection. It probably isn’t as wide but I have not burned it in fully because I think It would be better to just remove it due to the increase of bass.

So does anyone have any advice on what’s best? Is the Vishay z foil a good option right after the capacitors? I have an ss small amplifier and the values of the next small 0.25w resistors, which are also takman rey literally are next to the tripath chip and have values that don’t match these best audio resistors.

I view boutique "audiophile" components with suspicion. For sensitive positions, I tend to use bulk foil resistors, including Z foils. They are very transparent and completely neutral. I have never tried Audio Note parts.

 

[E.simpson]

I view boutique "audiophile" components with suspicion. For sensitive positions, I tend to use bulk foil resistors, including Z foils. They are very transparent and completely neutral. I have never tried Audio Note parts.

I see. I have two toroidal transformer within inches of the resistors, and although they are protected with thin steel casing I’m concerned it will affect the z foil.
Also my amp is an ss amp that originally is more 2 dimensional in sound with all Takman resistors which give a very nice hifi sound.

I have two versions of the amp, the new and an older one and I’ve noticed the two resistors right after the foil caps after rca and volume pot are rated at 15k on the new and 14k on the older. The older amp had more air and warm atmosphere with how it presented its air and the the new amp with the 15kohm resistor had less but was a little more direct in its sound and tonally rich with a touch more bass but lost a little bit of that magical air touch and some of the very faint airy sounds.

I couldn’t happen to notice when I swapped the 14kohm Takmans to 15kohm an silver niobium’s that the amps sound suddenly sounded a lot more like the newer one with 15kohm resistors but with way more detail and realness and richness in the tone, but also more bass. I’m starting to think these resistors help filter frequencies coming in from the rca, all 50khz and above as when I select this function on Roon to filter 50khz and above I also lose some of the magical air details that give the music its breath (yes it’s an atmosphere you can hear).

unfortunately there are no 14kohm z foils only 15kohm. The amp already sounds slightly cool and revealing with stock resistors, a hint of warmth and the bass is enough but it doesn’t lose the hifi sound but is near the edge of that spectrum so I can enjoy vast amounts of music genres still. If anything the mids could sound just a little better tonally and the highs with more detail which I don’t think the z foil will do it I remove the Takman for it.

anyway, I will put some an silver tantalum’s in the new version of the amp since it has the same rating for resistors and has some other updated small components that isn’t the same on the older one which maybe help support the 15kohm change perhaps, which are all on the input side of the chip.

I do like the sound of the older amp so I’ll keep the 14kohm resistors but I am tempted to try the an silver tantalum’s in its place to see how that compares to silver niobium’s, I also have 1w shinkoh tantalum resistors I want to install on the output side near the capacitors which has a takman rey there. The leads are too thick on the shinkoh so I’ll shave them down and see how they sound there as I heard they are also clear and detailed but I really am thinking to just put them in now while the niobium’s are in. I’ll see anyway, I have ordered larger Takmans as I heard larger resistors of same value sound better so I will replace two small ones with larger versions, these two come straight out of the chip and then the trace lines go right back to it so it’s got an important function, they are rated at 20kohm which only the z foils can replace. These resistors are 0.25w I am replacing on the input side with 0.5w and 1w is on the output side which I will keep the same. The amp seems to have more power with 15kohm, a little too much, which is how the new one sounds but with I can take it louder before clipping.

anyone has any suggestions? If maybe the Shinkos help with bass reduction and warmth so I could drop the an and leave in all Takmans and just replace the 1w with shinko? Or if it won’t alter the sound much in the output stage or?

 

[flowcharts]

Have you given the AN resistors 200-300 hours to settle before making comparisons?

I've used AN Tantalum, Niobium, & Niobium silver, but not enough to be able to narrow down specific characteristics. I can just say they've always improved on the generic metal foils they've replaced.

I have used Z-foils (charcroft) enough to get a sense of their character. They just sound like the resistor's been taken out of the signal path.

 

[Salectric]

Hey guys. what do you think about using 1/2w z foils, audio note silver tantalum or silver niobium resistors after the rca input, then volume pot to coupling capacitors on the input rca stage? Currently I swapped some takman reys that are 0.25w, to audio note silver niobium’s 0.5w and it became quite a bit more powerful to the point where my amp is losing some volume and it enters clipping a bit earlier from the extra power of bass. The sound however is much more detailed even at low volumes and each sound is individually represented with great dynamics maybe a bit too much, but, it would be good for live music or strictly voices and live instruments with bigger speakers.

Im wondering if any other resistor will do exactly the same as what the takman rey does but just better in every way, is very musical, but doesn’t increase the bass anymore than a takman rey resistor. The leads just about fit into the holes with the silver niobium’s and they really project the music as big but not shouty, smooth and warm but clear. It did also sound tuby on some songs, also the transient and soundstage became more of it’s a real sound now, it doesn’t wrap around your ear fully and into your soul, it doesn’t create that mystical presence that digs into you with its transients and stereo projection. It probably isn’t as wide but I have not burned it in fully because I think It would be better to just remove it due to the increase of bass.

So does anyone have any advice on what’s best? Is the Vishay z foil a good option right after the capacitors? I have an ss small amplifier and the values of the next small 0.25w resistors, which are also takman rey literally are next to the tripath chip and have values that don’t match these best audio resistors.

You say the resistor in question is “after” the input jack but before the volume control. Is it a loading resistor (one lead going to the signal input and one lead going to ground)? Or is it in series with the signal input?

If it’s a loading resistor, I highly recommend a 2w Audio Note Silver Tantalum. In my experience, that is the best sounding load resistor, better than AN’s regular tantalums and better than regular or silver Niobium. But only the 2 watt silver tantalum.

In series the bulk foil should do fine.

 

[E.simpson]

Have you given the AN resistors 200-300 hours to settle before making comparisons?

I've used AN Tantalum, Niobium, & Niobium silver, but not enough to be able to narrow down specific characteristics. I can just say they've always improved on the generic metal foils they've replaced.

I have used Z-foils (charcroft) enough to get a sense of their character. They just sound like the resistor's been taken out of the signal path.

I haven’t given them that much time no, but the amp I have only puts out 60w a channel and that resistor reduced total volume output and increased bass noticeably.

 

[E.simpson]

You say the resistor in question is “after” the input jack but before the volume control. Is it a loading resistor (one lead going to the signal input and one lead going to ground)? Or is it in series with the signal input?

If it’s a loading resistor, I highly recommend a 2w Audio Note Silver Tantalum. In my experience, that is the best sounding load resistor, better than AN’s regular tantalums and better than regular or silver Niobium. But only the 2 watt silver tantalum.

In series the bulk foil should do fine.

 

[E.simpson]

The legs on the right side of these foil caps go straight to those two resistors which I have changed to a silver niobium’s and these takman resistors are 0.25w each.

 

[adrianywu]

I haven’t given them that much time no, but the amp I have only puts out 60w a channel and that resistor reduced total volume output and increased bass noticeably.

The effect you notice might be due to the reactive characteristics of the parts that altered the frequency response of your preamp. You might like the effect but that does not mean these resistors are "better". This is like adding MSG when you are cooking. Many "audiophile" parts color the sound due to their poor technical performance characteristics.

 

[E.simpson]

The effect you notice might be due to the reactive characteristics of the parts that altered the frequency response of your preamp. You might like the effect but that does not mean these resistors are "better". This is like adding MSG when you are cooking. Many "audiophile" parts color the sound due to their poor technical performance characteristics.

What I am trying to say is this amplifier has multiple versions and the latest one has a 15k ohm takman rey, the older one has a 14k ohm takman rey which I can’t seem to find anywhere (they are specifically made for musical applications as they say), so I was forced to buy a 15kohm an resistor since they don’t have 14k. I have noticed that in doing so it has changed the sound of the amp and it now has similar sound characteristics as the new version which also had less 30khz airyness to the music that would dig deep into you (I think the resistors value change from 14-15k did this as I noticed the same thing when the resistors were stock when I compared the two amps). Yes it might have added a little colouration but I can only hear it in the 200hz range on some things and the resistor wasn’t burned in at all. everything is definitely a little thicker with amazing texture but it sounds incredible like everything is in front of you and the speakers are not there.

There’s a lot more power and I think it’s due to the silver as I have copper and silver RCA leads on two separate inputs to my amp and the silver is louder on the same setting as copper and a lot clearer with great individual textures and the copper is a bit warmer and brings all the sounds together instead of isolating them and everything smooths out but you still hear the details, maybe not as in your face as silver but hey.

unfortunately I removed the an silver niobium’s because I thought the excess power was too much for the amp and speakers in its speed and power, just a little. Only after removing I installed the RCA’s into the backplate for the copper cables side and realised that the silver allowed more power into the signal compared to copper. But still I already think it’s because of the value and I disliked that extra power that some people would think is perfect, but my amp isn’t that strong and I have a purpose for it’s location. So I will install them in the newer version instead to see if it works better in that.

As for the pre amp, it is in my pc which has RCA outputs and a separate lead that goes to headphone amp (it’s a sound blaster ae-9 with sparkos ss3601 & 2) and I can hear how the DAC sounds at anytime of the day to compare it to the amp and speakers.

it might be a “boutique” resistor but remember the whole point of it is, is that we all know material composition can create new things and can also change how atoms and elements behave. All elements and chemicals or substances have their own qualities to them so if a “boutique” audiophile component maker decided to create a resistor with different materials for a different outcome they would have researched and developed it in a certain way that would meet certain regulations and sound acceptable and if not better in one or more ways.

this is fundamentally how all things are made, just all are made in different ways to do the same job or different jobs with different materials or sharing primary materials(like copper), It’s like saying there is only one way get over a wall.

 

[Barry]

I recently tried the Audio Note Niobium 1W resistors in my preamp. I put them in the inputs of the signal path, before the gain stage, in place of TX 2575 (naked Vishay Z-foils). I'm a big fan of the Z-foils, but using too many is a little bit too much of a good thing. Over time, I noticed the result was a little lean and hard sounding on some recordings.

The Niobiums have better tone color, maybe just a tad more depth, and cured the problem. In terms of transparency/presence and low noise, they didn't give up much, if anything, to the Z-foils. It was a worthwhile trade-off. I still have Vishays on the outputs. They pair well together.

These AN resistors are labeled as 2% although the 8 matched ones I got were less than 1% worst case (Vishays are .1%!). Others who have tried them have stated the Niobiums require at least 300 hours of burn-in before they sound their best. I would agree.

 

[bazelio]

Has anyone compared the AN silver tants vs the silver niobiums? I'm curious how they compare and contrast to each other.

 

[E.simpson]

I recently tried the Audio Note Niobium 1W resistors in my preamp. I put them in the inputs of the signal path, before the gain stage, in place of TX 2575 (naked Vishay Z-foils). I'm a big fan of the Z-foils, but using too many is a little bit too much of a good thing. Over time, I noticed the result was a little lean and hard sounding on some recordings.

The Niobiums have better tone color, maybe just a tad more depth, and cured the problem. In terms of transparency/presence and low noise, they didn't give up much, if anything, to the Z-foils. It was a worthwhile trade-off. I still have Vishays on the outputs. They pair well together.

These AN resistors are labeled as 2% although the 8 matched ones I got were less than 1% worst case (Vishays are .1%!). Others who have tried them have stated the Niobiums require at least 300 hours of burn-in before they sound their best. I would agree.

I only have the silver’s I’m not sure what the difference is compared between silver and just standard niobium. I didn’t notice any brightness on the silver an niobium’s i tried, but i did notice the presentation of music was a bit more slightly forward and I did lose some of those airy leading edge details that would float in the atmosphere, however I did not break it in past an hour simply because of the fact that the power increase was a little too much. I think me going from standard to silver is probably what’s causing the power increase because of the silver and less resistance in the signal path. maybe I should try the normal ones as I did notice that silver in the signal rca increases the input loudness.

 

[E.simpson]

Has anyone compared the AN silver tants vs the silver niobiums? I'm curious how they compare and contrast to each other.

I have silver an’s and tants but I cannot keep swapping them out for back to back comparisons due to the pcb getting damaged as these legs are slightly bigger. however im starting to think silver in general increases the live feel and soeskerless presentation, and dynamics so much more that copper to the point where voices and sounds all sound 3d and very real.

 

[E.simpson]

I have silver an’s and tants but I cannot keep swapping them out for back to back comparisons due to the pcb getting damaged as these legs are slightly bigger. however im starting to think silver in general increases the live feel and soeskerless presentation, and dynamics so much more that copper to the point where voices and sounds all sound 3d and very real.

Ok I’ve installed the silver tants in a way that won’t damage the pcb and I can swap, and it’s definitely smoother and a different kind of warm, the instruments blend better but the detail isn’t as much as silver niobium, the detail in those were extreme, voices were a little heavier the highs and lows were very detailed and dynamic with great depth but for rhythmic music it didn’t work as well. it seemed like it wanted to show you live performances over produced music. The tantalum seems a little rolled off on the highs but it’s song dependant and the tone is great, it also has less bass and overall power than the silver an niobium’s, but those are 2% rated (even though bazilio said they are actually more like 1%) and I’m not sure if that’s what’s causing the loudness difference as my amp uses 1%. There is less low volume detail compared to the niobium’s but again I’ve only just installed them and didn’t give either time to burn in fully. The tants do sound more natural overall in their presentation even though it may have less overall detail it has a better balance between emotion and raw detail and warmth. I’m liking the tants so I will keep them and let them burn in. These are in the input position on my solid state amp just after the coupling caps.

 

[christensenleif@msn.com]

I went from AN 2 watt tants that´s been in my 300Bs for years to AN 2w Silver Niobium and after some weeks I concluded that they were a tad too analytical in my system
then got tipped about some vintage Klangfilm Rosental resistors as slightly more "humane" sounding......replaced the SN grid resistor on the 6C45 driver tube and lowered my shoulders
this is the only r in my 300Bs that are directly in series with the signal.....the 4 other cathode and hum resistors are still Silver N....so far....

 

[E.simpson]

I went from AN 2 watt tants that´s been in my 300Bs for years to AN 2w Silver Niobium and after some weeks I concluded that they were a tad too analytical in my system
then got tipped about some vintage Klangfilm Rosental resistors as slightly more "humane" sounding......replaced the SN grid resistor on the 6C45 driver tube and lowered my shoulders
this is the only r in my 300Bs that are directly in series with the signal.....the 4 other cathode and hum resistors are still Silver N....so far....

Unfortunately we have two completely different types of amps and resistor sizes, but I agree niobium sounded too analytical in the signal in series’s with the input caps, but wow it absolutely took my breath away with the detail my system was able to output and it was so realistic, just lacked emotion and human feeling. Regardless it was incredible to hear it and I’ll never forget it, it definitely has a very specific spot to fill.

the non magnetic silver tants are much better for me but again I’m only using 1/2 watts. Silver Niobium’s are definitely very full sounding with perfect lifelike tone. I’m curious as to how the burn in will effect the silver tantalum’s and what the difference is from first installation sound wise.

 

[christensenleif@msn.com]

what I learned and also personally tested, was that the AN 2 watt tants sounded far better than the lower w resistors
it turns out the legs are fixed in a different way on the 2watt
I´m not sure this goes for all models, but after I discovered this, I always buy the 2w
I tested the difference in AN Quest where there´s a single 1K resistor between 1 and 2 half of the 6SN7? driver tube, so very easy to test
and the difference was NOT subtle