Todd's AG Trio G3 System -- it's about time

[Uwiik]

Its ok to place the Basshorns "upside down"?

I think its possible. could be wrong thought. all side have provision for spike.

 

[the sound of Tao]

Big update!!

Spent I don’t know how long in the dealer….I opened the can of worm and tried CH L10 + iTron, still prefer G70+iTron and everyone else in the room (4 other people). They can make more money if I got hooked to CH L10 but they told me their honest opinion that G70 beat the CH L10 (in this particular setup mind you), so it’s a valid opinion.
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Then I insisted that I want to spend the time to re layout and re set the whole G3 setup, moved the basshorns vertically and put these beside the Trio (just like how Todd had it setup), setup the azimuth, tweeter plane, listening distance and everything else, took a few hours to do just that.

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Just like I expected suddenly everything sounded at least 50% better, tweeter is much more controlled and bass is way beter with both CH L10 + iTron and G70 + iTron, but again me and everyone else still prefer G70 + iTron for wider staging, much more controlled bass, way better sound separations and much much better high.

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Then we installed the G70 + Ongaku again, still with crazy salad of wires, very very long RCA interconnect, but using Siltech Double Crown power cable….. we were all in heaven…We tested audiophile recording, mediocre recording, trance music, Ed Sheeran, even Norah Jones’ “Come Away With Me” which is one of the most crapiest recording ever constantly bleeding my ears were very acceptable, we were all in heaven doesn’t matter about the quality of the recording. Even the dealer said that this is the best sound he ever heard and he can actually make much more money if he said otherwise. Me myself knew that this is it, this is my endgame system and I fell in love all over again with my Ongaku….

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I have made my decision, no iTron, yes to basshorns in one swift purchase, G70 + Ongaku, Taiko, Siltech Double Crown + Triple crown throughout, Torus AVR. Now I just need to know what the number comes to, maybe I can swing it this year, maybe I have to wait a bit more, but I don’t think I will change my mind again. I have made it clear to my wife that she has to settle with Boston GP, no Steinway this year, she is lucky she is not getting Casio keyboard.

Thanks for all positive comments and I don’t want to hijack @sbnx thread any further unless we can put this as a sticky for official Trio G3 thread. This is awesome and I am beyond happy finally finding my end game. If only this happened sooner before I spent $500.000 plus on constantly changing and replacing gears….it was damn ridiculous…

Congratulations, great outcome, spectacular setup.

 

[itay123]

So amazing, just looking at this whole process!

The SILTECH power cables especially at thet levels,
it is something that is not perceived,
how much structure it creates for the setup/results.

Enjoy, most impressive!

 

[christoph]

Its ok to place the Basshorns "upside down"?

It's probably even better because this way the horn mouth opening is waaaayyyyyyyyy longer through the floor

 

[Uwiik]

It's probably even better because this way the horn mouth opening is waaaayyyyyyyyy longer through the floor

I must try that tomorrow

 

[Uwiik]

So amazing, just looking at this whole process!

The SILTECH power cables especially at thet levels,
it is something that is not perceived,
how much structure it creates for the setup/results.

Enjoy, most impressive!

I have tried so many different cable, IMO nothing comes close to Siltech especially the double crown / triple crown level…. Never tried Odin 2 thought, gaining a lot of followers these Odin lately…

 

[christoph]

I must try that tomorrow

You already have it like that, at least according to the latest pics

 

[Uwiik]

You already have it like that, at least according to the latest pics

Ahhhh… sorry my bad, Englist is not my mother tongue, but yes, I think that was at least 30-40% improvement compared to when it was horizontal. it can be a bit overbearing on the previous setup.

 

[christoph]

Ahhhh… sorry my bad, Englist is not my mother tongue, but yes, I think that was at least 30-40% improvement compared to when it was horizontal. it can be a bit overbearing on the previous setup.

English isn't my mother language either
I'm a real big fan of your story here

 

[Uwiik]

.

I am humbled

 

[christoph]

Any chance you can get the orange ones?
And if not, what would be your color of choice for the horns?

 

[Ron Resnick]

May I just say I love this thread? I think this thread is an example of WBF at its very best.

Todd chronicling his system journey with new Trio G3s, and literally breaking new ground as he goes in terms of the precision with which he is fine-tuning the system to his ears. Is there any other Trio G3 system in the entire world to which its owner or dealer has applied Todd's level of perfectionism (including that amazing dedicated room)?

And Uwiik, leveraging Todd's experience and reporting, as well as crowdsourcing other members' opinions on amplification and system design, to solve the equation for his own dream system.

Congratulations to both of you!

 

[adyc]

May I just say I love this thread? I think this thread is an example of WBF at its very best.

Todd chronicling his system journey with new Trio G3s, and literally breaking new ground as he goes in terms of the precision with which he is fine-tuning the system to his ears. Is there any other Trio G3 system in the world to which its owner or dealer has applied Todd's level of perfectionism?

And Uwiik, leveraging Todd's experience, as well as crowdsourcing other members' opinions on amplification and system design, to solve the equation for his own dream system.

Congratulations to both of you!

Yes, luckily there is no one in this thread asking whether the sound from G3 is natural or not.

 

[bonzo75]

Yes, luckily there is no one in this thread asking whether the sound from G3 is natural or not.

And no one attacking Todd’s videos with an anti video rant

 

[sbnx]

I have been typing on this between work so I see a lot of posts since I started.

Hello Uwiik,

It is certainly nice that you have a dealer with both top tier tube and top tier solid state gear. Great job putting that dealer to work. It is awesome to see someone really dig in and find out what they like and what is going to work for them long term. Like you said you could just spend years moving from gear to gear. Now you know and don't have to keep second guessing yourself.
As you know, each room is different. For some the spacehorn may work well in the center and for others it may work to the outside of the trio horn. The room has to be pretty wide to get the space horn to work on the outside. Once you get them in your room you can find which type of setup works for you. I just don't like "stuff" between the speakers and the space horns work well for me on the outside.

I did state specific numbers in my post on the spacehorn. However, each room is different and you will need to find the settings that work for you in your room. If you decide to position the spacehorn to the outside of the speakers here are some guidelines you can use if you want to experiment.

Height: the spacehorn really needs more height from the floor. This will help with the bass articulation and the bass release into the room. Mine are probably about 3 inches from the floor to the bottom lip of the spaacehorn. You can cut wood block to use for this. Rake: Tilt the spacehorn back so the opening is pointed up a little. At least a few tenths of a degree. If you start from flat then then start tilting it back a little at a time you will find the spot where the bass releases from the floor and opens up into the room. Lateral spacing from the main trio: If you have the spacehorn too close the is too much coupling and it makes the upper bass region sound congested. The best thing to do is start too close and then start moving the spacehorn out a little at a time until you hear the upper bass clear up. Mine is 5 1/4 inches from the inside lip of the side of the spacehorn to the edge of the Trio "cabinet". Toe-in: Match the toe-in of the spacehorn to the toe-in o fthe trio. Azimuth. You can see from my earlier post that the azimuth of the spacehorn matters quite a bit as the spacehorn is coupling to the upper horn. Tilt is out at least a few tenths of a degree and keep going until you find that the sound is clear. And of coursse front-to-back: This is all about time aligning the spacehron to the trio. you just have to tap, tap, tap until it is right.

You mentioned (and showed a picture) of the cable mess necessary to get the system to work. I think that is ok at a dealer. I am sure you are very aware of the difference this is going to make once you get the speakers home and have some nice cables working in your system. Before I got the Odin2 cables I was using some long silver interconnects. The difference between the Odin and the silver interconnects couldn't be more stark. The silver cables put a spotlight on the upper midrange. By comparison the Odin2's sound very mellow. I am sure the upper tier Siltech would make a very nice choice as well as Crystal cable.

I am happy you have found the combination of Ongaku and Trio that brings a smile to your face. It does not bother me at at all that you post about it in this thread. I am all about sharing experiences. To me that is the real point of a forum.

 

[Uwiik]

Any chance you can get the orange ones?
And if not, what would be your color of choice for the horns?

I think orange is the best color. If the dealer is willing to take off the iTron then yes I can get the orange color, otherwise the light blue one also looks very nice.

 

[Uwiik]

Yes, luckily there is no one in this thread asking whether the sound from G3 is natural or not.

very very natural on Ongaku, to the point with eyes closed, one would think he/she is in a life play…but this is my opinion.

 

[Uwiik]

I have been typing on this between work so I see a lot of posts since I started.

Hello Uwiik,

It is certainly nice that you have a dealer with both top tier tube and top tier solid state gear. Great job putting that dealer to work. It is awesome to see someone really dig in and find out what they like and what is going to work for them long term. Like you said you could just spend years moving from gear to gear. Now you know and don't have to keep second guessing yourself.
As you know, each room is different. For some the spacehorn may work well in the center and for others it may work to the outside of the trio horn. The room has to be pretty wide to get the space horn to work on the outside. Once you get them in your room you can find which type of setup works for you. I just don't like "stuff" between the speakers and the space horns work well for me on the outside.

I did state specific numbers in my post on the spacehorn. However, each room is different and you will need to find the settings that work for you in your room. If you decide to position the spacehorn to the outside of the speakers here are some guidelines you can use if you want to experiment.

Height: the spacehorn really needs more height from the floor. This will help with the bass articulation and the bass release into the room. Mine are probably about 3 inches from the floor to the bottom lip of the spaacehorn. You can cut wood block to use for this. Rake: Tilt the spacehorn back so the opening is pointed up a little. At least a few tenths of a degree. If you start from flat then then start tilting it back a little at a time you will find the spot where the bass releases from the floor and opens up into the room. Lateral spacing from the main trio: If you have the spacehorn too close the is too much coupling and it makes the upper bass region sound congested. The best thing to do is start too close and then start moving the spacehorn out a little at a time until you hear the upper bass clear up. Mine is 5 1/4 inches from the inside lip of the side of the spacehorn to the edge of the Trio "cabinet". Toe-in: Match the toe-in of the spacehorn to the toe-in o fthe trio. Azimuth. You can see from my earlier post that the azimuth of the spacehorn matters quite a bit as the spacehorn is coupling to the upper horn. Tilt is out at least a few tenths of a degree and keep going until you find that the sound is clear. And of coursse front-to-back: This is all about time aligning the spacehron to the trio. you just have to tap, tap, tap until it is right.

You mentioned (and showed a picture) of the cable mess necessary to get the system to work. I think that is ok at a dealer. I am sure you are very aware of the difference this is going to make once you get the speakers home and have some nice cables working in your system. Before I got the Odin2 cables I was using some long silver interconnects. The difference between the Odin and the silver interconnects couldn't be more stark. The silver cables put a spotlight on the upper midrange. By comparison the Odin2's sound very mellow. I am sure the upper tier Siltech would make a very nice choice as well as Crystal cable.

I am happy you have found the combination of Ongaku and Trio that brings a smile to your face. It does not bother me at at all that you post about it in this thread. I am all about sharing experiences. To me that is the real point of a forum.

@sbnx , thanks so much for the tune up tips! I couldn’t thank you enough for your post detailing your journey with your Trio G3. These has given me a new lease in my audio passion. To be totally honest, lately I have been contemplating to just buy Devialet and to quit the hobby altogether due to my frustration in getting the end game sound I have been looking for since the 90s when I was still a poor college student. Even after I could afford above 100k threshold components I was never really fully convinced even when I decide on a whole system, I often just buy just because I think I will be able to tune it to my liking with expensive cables and tubes which is never the case. This time is different…..Your detailed story gave me the confidence and the energy to try one last time and it pays big time…At this point I know that I will be fully happy with my decision….Now I just have to be really careful so I don’t spend stupid on more crazy cables…..What do you think about Odin2 compared to Siltech Double/triple crown on the Trio G3? I am already fully covered with Siltech on my components but now I have to get more cables for the Trio G3 + Basshorns…

 

[christoph]

And no one attacking Todd’s videos with an anti video rant

And no "get off my thread"

 

[sbnx]

@sbnx , thanks so much for the tune up tips! I couldn’t thank you enough for your post detailing your journey with your Trio G3. These has given me a new lease in my audio passion. To be totally honest, lately I have been contemplating to just buy Devialet and to quit the hobby altogether due to my frustration in getting the end game sound I have been looking for since the 90s when I was still a poor college student. Even after I could afford above 100k threshold components I was never really fully convinced even when I decide on a whole system, I often just buy just because I think I will be able to tune it to my liking with expensive cables and tubes which is never the case. This time is different…..Your detailed story gave me the confidence and the energy to try one last time and it pays big time…At this point I know that I will be fully happy with my decision….Now I just have to be really careful so I don’t spend stupid on more crazy cables…..What do you think about Odin2 compared to Siltech Double/triple crown on the Trio G3? I am already fully covered with Siltech on my components but now I have to get more cables for the Trio G3 + Basshorns…

Glad to hear you found it helpful. I can certainly relate to almost giving up. As I mentioned in one of the above posts I was there at one point.

I think the Siltech cables will work nicely for you. I did not get a chance to hear them. It is not easy, if not impossible, to find anyone with 5 meter pairs of interconnects that I could compare. I feel I should mention that the silver cables I was using as there are several brands now that utilize pure silver: Siltech, Crystal and Argento just to name a few. They were a pair of the Analysis Plus Silver Apex. Not cheap but not exactly top of the heap. I also used a pair of MIT MAX rev. 2. I settled on Odin2. The difference between these three cables is huge. It is jsut like Goldie Locks: too hard, too soft and just right.

Yes, unfortunately you will need an extra set of cables to connect ot the spacehorn and an extra pair of power cords to power the spacehorn. This is definitely some extra cost associated with the AG Trio system.