Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

Taiko Audio

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Feb 10, 2017
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Oh, I'm not complaining. I gladly pay all taxes I am responsible for. It sounds like there is confusion whether Extreme owners should pay the import duty tax charged by California as Emile states computers are 'duty free' and U.S. Customs may have categorized the Extreme incorrectly for at least 3 of us. CA can keep my $750 but I would gladly take it back if I was erroneously charged. Sounds like Steve you may not have been charged this tax by California. Great pictures Emile!! Did you get to hear how the system sounded?!

I suspect the difference may be in import duties (free for computers) and State sales Tax. I very rarely hear reports from our customers they were charged for taxes and/or duties.

I was not personally present at that show unfortunately!
 
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gds7368

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Jan 9, 2015
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Meanwhile in Europe we finally have some Shows again. We will be exhibiting at the Dutch Audio Event on the 30th and 31th of October with @flyer (Ultisone), Alsyvox Botticelli loudspeakers and Aries Cerat electronics.

Here are a few photos of the Audio Video Kino 2021 show in Bratislava, Slovakia held on the 18th and 19th of September by our distributor for Austria, Slovakia and the Czech Republic, DreamAudio.

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Is this one of those eye tests where you ask us later if anyone noticed the lady was wearing tennis shoes?
 
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Johnny Moondog

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Oct 30, 2014
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Same here. Received a couple of letters from CA Dept of Tax and Fee Administration. Unfortunately, I ended paying for it...
Oh boy, me too. I kept getting late penalties and finally paid a few weeks ago...
Didn't realize anyone else had encountered this. I thought mine was a mistake given the category it was placed in. And when I spoke to a representative at the CA Department of Tax Etc. they were also surprised, but explained that their process is based on the category chosen by U.S Customs. In any case, the ball is now in their court, and there may still be a payment in my future.
 

oldmustang

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Dec 1, 2012
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another benefit of the taiko switch will be carefully controlling the input to the extreme.
you can never have enough redundant control systems when dealing with nuclear reactors!
So the Taiko will come with a scram switch? Awesome!

Steve Z
 
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dminches

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Oct 22, 2011
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Do you expect the switch to be available in 2021? I know getting supplies for anything is impossible these days.
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
I suspect the difference may be in import duties (free for computers) and State sales Tax. I very rarely hear reports from our customers they were charged for taxes and/or duties.

I was not personally present at that show unfortunately!
I was asked two questions
1. Is this a computer. Answer YES

2. Does it have an optical drive. Answer NO

Charge $338

i received delivery next day
 

Kris

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Mar 4, 2019
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Streaming HD movies, or say Netflix 4K would be a good test. Please share the results if you do.
Started some early tests and the differences are very big .
I knew based on my experience that I can get any kind of SQ out of extereme by just tuning my switches and router.
But if I add different routers this becmes much more noticable.
Hardwere is one thing ( type of processor, number of cores, memory size, memory type - ddr2 , 3 or 4,)
But the other very importat thing is softwere and its settings.
To stay consistent in that I need to set them equal or to know what are the key settings.

So I have a few questions to Emile
what are your basic Router settings?
I think the most important is MTU size (69 - 9000) for the ports in router.

firewall is a must but it looks it slowes the internal transfer of the packets very significant.
I turned firewall in one router totally off and is a significant step up.
so if firewall is used more expensive router solutions are going to be favorable.

What are your basic switch settings:
is it L2 or L3 switch ?
Jumbo frame on / of
size of jumbo frame
APD
flow control on /off
IEEE 802.3az on/off
QoS priority type DSCP / CoS/ Ip precedence
QoS mapping priority values
LLDP properties values ( TLV adv interval, hold multiplyer, reinitiazing delay, transmit delay)

flow controll ON is a must in all of them.
APD looks like a important to keep it ON.
Jumbo frame softens and makes the music slower but I found it also adds less clarity and I tend
not to like it as much. Prefer to keep it off.
 

Taiko Audio

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Feb 10, 2017
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I was asked two questions
1. Is this a computer. Answer YES

2. Does it have an optical drive. Answer NO

Charge $338

i received delivery next day

I’m no expert on the US tax system, but it appears to me that import duty free on computers does not excempt the unit from individual State sales tax:

2AE6FDAF-5860-48F2-B360-560D6429A01C.jpeg
 

Taiko Audio

Industry Expert
Feb 10, 2017
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Do you expect the switch to be available in 2021? I know getting supplies for anything is impossible these days.

As much as I’d like it to be available this year, the supply situation does indeed make that unlikely.

We have decided to release both a network card and switch now working in tandem to address this particular “issue”. I expect these to be available at about the same time, but that could end up being Q1 2022. This will come hand in hand with a software update.
 

Taiko Audio

Industry Expert
Feb 10, 2017
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taikoaudio.com
Started some early tests and the differences are very big .
I knew based on my experience that I can get any kind of SQ out of extereme by just tuning my switches and router.
But if I add different routers this becmes much more noticable.
Hardwere is one thing ( type of processor, number of cores, memory size, memory type - ddr2 , 3 or 4,)
But the other very importat thing is softwere and its settings.
To stay consistent in that I need to set them equal or to know what are the key settings.

So I have a few questions to Emile
what are your basic Router settings?
I think the most important is MTU size (69 - 9000) for the ports in router.

firewall is a must but it looks it slowes the internal transfer of the packets very significant.
I turned firewall in one router totally off and is a significant step up.
so if firewall is used more expensive router solutions are going to be favorable.

What are your basic switch settings:
is it L2 or L3 switch ?
Jumbo frame on / of
size of jumbo frame
APD
flow control on /off
IEEE 802.3az on/off
QoS priority type DSCP / CoS/ Ip precedence
QoS mapping priority values
LLDP properties values ( TLV adv interval, hold multiplyer, reinitiazing delay, transmit delay)

flow controll ON is a must in all of them.
APD looks like a important to keep it ON.
Jumbo frame softens and makes the music slower but I found it also adds less clarity and I tend
not to like it as much. Prefer to keep it off.

I will share those next week, but I can already tell you you have a different range of configurability. To achieve 100% similar performance across the board we may need to select a go to router, or design one ourselves. Some of these settings are positive or negative in direct correlation on how the network adapters in the Extreme are configured…
 

Kris

Well-Known Member
Mar 4, 2019
951
973
183
I will share those next week, but I can already tell you you have a different range of configurability. To achieve 100% similar performance across the board we may need to select a go to router, or design one ourselves. Some of these settings are positive or negative in direct correlation on how the network adapters in the Extreme are configured…
Thank you Emile
I am sure none of us is getting as good results as you do.
Trying to get close to what you have .

I just increased the network speed from 200 mbps to 500 mbps and it is so much better .

the problem is that most low value routers like mine edgerouter X will slow things significant if firewall is sekected ON in router. It could be down to 30 mbps In some scenarios.
So to keep it high speed you need something serious.

I agree I have much less settings, but will also get the dream machine pro just to see what I am missing, so if you could share some screenshots and your comments if will be priceless.

I know you must had a problem defining network settings in Extreme for everyone.
I learned some time ago how different results I can get with same router or switch and just changing the settings.

If you decide for some reason to build the router I am sure it will increase the overall SQ very significant ( more than the USB card I suspect ). Ultimate solution.

if no time to bulid the Taiko Router we can buy dream machine pro ( 350 - 400 euro only) and copy the settings you find best for extreme.
The good thing with dream machine pro is that you know it very well already and we could use one router for all home network needs and camera monitoring.
 

Nakor

Well-Known Member
May 14, 2011
33
23
913
Didn't realize anyone else had encountered this. I thought mine was a mistake given the category it was placed in. And when I spoke to a representative at the CA Department of Tax Etc. they were also surprised, but explained that their process is based on the category chosen by U.S Customs. In any case, the ball is now in their court, and there may still be a payment in my future.
I doubt it was categorized as a nuclear reactor, it’s just that section 84 is titled "NUCLEAR REACTORS, BOILERS, MACHINERY AND MECHANICAL APPLIANCES; PARTS THEREOF”. My guess would be that the HS code was incomplete, for whatever reason, and thats why it only shows the first two digits and not the full code.

Screenshot 2021-10-02 at 14.26.03.png

Emile is likely correct in that computers are exempt of import duty and therefore most US buyers have only had to pay state sales tax.
 

Kris

Well-Known Member
Mar 4, 2019
951
973
183
@Kris , since you appear to be willing and able to run experiments, if you run say a netflix 4K stream, does this impact local file and streaming SQ equally? Is this possible for you to try with QoS enabled and disabled?

Do you currently use Fiber or Copper into the Extreme?

I am experimenting most of my time home.
did try netflix 4k stream, It lowers SQ when on edgerouter X.
both local files and streamed sound worst. It is very noticable difference.
I understand the better routers with much better performance will not be affected as much.

I am on copper all the way as it sounds more real, but I get fibre to my home.

I can try with QoS , but there are some numbers there.
shoud that be checked in router or switch or both ?
Will try to check QoS in my settings .
 

kswanson27

Well-Known Member
Nov 21, 2018
368
179
128
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See item#2

This is new to me. Does anyone else have problems using Roon with the JL Audio Board after a Roon update? I do not.
I'm not running the JL Audio board but I lost the Roon server with the last two Roon updates. Ed had to delete and reinstall my Roon core each time to get me back up.
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
See item#2

This is new to me. Does anyone else have problems using Roon with the JL Audio Board after a Roon update? I do not.
Never, however I am seeing this in a different thread so perhaps the user is not using an Extreme. Having said that I cannot understand why Extreme users continue to use Roon rather than TAS. The future of the Extreme is with TAS and not Roon IMHO.

I believe Emile has promised a new software update as well as a new card that might obviate the need for a switch but wherever Emile takes his TAS direction that's where I plan to go. I haven't used Roon in over a year and just don't miss it but that's just me.
 
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