Taiko Audio SGM Extreme : the Crème de la Crème

[Taiko Audio]

How does Jplay compare to HQPlayer when used with Roon?

I’ve used both JPlay and HQ Player individually and together.

HQ’s primary contribution is direct control over upsampling and filters, which allows you to select a format that best matches the applicable dac. It’s also good for managing complex convolution pipelines, speaker time/volume delays, etc. It’s very processor intensive and benefits greatly from a high-cuda-core video card to perform floating point math. As Roon has gotten better the sonic contribution has declined. It’s particularly helpful to me as I’ve got four separate dacs (two for speakers and two for headphones) that each respond differently.

JPlay’s primary contribution is removing processes not essential to processing music. As such the things it does are quite different. Peanut butter and jelly rather than two flavors of jam.

Agree.

 

[nonesup]

Could it be that someone was bothered by Emile post?

In any case, I have the post saved and I find it very valuable.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Could it be that someone was bothered by Emile post?

In any case, I have the post saved and I find it very valuable.

You're welcome

 

[microstrip]

Hi Steve,
Jplay is a playback engine sitting in between Roon and the DAC driver, it allows some (undisclosed) control/tuning of the datastream. It is not mandatory, as Roon can function without it, though highly recommended as it does improve sound quality. It is included as a default option with the Extreme.

(...) JPlay’s primary contribution is removing processes not essential to processing music. As such the things it does are quite different. Peanut butter and jelly rather than two flavors of jam.

Sorry for my ignorance, I can not see how these answers match.

 

[Steve Williams]

Sorry for my ignorance, I can not see how these answers match.

I thought I was the only noobie here

 

[Taiko Audio]

Sorry for my ignorance, I can not see how these answers match.

They don’t, they do complement eachother.

 

[Taiko Audio]

JPlay has 4 main identifiable modes of action:

1) It can tune operating system parameters and reduce background activity of processes unnecessary for audio playback.
2) It can act as a UPNP mediaserver and renderer.
3) It has frontend and endpoint functionality enabling distributing load over 2 systems.
4) It can act as an ASIO driver, so you can select it from within Roon as an output (audio zone), it can then "manipulate" the data stream fed to the DAC driver.

We only use the 4th option in the Extreme.

As Brucemck2 pointed out;

HQ’s primary contribution is direct control over upsampling and filters, which allows you to select a format that best matches the applicable dac. It’s also good for managing complex convolution pipelines, speaker time/volume delays, etc.

They serve different purposes and can be used together.

 

[microstrip]

JPlay has 4 main identifiable modes of action:

1) It can tune operating system parameters and reduce background activity of processes unnecessary for audio playback.
2) It can act as a UPNP mediaserver and renderer.
3) It has frontend and endpoint functionality enabling distributing load over 2 systems.
4) It can act as an ASIO driver, so you can select it from within Roon as an output (audio zone), it can then "manipulate" the data stream fed to the DAC driver.

We only use the 4th option in the Extreme.

As Brucemck2 pointed out;



They serve different purposes and can be used together.

Thanks - my concern was mainly option one and three!
Does the manipulation referred in 4) keep bit exact flow?

 

[nonesup]

You're welcome

I had a one-year license of Roon + Mini PC i7-256 SSD-16 Gb RAM, to compare it with my Melco + Minimserver. When the year ended I did not renew the license. Later ... who knows.

 

[Taiko Audio]

Thanks - my concern was mainly option one and three!
Does the manipulation referred in 4) keep bit exact flow?

Yes it does, its more about buffering, it does not alter any bits, atleast afaik.

 

[Taiko Audio]

I had a one-year license of Roon + Mini PC i7-256 SSD-16 Gb RAM, to compare it with my Melco + Minimserver. When the year ended I did not renew the license. Later ... who knows.

There are plenty of alternatives ofcourse

 

[Number9]

+1 I've heard the D1-direct with reclocker is close to D1-12mk2 level from several sources.

What would be the appropriate amount of gain, sensitivity required to run direct?

 

[Taiko Audio]

What would be the appropriate amount of gain, sensitivity required to run direct?

To get an accurate answer to that I would advice you to contact Vincent @ Totaldac.

It can drive these with the passive Bespoke preamplifier:
http://en.audionet.de/machines/heisenberg/

Does not tell you much I'm afraid.

 

[Number9]

The Audionet website doesn't list the input specs. but I appreciate your taking the time to respond. I will post on the TotalDac thread.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

look what the cat dragged in......

for a few years now i've been waiting to settle on a digital interface i felt was going to be long term, at which point i would find a big boy cable solution. i found my digital interface, SGM Extreme server into the MSB Pro USB, and so i acquired a top flight USB to see if that could take things further.

would the USB cable still matter?

it seems it certainly does matter. even stone cold we have taken a clear step forward.

 

[Esotar]

look what the cat dragged in......

for a few years now i've been waiting to settle on a digital interface i felt was going to be long term, at which point i would find a big boy cable solution. i found my digital interface, SGM Extreme server into the MSB Pro USB, and so i acquired a top flight USB to see if that could take things further.

would the USB cable still matter?

it seems it certainly does matter. even stone cold we have taken a clear step forward.

View attachment 54417

I use LH Light Speed 20G USB Custom model.

LH customized 20G as I hope, so I call 20G DE (DIGITUS Labs Edition)

The USB cable when 20G DE quality inspection test is your new USB cable [Lacorde].

Lacorde is better than 20G DE, but price is 5 times 20G DE price.



Quality is more than normal 20G, but it has critical weak point.

[[[Dead very easily]]]

LH sold fifty 20G DEs and repaired 28 times.

So LH made "New" 20G and "New" 20G DE without Battery.

 

[Steve Williams]

look what the cat dragged in......

for a few years now i've been waiting to settle on a digital interface i felt was going to be long term, at which point i would find a big boy cable solution. i found my digital interface, SGM Extreme server into the MSB Pro USB, and so i acquired a top flight USB to see if that could take things further.

would the USB cable still matter?

it seems it certainly does matter. even stone cold we have taken a clear step forward.

View attachment 54417

I use LH Light Speed 20G USB Custom model.

LH customized 20G as I hope, so I call 20G DE (DIGITUS Labs Edition)

The USB cable when 20G DE quality inspection test is your new USB cable [Lacorde].

Lacorde is better than 20G DE, but price is 5 times 20G DE price.



Quality is more than normal 20G, but it has critical weak point.

[[[Dead very easily]]]

LH sold fifty 20G DEs and repaired 28 times.

So LH made "New" 20G and "New" 20G DE without Battery.

The bottom line is "USB cables do matter" and I'm sure we all have our favorites. I started a thread on this very subject when I found my favorite cable as well. And yes they can be very expensive but I was stunned just as I am sure Mike is. I never thought such a profound change would be audible but it is.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

The bottom line is "USB cables do matter" and I'm sure we all have our favorites. I started a thread on this very subject when I found my favorite cable as well. And yes they can be very expensive but I was stunned just as I am sure Mike is. I never thought such a profound change would be audible but it is.

the Gobel USB is not outrageously priced, but it's not inexpensive either (around half what your Masterbuilt USB lists for as i recall). so far after 3 hours or so i am very impressed. i had assumed with all the other network things i had done adding the MSB Pro USB fibre and then the fibre SFP interface that the piece of USB still there would have marginal effect.

however; what the Gobel has done is remarkable. over the first 90-120 minutes or so i could hear it slowly improve and expand it's effect. in the first few seconds i heard the sound seem to be less loud. then i realized it was not actually lower in volume, the digital glare was absent. gone. instead much greater texture and nuance. less processed, more real. over time the broader improvements in the bass and greater space and dynamics presented themselves and things opened up more.

that absence of digital glare is having significant musical consequences for my listening. i love string quartets and piano, violin concertos and any sort of baroque music. wow!!! all this stuff is much more natural and involving. i get that completely natural leading edge with zero distortion in familiar recordings.....now realizing that the glare had pushed me away.

redbook vocals? now they are much more analog sounding. across the board.

the difference between vinyl and digital in presentation? much less now.

i can't really say how what i'm hearing with the Gobel USB would work in other contexts. i have all these other tools in my network that have particular effects. yet no doubt this is a special USB cable. it is delivering what i was hoping it might. it's crossing the 'T' and dotting the 'i' for me. the final piece of my puzzle.

there could be a number of other USB cables that can do this same stuff; or not. i had 3 modestly priced USB cables i invested in, thinking at some point i would try this one. and it's doing what i hoped it would.......so far.

 

[Taiko Audio]

There is just no way around high end boutique cabling, its pricing often seems ridiculous, yet its influence is undeniable, and often mayor. It's a mistake to think that just because it's a USB cable it won't matter as much as other cable types.

I use the Intona Ultimate myself, I was quite shocked by the level of improvement it made over others. I don't know how it performs relative to other super cables but there's something interesting about it which is why I'm mentioning this.

They come in 3 grades:

Premium: USD 429 / 1 meter
Reference: USD 739 / 1 meter
Ultimate: USD 2319 / 1 meter

The only difference between these 3 is its impedance tolerance:
Premium: 2 Ohm
Reference: 1 Ohm
Ultimate: 0.3 Ohm

The difference moving up the line is quite shocking, for its effect on sound quality the Ultimate is completely worth its increased retail tag.

They also have a new USB 3.0 isolator retailing at USD 379, this is the first isolator we've come across which improves the USB output of the SGM servers, on the plus side, it does not require and external power supply (likely one of the reasons for its ability to improve the SGMs USB output), on the downside, it requires 2 USB cables, and you should not make the mistake to assume you can get away with lower quality ones. I do not know if this isolator would improve the MSB Pro interface.

I also don't know how the Intona Ultimate (with or without isolator), Gobel, Masterbuilt, LH 20G DE compare. I am sure they will all sound different.

 

[nonesup]

Well the other Göbel cables are just as good