power conditioner

[Folsom]

Balanced Isolation transformers are good for most audio systems if the performance is not ultimate. For ultimate performance isolation tranaformers have some limits:
- bass is not fully extended and solid
- the ac polarity will not be correct
- dynamics are not perfect

I've heard what some people call ultimate through balanced transformers and I can't uniquely identify obvious flaws but have been able to improve the sound slightly due to a bit of resonance control pre balance. Necessary? May be situational, certainly not a waste or low end if you get a very large one. I lean towards a very minimal approach to power compared to the past. Learning to make appliances that are not as dependent on power mitigation contributions has been a big deal and nothing like any text book implies.

Regenrators and things like them (inverters) have had more sonic impact in my experience. But it depends on where you are. I once visited a really nice guy with a very nice stereo that had horrible power so the overall experience was much preferred with added stability.

 

[Folsom]

I suggest you read up on the topic. No-one is saying AC power is the actual generator of the harmonic. Transformers are, as I stated earlier.

The Elgar conditioners (made back in the 1970s) can sort it out, as can the PS Audio regenerators. Passive devices, unless they have a 300Hz filter, cannot. A 300Hz filter requires a fairly large choke FWIW.

It shouldn't. But grounding is a bit of a black art and I've encountered many in high end audio that don't really understand it.

I wish there was something left to read that would be new information.

The Elgar stuff is neat but even today's units are limited to 20ms response time so nothing even close to audio capable. If you run a lab of sorts then it is all very nice. The PS Audio units drastically change sound by the power cable from the wall to them. So even units that are suppose to free themselves of everything are often not doing so sonically.

As far as ground goes, it is a curse in the name of safety. Few want to run balanced operational equipment, balanced power, or make enclosures that are against their sensibilities to mitigate the issues. I'm sure for you it is several fold over since tubes use high voltages and if you cannot get ground under control you can get sounds like people yoinking input cables at a community event while everything is still on and unmuted.

 

[Kingrex]

Unless we properly quantify power needs all we say is vaporware.

Addressing 500, 1000, 2000 or 5000WA is very different and needs different approaches. In a forum blessing low power SETs and very high-efficiency speakers the problem should be easily solved.

I get your point. But I would use nothing less than a 2000 Watt Exeltech or Victron. Victron is actually 3000 watts or 5000 watts. The only difference is that with 5000 watts, I would be designing for a larger isolation transformer, like a RM40. But I think they are all 240 volt in. Would have to check. Or, 2 x RM20. I would drop 2 fuses at the output of the inverter and go to each isolation transformer. But your getting a lot of heavy parts in the room at 5000 watts. The inverter is 135 plus pounds. So is the battery. So is the isolation transformer.

I would stick with multiple 2000 to 3000 watt inverters to fit the system. Could be one for amps and one for front end.

I feel over 10,000 watts is the dividing line. When you get that big, you should either go with multiple small units, or the system needs to be taken out of the room. Now you need a professional installer.

 

[Amir]

This statement needs clarity.

I agree the AC filters really don't do much. And if your only exposure to 'conditioners' in high end audio is a glorified power strip that calls itself a power conditioner when it really isn't then I can see why you came to this conclusion.

AC power conditioning was sorted out a long time ago. See if you can find a copy of the manual for an Elgar AC conditioner (available on eBay)- read it and you'll see what I'm talking about. Elgar conditioners could get the AC line distortion down to 0.5% THD at full output. The bigger ones could do that with 5000VA. They also could maintain line Voltage and do that without limiting current. I first learned about the Elgars from Michael Percy (who sells high end components like resistors and capacitors) when I visited him in the early 1990s.

You are audio designer so you know more than me about complexity of good sound vs circuit design.

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I have spent many times for this problem but did not find the proper solution.

ABB low distortion 20KVA UPS