Lampizator announcement: launch of our all new TOTL HORIZON DAC

[wisnon]

I post this clip for fun. Steve Williams' system is amazing. I love it.

I think you should not challenge everyone about music. We only share our system with our passion. We get success together.

Great looking system you have there.

 

[wil]

In the Owners Manual for both the Pacific and Horizon, Lukasz states:

"The DAC with volume control should sound audibly cleaner and more direct without any preamp between the DAC and the amp. The preamp, however good, will veil a lot of the DAC’s natural clarity, speed and directness.

The load presented by the preamp or amp or simply the next analog component that the DAC sees, should be as high as possible. It is measured in kilo-Ohms and 100Kilo Ohms is a perfect ballpark value. More is VERY rarely seen. 47 K is next common value, and it is great too. 20 K is kind of on a low side, but we can handle that. Lower than 10k is bad news. The bass extension may suffer a few hertz of the lowest octave
The DAC will not be damaged in any way, but at around 6K of load the dynamics of the dac will start to fade away.
Having said that - every properly designed amp or preamp keeps the load value above 40k. And if it doesn’t - we simply don’t choose such amp because it was not designed with audiophiles in mind."

Based on the specs from the following pre's and their amps should we assume the Atmasphere (based only on impedance) would be a better match with the Horizon, or is it, as I suspect, far more complicated? And this of course doesn't take into account the innate qualities of each amp and pre
and how they work together.

- Lamm LL.1 pre 16.5k ohm input / 16.5 k ohm out ML3 41k ohm input

- Dartzeel pre 30k ohm input / 75 ohm out DZ 108 amp 30k ohm input
50 ohm " Zeel" out 50 ohm "Zeel"

-Atma MP3 pre 100k ohm input / 250 ohm out Atma MA1 amp 100k ohm input

 

[Steve Williams]

In the Owners Manual for both the Pacific and Horizon, Lukasz states:

"The DAC with volume control should sound audibly cleaner and more direct without any preamp between the DAC and the amp. The preamp, however good, will veil a lot of the DAC’s natural clarity, speed and directness.

The load presented by the preamp or amp or simply the next analog component that the DAC sees, should be as high as possible. It is measured in kilo-Ohms and 100Kilo Ohms is a perfect ballpark value. More is VERY rarely seen. 47 K is next common value, and it is great too. 20 K is kind of on a low side, but we can handle that. Lower than 10k is bad news. The bass extension may suffer a few hertz of the lowest octave
The DAC will not be damaged in any way, but at around 6K of load the dynamics of the dac will start to fade away.
Having said that - every properly designed amp or preamp keeps the load value above 40k. And if it doesn’t - we simply don’t choose such amp because it was not designed with audiophiles in mind."

Based on the specs from the following pre's and their amps should we assume the Atmasphere (based only on impedance) would be a better match with the Horizon, or is it, as I suspect, far more complicated? And this of course doesn't take into account the innate qualities of each amp and pre
and how they work together.

- Lamm LL.1 pre 16.5k ohm input / 16.5 k ohm out ML3 41k ohm input

- Dartzeel pre 30k ohm input / 153k ohm out DZ 108 amp 30k ohm input
50 ohm " Zeel" out 50 ohm "Zeel"

-Atma MP3 pre 100k ohm input / 250 ohm out Atma MA1 amp 100k ohm input

Base it on your ears Will rather than the specs

 

[microstrip]

In the Owners Manual for both the Pacific and Horizon, Lukasz states:

(...) Having said that - every properly designed amp or preamp keeps the load value above 40k. And if it doesn’t - we simply don’t choose such amp because it was not designed with audiophiles in mind." (...)

I respect designers/manufacturers but this is kind of untrue comment that should not be written in a manual of a quality component. Since long we know the danger of writing "every", "all", "never" or "none" in this hobby, filled with respectable exceptions.

 

[marty]

Having said that - every properly designed amp or preamp keeps the load value above 40k.

Wow. Tell that to Spectral and others whose input impedance is 10K for a reason. As Steve said, let your ears be the judge, but a relevant question that has not yet been answered (unless I missed it) is- what is the output impedance of the Horizon? Is it low as in 2 ohms (Soulution 725), 7 ohms (like Gryphon Commander) or 25 ohms (VTL 7.5III)? Or high as in 300 ohms (ARC Ref 10). Just curious. It's not a trick question, but a legitimate one.

 

[wil]

Base it on your ears Will rather than the specs

I totally agree! I'm just trying to learn

 

[Steve Williams]

I want to make another announcement about this weekend. Based on what Lukasz and Fred are want ting to show I am suggesting that everyone attend at noon and plan on staying until done as here is the program

PROGRAM

1. Introduction of Lukasz and Fred
2. Some words from Lukasz
3. Demo of Horizon with Lukasz favorite tube set, (which I have to say I am loving and could live with these forever)
4. Demo of Horizon using a multitude of different tubes
5. Demo of Pacific
6. Demo of Horizon direct to amps
7. Closing thoughts from attendees

There will be food and drink served safely throughout the afternoon in individual servings . Masks will be provided if needed as well as hand washing solution but all I ask is those who are attending and have any symptoms please be tested before you come

Ron will be filming an interview with Lukasz for our video channel and also polling thoughts of those attending

Finally several more people have been added and if you are concerned re safety, it seems that way more than half attending are coming on Saturday so let me know if you want to switch to Sunday. For consideration is the amount of listening time evrtyone is going to get on Saturday vs those coming on Sunday. The game will be televised throughout my house for those wanting to follow the game if they aren't in the listening room

I mention all of this only because my listening room is my man cave and not built for large crowds (even though I have had a record of 18 people in my room at the same time So my thought was to have the longest individual listening experience in the sweet spot during the initial Horizon demo with the favored tubes

We will try to wrap up by 5:00 PM as most of you attending are coming from afar and several have plans to catch

Please PM me for any thoughts or concerns

I'm looking forward to meeting all of you as I know perhaps only 4 people attending

Lets have fun and do our best to stay safe.

I thought for ongoing continuity of this thread it would be my thought that those attending post their thoughts and comments in this thread as it will be the best way to follow the Horizon. After this event and those thoughts have all been posted and comments made Golum will be starting a thread on tube rolling with the Horizon. I have to admit that Lukasz favorite set which I am using is something I would be happy with forever. I do want to try my Shuguang gz480 after the KR-RK 5u4g and perhaps the NIB matched quad set of Tung Sol KT 170

 

[wil]

Base it on your ears Will rather than the specs

I see that another amp designer, Infigo Audio, is suggesting use of their DAC direct to their power amps. He doesn't even make a pre.

 

[Steve Williams]

I see that another amp designer, Infigo Audio, is suggesting use of their DAC direct to their power amps. He doesn't even make a pre.

Direct from DAC to amp is not a new concept Wil

rewards can be great if there is impedance matching between DAC and amp

 

[Jbs]

I want to make another announcement about this weekend. Based on what Lukasz and Fred are want ting to show I am suggesting that everyone attend at noon and plan on staying until done as here is the program

PROGRAM

1. Introduction of Lukasz and Fred
2. Some words from Lukasz
3. Demo of Horizon with Lukasz favorite tube set, (which I have to say I am loving and could live with these forever)
4. Demo of Horizon using a multitude of different tubes
5. Demo of Pacific
6. Demo of Horizon direct to amps
7. Closing thoughts from attendees

There will be food and drink served safely throughout the afternoon in individual servings . Masks will be provided if needed as well as hand washing solution but all I ask is those who are attending and have any symptoms please be tested before you come

Ron will be filming an interview with Lukasz for our video channel and also polling thoughts of those attending

Finally several more people have been added and if you are concerned re safety, it seems that way more than half attending are coming on Saturday so let me know if you want to switch to Sunday. For consideration is the amount of listening time evrtyone is going to get on Saturday vs those coming on Sunday. The game will be televised throughout my house for those wanting to follow the game if they aren't in the listening room

I mention all of this only because my listening room is my man cave and not built for large crowds (even though I have had a record of 18 people in my room at the same time So my thought was to have the longest individual listening experience in the sweet spot during the initial Horizon demo with the favored tubes

We will try to wrap up by 5:00 PM as most of you attending are coming from afar and several have plans to catch

Please PM me for any thoughts or concerns

I'm looking forward to meeting all of you as I know perhaps only 4 people attending

Lets have fun and do our best to stay safe.

I thought for ongoing continuity of this thread it would be my thought that those attending post their thoughts and comments in this thread as it will be the best way to follow the Horizon. After this event and those thoughts have all been posted and comments made Golum will be starting a thread on tube rolling with the Horizon. I have to admit that Lukasz favorite set which I am using is something I would be happy with forever. I do want to try my Shuguang gz480 after the KR-RK 5u4g and perhaps the NIB matched quad set of Tung Sol KT 170

Super nice of you to put this gig on and have everyone over. Lots of work, but I'm am sure it is a ton of fun too! I wish I had time to go; I look forward to the videos following the event.

 

[microstrip]

Wow. Tell that to Spectral and others whose input impedance is 10K for a reason. As Steve said, let your ears be the judge, but a relevant question that has not yet been answered (unless I missed it) is- what is the output impedance of the Horizon? Is it low as in 7 ohms (like Gryphon Commander) or 25 ohms (VTL 7.5III)? Or high as in 300 ohms (ARC Ref 10). Just curious. It's not a trick question, but a legitimate one.

As far as I can guess, the critical parameter should also be the value of the coupling output capacitor. "Lower than 10k is bad news. The bass extension may suffer a few hertz of the lowest octave" (quote from the manual).

 

[wil]

Wow. Tell that to Spectral and others whose input impedance is 10K for a reason. As Steve said, let your ears be the judge, but a relevant question that has not yet been answered (unless I missed it) is- what is the output impedance of the Horizon? Is it low as in 7 ohms (like Gryphon Commander) or 25 ohms (VTL 7.5III)? Or high as in 300 ohms (ARC Ref 10). Just curious. It's not a trick question, but a legitimate one.

Re output impedance for Horizon, I just saw on the website : "Output impedance: 600 Ohms per phase"

 

[Willgolf]

Steve, I am driving in from Arizona so Saturday is the only day I can attend as we will be making the long drive back on Sunday.

I am in the camp that loves my Pacific direct to my Canary Audio Grand Reference 300B monoblocks.

 

[mr.gregdee]

I want to make another announcement about this weekend. Based on what Lukasz and Fred are want ting to show I am suggesting that everyone attend at noon and plan on staying until done as here is the program

PROGRAM

1. Introduction of Lukasz and Fred
2. Some words from Lukasz
3. Demo of Horizon with Lukasz favorite tube set, (which I have to say I am loving and could live with these forever)
4. Demo of Horizon using a multitude of different tubes
5. Demo of Pacific
6. Demo of Horizon direct to amps
7. Closing thoughts from attendees

There will be food and drink served safely throughout the afternoon in individual servings . Masks will be provided if needed as well as hand washing solution but all I ask is those who are attending and have any symptoms please be tested before you come

Ron will be filming an interview with Lukasz for our video channel and also polling thoughts of those attending

Finally several more people have been added and if you are concerned re safety, it seems that way more than half attending are coming on Saturday so let me know if you want to switch to Sunday. For consideration is the amount of listening time evrtyone is going to get on Saturday vs those coming on Sunday. The game will be televised throughout my house for those wanting to follow the game if they aren't in the listening room

I mention all of this only because my listening room is my man cave and not built for large crowds (even though I have had a record of 18 people in my room at the same time So my thought was to have the longest individual listening experience in the sweet spot during the initial Horizon demo with the favored tubes

We will try to wrap up by 5:00 PM as most of you attending are coming from afar and several have plans to catch

Please PM me for any thoughts or concerns

I'm looking forward to meeting all of you as I know perhaps only 4 people attending

Lets have fun and do our best to stay safe.

I thought for ongoing continuity of this thread it would be my thought that those attending post their thoughts and comments in this thread as it will be the best way to follow the Horizon. After this event and those thoughts have all been posted and comments made Golum will be starting a thread on tube rolling with the Horizon. I have to admit that Lukasz favorite set which I am using is something I would be happy with forever. I do want to try my Shuguang gz480 after the KR-RK 5u4g and perhaps the NIB matched quad set of Tung Sol KT 170

Fantastic program Steve. Well done. We are all ears

 

[Phantom-Audio]

Looks nice, Those Blue Globes are 6SN7? Which manufacturer makes these?

 

[Golum]

Looks nice, Those Blue Globes are 6SN7? Which manufacturer makes these?

PSvane

 

[Steve Williams]

Master Yoda is in the house All I can say is Lukasz is a blast and is filled with so many life challenging stories that he had us gasping

He's jet lagged and we put him to bed.. Busy day tomorrow and fFred arrives tomorrow eveningt

Lukas taught me something very interesting about the Horizon for those of us who use SE rather than balanced

He suggested that rather than using a quad set of power tubes(where the two power tubes on the right of center are for balanced ), that I take out those two good tubes on the right and fill those sockets with any cheap tube

 

[nirodha]

I respect designers/manufacturers but this is kind of untrue comment that should not be written in a manual of a quality component. Since long we know the danger of writing "every", "all", "never" or "none" in this hobby, filled with respectable exceptions.

Nirodha states:” if a dac sounds emotionally more involving without a preamp, you are doing something wrong”. You see how easy it is to state something

 

[dminches]

Master Yoda is in the house All I can say is Lukasz is a blast and is filled with so many life challenging stories that he had us gasping

He's jet lagged and we put him to bed.. Busy day tomorrow and Fred arrives tomorrow eveningt

Lukas taught me something very interesting about the Horizon for those of us who use SE rather than balanced

He suggested that rather than using a quad set of power tubes(where the two power tubes on the right of center are for balanced ), that I take out those two good tubes on the right and fill those sockets with any cheap tube

Is that also true of the 2nd triode tube?

 

[Steve Williams]

Is that also true of the 2nd triode tube?

I wondered the same . I'll ask him when he's awake