In Pursuit of the very best amplifier (to my ears!) money can buy...

Pat,
Lots of really nice choices, did you listen to the Nagra Reference pre when you visited FL? I really like the Nagra Pre, its very musical with a natural sound to my ears. I'm building a new home with a dedicated room and am currently using the Nagra Ref amps and pre and also have a Boulder 3060 and 3010. Did you use the Boulder gear with the Lyras? If so, how was the sound and why did you move on from the Boulder amps and pre? I don't plan on keeping all of the gear but am waiting to get into the room to make a decision, interested to hear your thoughts.

Dave
Somewhat curously I also found the d'Ag to be a tick sweeter than the Nagra. For some stuff that was preferred but for other material it wasn't so much. Truth be told I had my girlfriend with me and she very much preferred the d'Ag. I realize this probably disqualifies my findings! For me, the VAC Statement, the Nagra Ref and the d'Ag were all perfectly great options.
 
Interesting, I've only heard D'ag Relentless with Wilson, sound was visceral but hard to judge being in a highrise with marble floors, I assumed tubes would make the Nagra a bit sweeter sounding than the SS D'ag pre. IME, tubes make a big difference with the Nagra, new Russian tubes sounded lifeless compared to NOS Amperex or Siemens from the late 50's. Good luck in your quest, hope we all find the sound we're looking for!

Dave
 
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Shocking thing about the Varese (sorry for the DAC diversion)...I have A|B'd it with a streamer+USB vs. ethernet direct and I cannot discern a material difference. I even spoke with dCS about it - they effectively smiled and said they put a lot of work into the streamer.

In fact I did a lot of listening and experiences and in the end I sold my old Taiko Extreme ... I was sorry to see it go, it had given me many years of great sound with the Vidaldi. With the Vivaldi, IMO it really made the difference.
 
Somewhat curously I also found the d'Ag to be a tick sweeter than the Nagra. For some stuff that was preferred but for other material it wasn't so much. Truth be told I had my girlfriend with me and she very much preferred the d'Ag. I realize this probably disqualifies my findings! For me, the VAC Statement, the Nagra Ref and the d'Ag were all perfectly great options.
Gryphon Apex ?
 
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Somewhat curously I also found the d'Ag to be a tick sweeter than the Nagra. For some stuff that was preferred but for other material it wasn't so much. Truth be told I had my girlfriend with me and she very much preferred the d'Ag. I realize this probably disqualifies my findings! For me, the VAC Statement, the Nagra Ref and the d'Ag were all perfectly great options.

Which preamplfier sounded closer to using no preamplfier is terms of tonal balance?
 
Poor Pat. Seems some of the crowd is less than happy with his decisions.
Ironically, the Goldmund room in Munich this year had amazing live music from a real string quartet, playing expensive period instruments and had one of the worst sounds at the show for their HiFi :eek:
 
Ironically, the Goldmund room in Munich this year had amazing live music from a real string quartet, playing expensive period instruments and had one of the worst sounds at the show for their HiFi :eek:

Why judge gear from bad sound at a show?
 
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spoken like a true dealer. :rolleyes:
I sell only the one brand, so it is something I believe in,. It seems the VAC is the only tube pre he tried, I am presenting an alternative, which Ron can confirm has plenty of merit as he owns an AC preamp.
 
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With my Boulder 3060 I always said that it treated all source material as a nail - there was detail, drive, resolution and power, delicacy...not so much.
I was going to post a detailed response to the many comments about the Boulder 3060, an amp I have owned for nearly a decade. I was going to post it in the Boulder forum but it no longer exists. I expect we will see a Goldmund forum as there is now a Stellavox forum.
 
I was going to post a detailed response to the many comments about the Boulder 3060, an amp I have owned for nearly a decade. I was going to post it in the Boulder forum but it no longer exists. I expect we will see a Goldmund forum as there is now a Stellavox forum.
There has been Goldmund forum on the WTB forums for a long while.
 
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I was going to post a detailed response to the many comments about the Boulder 3060, an amp I have owned for nearly a decade. I was going to post it in the Boulder forum but it no longer exists. I expect we will see a Goldmund forum as there is now a Stellavox forum.
take a deep breath


 
Which preamplfier sounded closer to using no preamplfier is terms of tonal balance?
I did not ever listen to the system sans preamplifier. I have run a couple systems in the past without a preamplifier. In every single case I preferred the sound with a pre in the mix. I realize that the pre adds something to the sound. But, I am seeking a sound that is pleasant to me. Not some ethereal raw studio sound - I could go on and on about the falsehood of 'as the artist intended...' I know for fact and from experience with several top artists that is just not accurate or true. Anyway, I digress!

Another way I think about it is that the preamplifier does about 15-20% of the lifting gain and the power amplifier does the remainder. So, the in-series mix enables an interesting cocktail.

(fun fact: Metallica (and many fans) preferred the mix of one of their albums as it was done using the stems on Guitar Hero the videogame over the commercially available media.)
 
I could go on and on about the falsehood of 'as the artist intended...' I know for fact and from experience with several top artists that is just not accurate or true.

Well thats the whole point of listening to music at home
Music is art and the role of a home stereo system is to replay that art ( musicians intent ) over the stereo system .

4 years at munich ( both shows and 24 years being an audiophile ) showed me that the Hifi ( hyped reviewer /magz industry) is far removed from that , its all about expensive shiny boxes connected with nice looking cables but leave me boring and unimpressed after 20 - 30 min .

And yes i have the $$$ to afford the so called " high level " stuff.

Thats why i bought/ decided on the Hegel integrated in the end with a very nice integrated DAC . :cool: good value.
 
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Well thats the whole point of listening to music at home
Music is art and the role of a home stereo system is to replay that art ( musicians intent ) over the stereo system .

4 years at munich ( both shows and 24 years being an audiophile ) showed me that the Hifi ( hyped reviewer /magz industry) is far removed from that , its all about expensive shiny boxes connected with nice looking cables but leave me boring and unimpressed after 20 - 30 min .

And yes i have the $$$ to afford the so called " high level " stuff.

Thats why i bought/ decided on the Hegel integrated in the end with a very nice integrated DAC . :cool: good value.
IF the Hegel ingratiated floats your boat who are we to argue otherwise?! So , you might be in the wrong thread then? :D
 
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Part 6: d'Agostino Relentless

This system was not in my home - I travelled to LMC in Arizona to hear it.

Setup: dCS Varese -> d'Agostino Relentless pre -> d;Agostino Relentless monos -> Wilson XVX (Transparent Opus cabling)

Ron R and I travelled to LMC. I was just getting so tired of movers and freight companies and all the hullabaloo of getting 400+ pound amps in and out my home. When we first sat down the plan was to listen to the Burmester 159s/Burmester 808s as a sort of calibration. I had become quite familiar with the Burmesters in my own system and so I was trying to set a baseline. I know it won't stand up to scrutiny but it was better than nothing. When we started I immediately suspected something was wrong. I am somewhat familiar with the XVXs and I am familiar with the Burmester setup. The sound was warm but it lacked resolution and dynamics. I asked if something else could be going one. Aha! It was the DAC - they had a Linn Organik DAC in the chain. Nice as it was, it wasn't quite there. So, they kindly swapped in a dCS Varese and wowza! Okay! Now were are talking! It sounded natural, neutral, never sibilant or harsh. It was an interesting contrast to my own system. (I have since purchased a Varese which I will chat on in a different thread!) Compared to my system it was more resolving, slightly less warm, more controlled but also a tick less continuous to my ears. I have always felt that the Wilsons sound incredible so long as you are seated just so.

With the baseline in hand we switched to the Relentless pre + monos. Wow was it a close call between the Burmester and the Relentless. The Relentless was slightly sweeter. It had a bit more bass drive and oomph but no more resolution. I apologize but I am not remebering all the differences as that was a whirlwind day and I don't want to misstate anything. Good as it all was, it became truly special for me when we changed the pre-amplifier. LMC put an Audio Research Ref 6 into the mix. Together with the Relentless it was a magical combination. What we lost in resolution, dynamics and drive we more than gained int mid-rang bliss. To my ears it sounded like the best of tubes AND SS. I left thinking I had found the combination!

There were just a couple options left to consider....more to follow
Can you expand a little more on the Relentless preamp vs the Audio Research with the Relentless power amps and the Wilsons? I am currently running the Relentless preamp with the D'Agostino MXV 400 monos, Alexx Vs and a Varese, so a similar system, and am interested in your views on the preamp switch-out. Also, what's your taste in music (i.e. leaning more classical or rock)?
 

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