Friday night listening

[Carlos269]

What an awesome looking TT setup ! Must sound amazing I’m sure.. Enjoy !!

Thanks Mike. One thing that I should have mentioned and that should be noted, which makes the Fuchs tonearm special, is that it has a magnetic bearing. The tonearm is suspended by a magnet, which serves as the pivot point. There is also a second magnet underneath the pivot point to act as a counter force for alignment.



This is a one-of-a-kind tonearm handmade in Germany by Dr. Robert Fuchs out of Tigerwood and it is a real beauty:

 

[Mikem53]

I now see how it’s suspended. How unique! You have some very interesting gear and combinations that are a treat for the eyes. I can only imagine how special it all must sound when paired ”correctly”, the character of these custom designs must all come through during playback.
I’ve never seen so much esoteric gear in one place, not even at shows..
Thank you Carlos for expanding my audio horizons..

 

[Carlos269]

Last night was a rainy and storming night and one of the drawbacks of having sky-lights in your listening room is the no matter how well insulated your room is, you still hear the pitter-patter of the rain striking the domed acrylic screens.

Nevertheless the beauty and sound of the new turntable set-up and the system as a whole made me persist with my listening session:













The massive idler and associated components sounded pretty good on their initial spin and listening session:

 

[Carlos269]

All the pieces for my new all out Open Baffle based system are now in house. I have assembled the new system and the initial extended listening session last night rewarded the effort and shows potential to scale great heights.

The new system is mostly a vintage affair with modern implementation. At the heart of the system are the very special Atelier-Rullit Silver Lab 10 full range drivers. These are the Alnico version serial number 1 & 2, the first pair ever produced, have only seen one other pair.

Some may wonder why I did not choose to go with the famed Atelier-Rullit field-coil version: for one, I did not want to mess with getting 150-250 Volt tube field-coil power-supplies commissioned and then having the to obsess about finding the optimal voltage setting; yes the Rullit filed-coil drivers run of of high voltage as opposed to most field coils that are energized from 12Vdc. And second and the most important reason why I chose to go with the Alnico version is because it is my understanding that the Alnico version sounds more refined and Oleg seems to indicate that these are rather extremely rare, as “This is a really rare opportunity to purchase an unique pair of speakers "hand made in Germany", for I'm not regularly able to invest a lot of time in a project like this.” and therefore they did come at a higher cost than the field-coil version.

 

[Carlos269]

Next came choosing the baffles. After a deep dive into the Open Baffle world, I learned that there are different camps but in the end decided to go with JE Labs version of the OB design. The gentleman from whom I purchased the baffles had done his own research and concluded that the JE Labs style was optimal for eliminating the bass cancellation caused by the back wave. The JE Labs OB is based on the G.A. Briggs design featured in Stereo Sound, in Japan back in 1996.

 

[Carlos269]

While on the JE Labs’ blogspot I reviewed the amplifiers section and learned about the modified RCA Radiotron SE2A3 design (single-ended) amplifier. I then found an amp builder that had built a dual monoblock version of the JE Labs’ modified RCA Radiotron SE2A3 amplifier, and he had adapted the design to use Type 45 output tubes instead of 2A3’s and with the 6C6 as the driver tube. To make things even better he used vintage Telefunken irons for the both the power and output transformers. B, just what I was looking for my new system:

 

[Mikem53]

Very nice, So how do the Sonics differ from your recent TM system with 45’s ?

 

[Carlos269]

Very nice, So how do the Sonics differ from your recent TM system with 45’s ?

It’s too early to say. I’m still fine tuning the new system.

 

[Carlos269]

Coming from listening to the monster Thomas Mayer 10Y Silver preamplifier, I wasn’t sure in what direction to go in, for a preamplifier for the new system. I spoke with Oliver Sayes about a bespoke 71A DHT preamp since I already own Type 01A, 10Y, 26 and 300B DHT pre’s and consider DHT preamps the best for controlling DHT Single-Ended-Triode amplifiers, but then a very rare opportunity presented itself to get a very exotic Telefunken RE084 DHT preamplifier for the new system. You don’t see many RE084 DHT preamps because the regular TFK RE084 tubes tend to be microphonic and there is an extremely limited supply of RE084 tubes. The solution to the first challenge is to use the special RE084K version of the tube that Telefunken screened for microphonics. The only way to mitigate the supply issue is to procure a lifetime supply of the tubes, which I have done.







The Telefunken AZ11 rectifier tube in use in the separate power-supply is also very special, especially in the mesh plates version, which are also very scarce but I have also managed to get a lifetime supply of them, I hope.







This is a very sexy preamplifier with exotic components, cocobolo chassis and aged copper leaf top plates. It sounds even better than it looks and it is dead quiet.

After doing some research on Alejandro Bartola‘s site, I’m glad that I went in this direction rather than a DHT 4P1L or EML 20A based preamp for this system.

 

[Carlos269]

The last piece of the puzzle came courtesy of Radu Tarta. The super-tweeters sourced from Radu serve two purposes: 1. To bring the overall AC impedance load of the speakers down to 4 Ohms, to match the 4 Ohm secondaries on 45 amplifier’s Telefunken output transformers for maximum power transmission and delivery. And 2) because on the JE Labs style baffles the full range driver is mounted closer to the floor to maximize bass coupling to the floor, the soundstage level can sound at a lower height than normal at the siting position. One way to raise and restore the soundstage to the normal height with the JE Lab style open baffles is to judiciously integrate a super-tweeter. The super-tweeters from Radu accomplished both goals with great sonic results:

 

[cjfrbw]

Interesting. The RE084 tube looks from specs like it could nearly be a drop in replacement for STC 110a type. I wouldn't want to blow one up trying, though.

 

[Carlos269]

For source, I am streaming Tidal Hi-Fi to my dCS Elgar Plus dac. Here are some pictures of my new Open Baffle based system:

 

[cjfrbw]

I have been impressed with various open baffle systems at audio shows, so it will be interesting what your final assessment is.

 

[Carlos269]

It is a pretty good indication when the sun rising tells you that your listening session must come to an end and that you have to go to bed. Another nice listening session last night.

Started with listening to the powerhouse system that is the one of a kind LampizatOr DSD-Only DAC, massive Thomas Mayer 10Y Silver preamplifier, custom 46 amp and Loth-X Troubadours with the original version of the Stefan Stamm ultra high sensitivity Alnico full range drivers.

Ended the night/morning listening to my newest system streaming Tidal HiFi to a dCS Elgar Plus DAC as source for my new custom Telefunken RE084K DHT preamplifier, which controls the new JE Labs inspired dual-monoblock Type 45 amplifier with vintage Telefunken irons that drive the Atelier-Rullit Silver Lab 10 Alnico full range drivers in the JE Labs style Open Baffles, augmented by the Radu Tarta super-tweeters.

For those wondering how the sound of these two very different systems compares to each other, here are a couple tracks on each system for your dicernment:

 

[cjfrbw]

Wow. Through the faulty medium of YouTube compression, I preferred the open baffle system by a bit. The Loth system sounded more intense and 'analytic'. However, those attributes might very well be very nice in the real life situation as opposed to internet media.

 

[Carlos269]

Wow. Through the faulty medium of YouTube compression, I preferred the open baffle system by a bit. The Loth system sounded more intense and 'analytic'. However, those attributes might very well be very nice in the real life situation as opposed to internet media.

Thank you for the feedback. I think that I know what you mean.

I have fine-tuned the Open Baffle system even further from the time of when the videos were recorded. I need to record and post a second round of videos.

To me, the speed, detail and articulation rendered by the original Stamm drivers in the Loth-X Troubadours is unmatched. The combination of that level of articulation with the clarity of the 801A’s & the warmth of the silver wound Tribute Audio Finemet core OPTVC’s in the Thomas Mayer 10Y Silver preamp, and Sayes Type 46 S.E.T. DHT amplifier is pure magic! Having said all that, what the custom Telefunken RE084K DHT preamp, the Bavera custom JE Labs 45 dual-monoblock amp and Oleg Rullit‘s Atelier-Rullit Silver Lab 10 Alnico full-range drivers and Radu Tarta super-tweeters in the JE Labs style Open Baffles give you is “a bit” more of an “Organic“ sound. There is a certain ”vintage Telefunken” sound with the Open Baffle system.

I like the way that Nick, the builder of the 45 amp, put it: “German transformers sound different than vintage American or Japanese iron. it has a natural, neutral sound that resembles the live performance with its airy presentation.”

 

[Andrew S.]

Great thread and thank you for posting.

A good friend now passed away had the Troubadours - they are actually now for sale here in Aus. for around USD2200.

He used a Yamamoto 300B power amp a Graham Slee phono & pre and a Brinkmann Bardo with Jelco arm and Supreme SPU.

in his tiny one bedroom apartment they were heavenly. You didn’t need volume to get the detail. I agree with everything to say about the Stamm.

unfortunately my friend was a heavy smoker and everything he owned smelled terribly of cigarettes (something I can’t stand), plus they are in another State with an ocean in the way, and I’m recuperating from some surgery and can’t lift more than 2kg….so not to be.

otherwise, I’d be joining you in owning a pair!

I like open baffles - built a few over the years. But for me the sound was everywhere but nowhere - if you know what I mean. I’m being clumsy in my words - sorry - hard to describe.
Great for room nodes (the figure 8 thing) though.

love to hear your systems. Very interesting and unusual.

 

[Carlos269]

Great thread and thank you for posting.

A good friend now passed away had the Troubadours - they are actually now for sale here in Aus. for around USD2200.

He used a Yamamoto 300B power amp a Graham Slee phono & pre and a Brinkmann Bardo with Jelco arm and Supreme SPU.

in his tiny one bedroom apartment they were heavenly. You didn’t need volume to get the detail. I agree with everything to say about the Stamm.

unfortunately my friend was a heavy smoker and everything he owned smelled terribly of cigarettes (something I can’t stand), plus they are in another State with an ocean in the way, and I’m recuperating from some surgery and can’t lift more than 2kg….so not to be.

otherwise, I’d be joining you in owning a pair!

I like open baffles - built a few over the years. But for me the sound was everywhere but nowhere - if you know what I mean. I’m being clumsy in my words - sorry - hard to describe.
Great for room nodes (the figure 8 thing) though.

love to hear your systems. Very interesting and unusual.

Thanks Andrew. If your late friend’s Loth-X Troubadours speakers have the original version of the Stamm driver, with the whizzer, they are worth every effort, smoke stink and all, to get them across the Ocean. The original Stefan Stamm drivers are the real deal, a true apex predator driver that outperforms the competition and deliver at the highest level. In this hobby where most correlate cost with performance, the Stamm drivers quickly slay any misleading or preconceived expectations. The Stamm drivers are real gems!

 

[Carlos269]

I like open baffles - built a few over the years. But for me the sound was everywhere but nowhere - if you know what I mean. I’m being clumsy in my words - sorry - hard to describe.
Great for room nodes (the figure 8 thing) though.

love to hear your systems. Very interesting and unusual.

The key to Open Baffles with single full-range drivers is to make sure that the back wave of the driver does not attenuate the forward bass output. The JE Labs OB design gives guidance on how wide versus low frequency cutoff the baffles needs to be to mitigate the reduction of bass output due to cancellation from the rear wave energy created by the driver excursion. With the JE Labs design style baffles there is no “figure 8 thing” that goes on.

As I embark on my next audio exploration into the field-coil/electro-dynamic drivers faction of the hobby I will once again go with Open Baffles but ones of different design concept.

 

[Andrew S.]

Thanks Andrew. If your late friend’s Loth-X Troubadours speakers have the original version of the Stamm driver, with the whizzer, they are worth every effort, smoke stink and all, to get them across the Ocean. The original Stefan Stamm drivers are the real deal, a true apex predator driver that outperforms the competition and deliver at the highest level. In this hobby where most correlate cost with performance, the Stamm drivers quickly slay any misleading or preconceived expectations. The Stamm drivers are real gems!

Unfortunately they are local pick up only in Melbourne. I'm in Hobart. Bass Strait is in the middle. And unfortunately my friend who died didn't keep the packaging.

Sorry to say my health isn't up to more than having a shower and walking out to the lounge at the moment. Let alone organizing a freight company to go pick them up, pack them and get them to me. And then hoping they arrive undamaged.

In any event - these photo's were from the Estate sale: the seller hasn't posted any recent photos. You will be able to tell me if they are original Stamm's. They have the whizzer, so I expect they are.

The key to Open Baffles with single full-range drivers is to make sure that the back wave of the driver does not attenuate the forward bass output. The JE Labs OB design gives guidance on how wide versus low frequency cutoff the baffles needs to be to mitigate the reduction of bass output due to cancellation from the rear wave energy created by the driver excursion. With the JE Labs design style baffles there is no “figure 8 thing” that goes on.

As I embark on my next audio exploration into the field-coil/electro-dynamic drivers faction of the hobby I will once again go with Open Baffles but ones of different design concept.

Re Open Baffles

Ahhh - that all makes sense. The ones I had in 2008 were a pair of the now defunct Hawthorne Audio 15 inch coaxial sterling drivers with bass 15 inches drivers, in tall not very wide baffles, and then in 2009 single drivers (by memory some form of Lowthers) in much the same.

The OB's I came up with sounded not bad - especially with certain music - but not in the same league as the Troubadours, or ESL's or a good box speaker - at least for classical which is what I listen to. Fun experiments though. I am quite sure what you are making would sound sublime.

I shall follow your adventures with much interest! A great pity I cannot snap my fingers and come over for a listen. Your type of systems interest me. Something away from the usual.

Speaking of Single Drivers - the Eclipse TD 712.

This was a speaker I owned in 2015/2016 that was very special. It is a single driver sealed unit. I would own another pair of those is a jiffy - they were my wife's favourite speakers - high WAF. That said - SETS need not apply - well they would work with 8 watts of 300B, but you wouldn't want to. I found them monsterously difficult to partner well. The better you feed them the better they sounded.


Thank you again for posting.