Brief Visit With MartinLogan Neoliths

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,547
0
36
#41
Lloyd, read my new thread. At schipol after listening to the grands. If you have the room, one word. Buy.
Just saw it and already commented! While we might have the room...i do NOT have the appetite for that 6-channel, all-Krell, massive beast. Make no mistake, i can imagine setup and run properly, they are awesome, but i admit to having my limits. I think any change in our current system would have to remain a 2-speaker plus sub(s) setup. Even the 'narrower' 4-speaker setup like Pendragon or Genesis 2s are going to prove difficult, however tempting they might be.

Question is how does an Apogee Full Range plus dual subs compare?
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
8,828
36
48
London
#42
Just saw it and already commented! While we might have the room...i do NOT have the appetite for that 6-channel, all-Krell, massive beast. Make no mistake, i can imagine setup and run properly, they are awesome, but i admit to having my limits. I think any change in our current system would have to remain a 2-speaker plus sub(s) setup. Even the 'narrower' 4-speaker setup like Pendragon or Genesis 2s are going to prove difficult, however tempting they might be.

Question is how does an Apogee Full Range plus dual subs compare?
You don't need the Grands, the full range is as good - same mids and SOTA unparalleled bass. The thing is to avoid unbalancing in the bass on some music, like I heard with fullrange, you need to have good amp control which is possible but needs expert guidance like Henk's. The Krells in full ranges are in the woofer.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
8,828
36
48
London
#43
I am talking about axpona show in chicago going on right now. Is this what you are evaluating?
Hi no, i thought you were making a generic comment that renaissance has to sound better because of Anthem room correction
 
Apr 3, 2010
16,022
0
0
Seattle, WA
#44
Hi no, i thought you were making a generic comment that renaissance has to sound better because of Anthem room correction
Well it can :). But room correction requires skill in running the calibration process. Here in US they clearly had done that. I don't know they did at that dealer show in London.

Based on hearing renaissance twice now at two different shows, I find that it nicely gets rid of room induced booming. You can put a speaker 100 times the price and size and it won't be able the cheat the laws of room acoustics and make good bass. You either need EQ, extensive room design, or both. Few showrooms are setup that way and the smaller the rooms, the worse those problems.
 

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,547
0
36
#45
You don't need the Grands, the full range is as good - same mids and SOTA unparalleled bass. The thing is to avoid unbalancing in the bass on some music, like I heard with fullrange, you need to have good amp control which is possible but needs expert guidance like Henk's. The Krells in full ranges are in the woofer.
Thanks and good to know...
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
8,828
36
48
London
#46
Thanks and good to know...
If you have active crossovers like he did, then you need many amps. Same would be the case for Wilson or Neolith. It can be passive, active, semi-active
 
Last edited:

LL21

Active Member
Dec 26, 2010
10,547
0
36
#47
If you active crossovers like he did, then you need many amps. Same would be the case for Wilson or Neolith. It can be passive, active, semi-active
Thanks...i have heard of people using Wilson active crossover to good effective with their passive subs.
 

spiritofmusic

Member Sponsor
Jun 13, 2013
6,231
11
38
E. England
#48
Further to a little gentle admonishment by a fellow member, just a few words to clarify my thoughts on the Neoliths demo.
There was a lot to like, scale, dynamic prowess, seemingly unlimited volume.
Not my intention to come across sniffy, I know how much I hate it when my choices are castigated online.
Tbh, maybe I ought to stick to the maxim that if I have nothing positive to say, say nothing.
I'm certainly no stats expert, having only heard various MLs a half dozen times in two decades.
 
May 19, 2014
693
0
16
Round Rock, TX
#49
Any comparison of the Prodigy vs Summit vs Renaissance?

Also, wrt frame resonating, I noticed it with SL3s and Summits (aluminum torqued frame). How much of a detriment that is to the sound, not sure, but can't be good. The Neolith is massive, huge panel, big woofers so I'd wager that irrespective of the frame material and some absorbing gasket there's no easy way to eliminate all that excess energy. You'd probably need a much more massive damping agent/gasket + added frame size and weight which aesthetically wouldn't fly for ML.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
8,828
36
48
London
#50
Any comparison of the Prodigy vs Summit vs Renaissance?

Also, wrt frame resonating, I noticed it with SL3s and Summits (aluminum torqued frame). How much of a detriment that is to the sound, not sure, but can't be good. The Neolith is massive, huge panel, big woofers so I'd wager that irrespective of the frame material and some absorbing gasket there's no easy way to eliminate all that excess energy. You'd probably need a much more massive damping agent/gasket + added frame size and weight which aesthetically wouldn't fly for ML.
I would assume Renaissance is better but it wasn't sounding that way on Friday, KJ explained woofer driver wasn't burned in and their second room is small as well so it wasn't an ideal room. All electronics were SS and IMO stats need a valve in the chain.
 
May 19, 2014
693
0
16
Round Rock, TX
#51
I would assume Renaissance is better but it wasn't sounding that way on Friday, KJ explained woofer driver wasn't burned in and their second room is small as well so it wasn't an ideal room. All electronics were SS and IMO stats need a valve in the chain.
Thanks. I wonder if it's that much better - or just bigger sounding? I liked my Summits very much, but felt a bigger panel to fill my room would've helped a great deal.
 

Harlequin

New Member
Jul 30, 2013
741
0
0
N/A
#52
By way of a postscript to my previous considerations regarding the amplification employed to drive the Neoliths At the event.
KJ themselves were somewhat "unsure" as to the choice on the day and were not entirely convinced that the Neoliths had been allowed to fully demonstrate their true capabilities, as they had heard for themselves upon first arrival with another brand of amplification.

As they had custody of the Neoliths for another day, Seve organised an impromptu in store amp-off, during the course of the following Monday.
I was not present myself, however I was not in the slightest suprised to be told that substituting a Valve amplifier brought about an additional degree of natural harmonic tonality and texture in the mids and upper registers that I thought missing on the day, the transducers now producing an entirely more organic rendition of the same tracks and medium employed at the event itself.

The most convincing and impressive replay via SS amplification resulted from D'Agostino Momentum amplification, in concert with with the same ARC valve pre as utilized during the event.

An opportunity missed methinks!