Audionet Scientist Series: Humboldt Integrated vs Stern and Heisenberg Separates : Having Your Cake and Eating it Too?

[christoph]

Thanks for your feedback.
I’m thinking now of Accustic Arts Mono II as better bet than Max.
Regarding the Heisenberg, it’s just more than I want to spend...
I will go and listen to these combinations next week - let’s see.

Why not the Humboldt, then?

 

[3125simon]

Why not the Humboldt, then?

Good question - it’s essentially because I can get the Stern/max for less that a Humboldt, even after the extra power cord and interconnect.

Then I have a “world-class” what ever that means preamp and can move to a better power amp if necessary and or funds permit.

Simon

 

[Thieliste]

Good question - it’s essentially because I can get the Stern/max for less that a Humboldt, even after the extra power cord and interconnect.

Then I have a “world-class” what ever that means preamp and can move to a better power amp if necessary and or funds permit.

Simon

You could also get a good deal on the Humboldt i guess.

 

[RSR]

Humboldt is, for me, the best Integrated I've heard: bettering Vitus, Pilium, Soulution, Nagra, Stern plus Maxs, CH M1.1s, D'agostino and EMM lab separates. Only the Stern & Heisenbergs eclipse this integrated IMHO.

Could you elaborate on this?

Would be great to understand in what ways it bettered these other amps, that we may be familiar with. I ask as I would like to know if the Humboldt is a potential for me.

 

[musicfirst1]

Could you elaborate on this?

Would be great to understand in what ways it bettered these other amps, that we may be familiar with. I ask as I would like to know if the Humboldt is a potential for me.

Much more musically involving for me. Better dynamics (micro and macro), lower noise floor, exceptional transparency, low level and micro details, yet not at all bright or etched. Did I mention Dynamics?
All of these attributes, for me add up to more MUSICALITY. All the other contenders editorialize relatively speaking. (Check out Greg Weaver's comments on the line in general.) I know Weavers heard a TON more contenders than me, and a little birdie told me he's saving his hard earned pennies to buy the Heisenberg monoblocks.
The Humboldt, is so far ahead of Audionet's own MAX in all the above regards, that It's almost embarrassing. and I would still take the Audionet MAX's above the other brands under discussion.

 

[Thieliste]

Completely agree on Audionet's scientist series.
I hope one day to be able to afford Stern-Heisenberg combo and a pair of used Borresen 05s.

 

[audio1]

Completely agree on Audionet's scientist series.
I hope one day to be able to afford Stern-Heisenberg combo and a pair of used Borresen 05s.

I have Heisenbergs and Borresen 05s, driven direct by a Chord Dave and Mscaler and the system is really incredible, natural, effortless and really musical.

 

[Thieliste]

I have Heisenbergs and Borresen 05s, driven direct by a Chord Dave and Mscaler and the system is really incredible, natural, effortless and really musical.

@audio1 Congrats you have a very nice system!
Do you plan to add the Stern at some point ? that would be a substantial upgrade vs Dave direct.
I own a Hugo TT2 wich i like very much for headphone listening and also to drive my Dynaudio Xeo 3 in my office system, might add the Mscaler at some point.
What size room do you use your Borresen 05s in ?
Cheers

 

[audio1]

@audio1 Congrats you have a very nice system!
Do you plan to add the Stern at some point ? that would be a substantial upgrade vs Dave direct.
I own a Hugo TT2 wich i like very much for headphone listening and also to drive my Dynaudio Xeo 3 in my office system, might add the Mscaler at some point.
What size room do you use your Borresen 05s in ?
Cheers

Thanks. No, I have no plans to add the Stern. I have no analogue sources so do not need it. Dave has no problems driving the Heisenbergs direct and has a transparent digital volume control. I don't agree that it would be a substantial upgrade. It would entail considerable additional expenditure, interconnects and power cords etc. Have you heard the Heisenbergs driven direct by Dave? The Heisenbergs are suppose to be better performers than the Stern. I have compared the Stern and Heisenbergs to the Dave direct, and much preferred it direct.

My room is 5 x 7 metres approx with 3.3 metre high ceilings.

The Mscaler is a really worthwhile upgrade. It transforms the Dave imho.

 

[XV-1]

Well, reading Audionet's propaganda , It appears that DC coupling is a big difference technically, also the bandwidth of the scientist series is quite a bit wider.

Don't get me wrong the MAXs are better than all the other SS designs I've ever heard, but the Scientist series is better by a significant margin, moreso than one might expect at the edge of the art.

I would certainly choose the MAXs hands down against everything else I've heard if the Scientist Series didn't redefine the SOTA in SS for me.

I demoed The Maxx monos last year for a couple of weeks .
I preferred my D'Agostino S200 stereo amp.
After this demo I was happy to do the S250 upgrade.

 

[heihei]

Thanks. No, I have no plans to add the Stern. I have no analogue sources so do not need it. Dave has no problems driving the Heisenbergs direct and has a transparent digital volume control. I don't agree that it would be a substantial upgrade. It would entail considerable additional expenditure, interconnects and power cords etc. Have you heard the Heisenbergs driven direct by Dave? The Heisenbergs are suppose to be better performers than the Stern. I have compared the Stern and Heisenbergs to the Dave direct, and much preferred it direct.

My room is 5 x 7 metres approx with 3.3 metre high ceilings.

The Mscaler is a really worthwhile upgrade. It transforms the Dave imho.

I would agree - of the Stern and Heisenberg, it is the Heisenberg that is the star of the show. The Stern is a great pre-amp, but is no better / worse than similar priced pre from CH etc. The Heisenbergs however - different story!!

 

[Thieliste]

Thanks. No, I have no plans to add the Stern. I have no analogue sources so do not need it. Dave has no problems driving the Heisenbergs direct and has a transparent digital volume control. I don't agree that it would be a substantial upgrade. It would entail considerable additional expenditure, interconnects and power cords etc. Have you heard the Heisenbergs driven direct by Dave? The Heisenbergs are suppose to be better performers than the Stern. I have compared the Stern and Heisenbergs to the Dave direct, and much preferred it direct.

My room is 5 x 7 metres approx with 3.3 metre high ceilings.

The Mscaler is a really worthwhile upgrade. It transforms the Dave imho.

That's good to know that you can use Borresen 05s in medium size room with good results.
5x7 is the size i plan to have for my dedicated listening room.
I would love to listen to your system.

 

[musicfirst1]

Thanks. No, I have no plans to add the Stern. I have no analogue sources so do not need it. Dave has no problems driving the Heisenbergs direct and has a transparent digital volume control. I don't agree that it would be a substantial upgrade. It would entail considerable additional expenditure, interconnects and power cords etc. Have you heard the Heisenbergs driven direct by Dave? The Heisenbergs are suppose to be better performers than the Stern. I have compared the Stern and Heisenbergs to the Dave direct, and much preferred it direct.

My room is 5 x 7 metres approx with 3.3 metre high ceilings.

The Mscaler is a really worthwhile upgrade. It transforms the Dave imho.

So to reverse your question, have you heard the Stern between the Dave/Mscaler and The Heisenbergs? I'm certain that adding the Stern would sound at least different, and possibly better. If you have tried this, could you describe the differences?

 

[heihei]

Might be worth trying the TotalDAC D1 driver - Emile at Taiko reports great things. I had one on 30-day trial, and preferred the Stern.

 

[audio1]

So to reverse your question, have you heard the Stern between the Dave/Mscaler and The Heisenbergs? I'm certain that adding the Stern would sound at least different, and possibly better. If you have tried this, could you describe the differences?

I have only compared the Dave direct to the Heisenbergs with the Stern and Audionet Planck. Speakers were Focal Grande Utopia EM. There was no comparison. The Stern and Planck were bright and fatiguing the Dave was superb. Alive, incredible musicality and prat, one of best listening sessions that I have ever experienced.

 

[Thieliste]

Might be worth trying the TotalDAC D1 driver - Emile at Taiko reports great things. I had one on 30-day trial, and preferred the Stern.

Don't you need 2 Totaldac d1-driver to drive the Heisenberd without the Stern ?

 

[Thieliste]

I have only compared the Dave direct to the Heisenbergs with the Stern and Audionet Planck. Speakers were Focal Grande Utopia EM. There was no comparison. The Stern and Planck were bright and fatiguing the Dave was superb. Alive, incredible musicality and prat, one of best listening sessions that I have ever experienced.

Do you use your Mscaler always at max rate on all your music files ?

 

[heihei]

Don't you need 2 Totaldac d1-driver to drive the Heisenberd without the Stern ?

No. He does stereo and mono versions.

 

[audio1]

Do you use your Mscaler always at max rate on all your music files ?

Yes. Very little difference between 44.1 kHz CD files and 192 kHz high res then.

 

[Thieliste]

Yes. Very little difference between 44.1 kHz CD files and 192 kHz high res then.

Ok that means the Mscaler is really worth the investment.