Resealed vinyl?

djsina2

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Bought an old record off Discogs which was listed as “M/M, new sealed, collectors copy”. I received a sealed copy but after opening it both records are full of scratches. The jacket also has light handling marks on the open edge and in one spot there is what looks like magic marker touching it up. Is resealing vinyl a thing? The seller is not the original owner. Of course once confronted the seller alluded to me trying to return my old scratched up records in place of his Mint ones.
 
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Gregadd

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Yes, anyone can purchase a shrink wrap. Sadly, the person who sold it to you could also be a victim. The "tell" is if he were not the guilty culprit, he would be equally outraged I suspect.
 

Gregadd

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OOPS.
 
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djsina2

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Open to any explanations on how this is possible without resealing a well used record. Also, it’s a Japanese pressing. More known for having pristine quality right? Just don’t see how it could have so many scuffs, scratches, marks if it truly was never opened since it was pressed.
 

Bonesy Jonesy

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I also had this issue on Discogs from a Seller in China. It is currently with PayPal to decide if I get my money back when I have returned the records (there were two, first one was the wrong issue) back to the Seller !
 

ddk

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Bought an old record off Discogs which was listed as “M/M, new sealed, collectors copy”. I received a sealed copy but after opening it both records are full of scratches. The jacket also has light handling marks on the open edge and in one spot there is what looks like magic marker touching it up. Is resealing vinyl a thing? The seller is not the original owner. Of course once confronted the seller says I’m trying to return my old scratched up records in place of his Mint ones.
Sealing records is very simple, never been hard. In this day and age it doesn’t take much to fake the covers either if there’s money in it.

Out of curiosity what was the album?

david
 

djsina2

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Sealing records is very simple, never been hard. In this day and age it doesn’t take much to fake the covers either if there’s money in it.

Out of curiosity what was the album?

david
Seller says he bought it this way years ago in Japan. I have no reason to doubt that. Maybe the seller in Japan was innocent too. Japanese people love wrapping things! It’s possible miscommunication back then is why I’m seeing what I see now. The disappointing part is the seller says “well you opened it…”. How else would I play my new M/M record?? It’s a first Japanese pressing of The Song Remains The Same.
 
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Gregadd

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Seller says he bought it this way years ago in Japan. I have no reason to doubt that. Maybe the seller in Japan was innocent too. Japanese people love wrapping things! It’s possible miscommunication back then is why I’m seeing what I see now. The disappointing part is the seller says “well you opened it…”. How else would I play my new M/M record?? It’s a first Japanese pressing of The Song Remains The Same.
You may be a little naive. At the very least it is breach of the warranty of merchantability. You know fit for the purpose intended. His recourse is against the person who sold it to him. Not your problem'
Watch his sales dry up if you go public. Prospective buyers will not care whose fault it is.
 

djsina2

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You may be a little naive. At the very least it is breach of the warranty of merchantability. You know fit for the purpose intended. His recourse is against the person who sold it to him. Not your problem'
Watch his sales dry up if you go public. Prospective buyers will not care whose fault it is.
Not naive but I have no proof of anything other than scratched up records that were said to be new. Like I said, the seller seems dug in that it’s not his problem so I’ll probably file a PP dispute. More than anything I guess I was just surprised to see what I got in a sealed record. I don’t buy a lot of old pre-owned vinyl and if I do I buy NM or M to avoid this. Mostly buy CDs off Discogs because I can polish out the inaccurate grading!
 

Gregadd

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Not naive but I have no proof of anything other than scratched up records that were said to be new. Like I said, the seller seems dug in that it’s not his problem so I’ll probably file a PP dispute. More than anything I guess I was just surprised to see what I got in a sealed record. I don’t buy a lot of old pre-owned vinyl and if I do I buy NM or M to avoid this. Mostly buy CDs off Discogs because I can polish out the inaccurate grading!
Assuming it is true you have all the proof you need. Remember he has no proof to the contrary. That presumes his innocence of which I am highly suspect. Again, if he is innocent why is he not pursuing his vendor on your behalf. I was a trial lawyer for over 30 years. I know proof. In court hid defense would be mere speculation.
Back when I was spinning vinyl reruns were accepted with no questions. My returns were made for finnicky audiophile resons. This is outright fraud by somebody in the chain.
 
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djsina2

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Assuming it is true you have all the proof you need. Remember he has no proof to the contrary. That presumes his innocence of which I am highly suspect. Again, if he is innocent why is he not pursuing his vendor on your behalf. I was a trial lawyer for over 30 years. I know proof. In court hid defense would be mere speculation.
Back when I was spinning vinyl reruns were accepted with no questions. My returns were made for finnicky audiophile resons. This is outright fraud by somebody in the chain.
He said he bought it “years ago” in Japan so there’s no recourse with the original seller. You’re right, unless I opened it in front of him there is no proof either way. I have about 5 hrs a week free time to listen to vinyl. It’s not a good use of my time dealing with all this trying to scam someone out of a $100 record.
 

Solypsa

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Imo the seller, by choosing to trust what they had without visual grading or playback grading, takes the responsibility. True you 'could' be cheating but so 'could' they. In the absence of any proof on their end about condition I think you have a case for refund. But what do I know :)

Btw I have lost almost all faith in visual grading. I wont spend much if I cant hear it or at least have a sense of trust that the seller actually played it and vouches for it.
 

Gregadd

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He said he bought it “years ago” in Japan so there’s no recourse with the original seller. You’re right, unless I opened it in front of him there is no proof either way. I have about 5 hrs a week free time to listen to vinyl. It’s not a good use of my time dealing with all this trying to scam someone out of a $100 record.
My friend once told me you can talk yourself out of anything. Your sworn testimony and the physical proof are all you need. His defense would not even be admissible. Did he open the record and inspect it?
 

djsina2

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Btw I have lost almost all faith in visual grading. I wont spend much if I cant hear it or at least have a sense of trust that the seller actually played it and vouches for it.
Yup, this is why I try to buy sealed. I think a lot of Discogs sellers are gambling on the fact that you may just accept an unrealistic grading.
 

djsina2

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My friend once told me you can talk yourself out of anything. Your sworn testimony and the physical proof are all you need. His defense would not even be admissible. Did he open the record and inspect it?
Obviously not since it was “sealed”. :)
 

Rjhd3

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Who is the seller? Whether $10, $100 , or $1000 I don’t want to buy from a merchant who refuses to stand behind their product.

It doesn’t matter to me if the seller scammed or got scammed. They sold it and it’s their accountability. A good one would want to make it right. So I’d love to know who to avoid in the future.
 
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Gregadd

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exactly. not to mention they are legally liable.
 

djsina2

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I don't know if anyone watches Pawn Stars but whenever they need to authenticate an autograph their expert uses a computer scope to see if it is "live ink" or a copy. I mentioned there is what appears to be black Sharpie touching up the open edge of the jacket in spots. On a new sealed record this should not be there. So, I got out my stylus scope...

This is what a clean part of the jacket edge looks like:
20230114_161326320.jpg


This is a spot which appears to have the Sharpie touch up:
20230114_161522367.jpg


Another section with what appears to be ink:
20230114_161454739.jpg


The worst spot where there is an obvious divot and again more touch up:
20230114_160959046.jpg
 
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Solypsa

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Without the tools you already know the media is not ' M ' by definition of visual grading on discogs. The seller chose to ( trust or assume, whichever you prefer ) the plastic wrap sealing, without verifying, but at any rate stated a condition that is not accurate.
 
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