How do you know when you are done?

[PHAA_]

I agree. This forum (like most) is gearcentric. Lots of pictures too. Music is secondary..

That is not actually what I was getting at so, my apologies if you took it that way.

Allow me to try, again.

Music is absolutely primary for me. However, along with that is the knowledge I cannot dismiss: higher end gear allows me to hear more of the music contained in the recorded performance. The two pursuits (music appreciation and audiophilia) complement each other, well, at least for me. They are still not mutually exclusive and still not one and the same but are a superb, complimentary match if one is so bent in that direction.

However, there is nothing wrong with being into the gear for the gear’s sake. We need people like to that. We need people to obsess over and design/engineer great audio components even if listening to music is not there #1 hobby. Likewise, we need musicians, who are quite often not audiophiles, to compose, perform and record the music we listen to.

Most of my participation on this forum is in the “What’s Spinning…” thread because I am about the music. That should not be misconstrued as a blasé attitude towards the gear. I think that’s true for most here. As evidenced by those pictures in that long running thread, there are plenty of folks who are clearly music hounds and gear heads.

 

[Ben Glasgow]

How many of us have ways to listen to music other than our main system?

So it's clearly about listening to music isn't it?

How many of us adored music when we had our basic way of listening as kids-radio, basic replay system?

Of course some people are more interested in gear than music.
Some people don't listen to all kinds of music either.

Some people who are happy to spend at a certain level and resent those who spend a lot more.

That's the world.............. room for everything and everyone.

 

[plasmod3]

Good question! Haha when I read the lampizator new dac release thread I guess! Audio is no longer about the sound but about who has the best words or the biggest boast. Reminds me of when 'quantum' used to be a fad and a selling tool

I have listened to many top systems in the world and build mine as well. I am probably cynical but if replacing one cap or wire in a component changes the sound that much , you kinda wonder if the industry is stacked against you...not have the best in there means you can pack ppl into endless upgrades as a means of sustaining the industry. As audiophiles we have the best of intentions chasing th best sound....what if our good intentions are taken advantage of by the industry? Not saying it is....but what if?? Has anyone considered the side of the coin that flips down rather than up?

 

[bonzo75]

.what if our good intentions are taken advantage of by the industry? What if??

Industry will do what it has to make a profit. If auditophiles fall prey each time, they are the suckers, these are not good intentions. Those with good intentions will trawl through the trash to get the gold.

Problem with the hobby today is the consumers, not the commercial sector

 

[Anton D]

Industry will do what it has to make a profit. If auditophiles fall prey each time, they are the suckers, these are not good intentions. Those with good intentions will trawl through the trash to get the gold.

Problem with the hobby today is the consumers, not the commercial sector

Caveat Omnes !

 

[PeterA]

Industry will do what it has to make a profit. If auditophiles fall prey each time, they are the suckers, these are not good intentions. Those with good intentions will trawl through the trash to get the gold.

Problem with the hobby today is the consumers, not the commercial sector

Interesting perspective. I would say the DIYers and those focusing on vintage gear have made a choice to opt out of the latest and greatest the “industry” has to offer. I would like to think they are pursuing what they believe is a superior listening experience (for them), but it might not be that simple.

 

[plasmod3]

Industry will do what it has to make a profit. If auditophiles fall prey each time, they are the suckers, these are not good intentions. Those with good intentions will trawl through the trash to get the gold.

Problem with the hobby today is the consumers, not the commercial sector

In a way this sucks in the ppl new to the hobby, does well to hook them on, disillusion them. It's not helping the hobby...it's slowly becoming a hobby of the grey hairs

 

[Lagonda]

Industry will do what it has to make a profit. If auditophiles fall prey each time, they are the suckers, these are not good intentions. Those with good intentions will trawl through the trash to get the gold.

Problem with the hobby today is the consumers, not the commercial sector

If a small niche manufacturer keeps releasing, "groundbreaking " upgrades and new ultimate models every 2- 3 years, don't be a sucker ! Its always easier selling too existing customer, than finding new ones.

 

[bonzo75]

If a small niche manufacturer keeps releasing, "groundbreaking " upgrades and new ultimate models every 2- 3 years, don't be a sucker ! Its always easier selling too existing customer, than finding new ones.

Even broader, stop looking for inefficient speakers and SS amps, because then the industry will manufacture that. If enough consumers asked for quality pressings with sets and efficient speakers, that’s what industry will start to manufacture, as only that will sell. The used market will improve

 

[PeterA]

Even broader, stop looking for inefficient speakers and SS amps, because then the industry will manufacture that. If enough consumers asked for quality pressings with sets and efficient speakers, that’s what industry will start to manufacture, as only that will sell. The used market will improve

Bonzo, I may agree with your approach, but it is very difficult to convince others to change their buying habits and preferences. It is also depends on what the designers know how to design and what their interests are. It sounds like Ralph can design anything, so I presume he chooses what to build based on his own interests and where the market seems to be going. I am encouraged by how active the top horn speaker thread is and with the participation of some horn designers. Perhaps what is old will be new again, but I do not think you can force it on anyone. There are plenty of choices out there. In my opinion, hobbyists should explore and listen to alternative takes on presentations and try not to be overly influenced by the marketing of the mainstream. You are doing your part on line and spreading one approach. I think that is good.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Industry will do what it has to make a profit. If auditophiles fall prey each time, they are the suckers, these are not good intentions. Those with good intentions will trawl through the trash to get the gold.

Problem with the hobby today is the consumers, not the commercial sector

Evenbut broader, stop looking for inefficient speakers and SS amps, because then the industry will manufacture that. If enough consumers asked for quality pressings with sets and efficient speakers, that’s what industry will start to manufacture, as only that will sell. The used market will improve

i respect your opinions, even tend to agree mostly by degrees, and the energy you put into the hobby. but don't respect dismissing wide sections of listeners and gear. there is more than one legit approach to enjoy the music. just my perspective.

consumers have to find their own way, at their own pace.

 

[Al M.]

i respect your opinions, even tend to agree mostly by degrees, and the energy you put into the hobby. but don't respect dismissing wide sections of listeners and gear. there is more than one legit approach to enjoy the music. just my perspective.

consumers have to find their own way, at their own pace.

No, there is only one legit approach for genuinely experienced people.

(Or so we are told.)

 

[Lagonda]

No, there is only one legit approach for genuinely experienced people.

(Or so we are told.)

Yes he has changed, he used to be more open minded, slowly turning into one of the zealots. Real experience will come with actually setting up and using his own system one day.

 

[PeterA]

Real experience will come with actually setting up and using his own system one day.

Milan, I agree that real experience comes from actually owning and working to improve one’s system through set up and changes. When I bought my new system, DDK told me “now the real learning begins when you live with it for the next year or two and experiment and fine-tune.”

Bonzo, has an admirable amount of exposure. Exposure is also important to hone in on what your priorities and preferences are. It’s also fun to travel and meet people and hear new things and learn what you don’t like.

I think the people who have the greatest knowledge and experience are those who have spent time increasing their exposure to what is out there and by experimenting with different gear and set up techniques.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Milan, I agree that real experience comes from actually owning and working to improve one’s system through set up and changes. When I bought my new system, DDK told me “now the real learning begins when you live with it for the next year or two and experiment and fine-tune.”

Bonzo, has an admirable amount of exposure. Exposure is also important to hone in on what your priorities and preferences are. It’s also fun to travel and meet people and hear new things and learn what you don’t like.

I think the people who have the greatest knowledge and experience are those who have spent time increasing their exposure to what is out there and by experimenting with different gear and set up techniques.

i think trying to glorify one journey over others as the top one is just wrong. i have the most respect for Kedar (ddk and Romy too) he contributes a great amount of helpful feedback, but also for others more focused on what they are personally doing as equally legit and well founded. and more who might step up and contribute.

celebrating Kedar's efforts is a good thing. however; singular exclusive thinking for righteous path superiority in the hobby just dampens forum energy and divides us. it's not positive. pushes many away. confirms an elitist culture. we can have fun without going there.

why be 'anti'? i do realize as humans it's our default.

 

[PeterA]

i think trying to glorify one journey over others as the top one is just wrong. i have the most respect for Kedar (ddk and Romy too) he contributes a great amount of helpful feedback, but also for others more focused on what they are personally doing as equally legit and well founded. and more who might step up and contribute.

celebrating Kedar's efforts is a good thing. however; singular exclusive thinking for righteous path superiority in the hobby just dampens forum energy and divides us. it's not positive. pushes many away. confirms an elitist culture. we can have fun without going there.

why be 'anti'? i do realize as humans it's our default.

I apologize Mike. I was not trying to glorify any particular journey over others. Honestly, I do not see where you get any of that out of what I wrote. Neither am I trying to be "anti" anything. Kedar's efforts at travel for exposure, and meeting fellow like minded hobbyists, even to your place, are admirable. I am actually impressed, and I am glad he shares his journey with the rest of us. I mention him because I am aware of him. I don't see his as "a singular, exclusive thinking for righteous path superiority in the hobby...." That is just not the way I see it. I am sorry you took it that way.

I like to point out examples with which I am impressed, nothing more.

 

[PYP]

The only reason I resist the "there is only one way" philosophy is that it is never true in life. How could it be?

What if, just like our physical ears, there are no two the same? What if what one person hears is actually different from others? Even live events. We go home and try to tune our sound to fit our own unique ears.

 

[andromedaaudio]

You when you re done when you spend you re money elsewhere.
Like on a beautifull visit to athens .

 

[fbhifi]

Mike, I’ve thought about the thread title question you asked over six months ago on and off since you posted it. There are many complicated answers, but I didn’t want to go down those various rabbit holes, that’s why I never posted a reply. I felt that there had to be a simple and straightforward answer.

This morning, for no particular reason, it came to me-

You know you’re done when you no longer have the desire to change anything in your system.

 

[PeterA]

This morning, for no particular reason, it came to me-

You know you’re done when you no longer have the desire to change anything in your system.

I like that. Do you think many have reached that point?