Magico Mini 2, Q1, Raidho C 1.1, or TAD CR 1

[AudioExplorations]

i have been running Mini2 for more than 6 years now...for better part of the early years with dartzeel pre and power combo (18 and 108). recently i acquired Soulution 501s monoblock and been running it. Mini2 just got even faster and better with the faster amp.

there is an itch i need to scratch, i had a short audition early last year on the CR 1 powered by Gryphon top end amps. As much i love the Mini2 for its sealed box bass characteristics, there is something i heard in the CR1 i can't shake off till now a year later.

I will not have a chance to home audition the CR1 side by side with the Mini2. I see some of fellow regulars here pair dartzeels with the CR1.. so I have electronics choices to pair nicely, even with the much hyped Devialet D-primer.

Is the CR1 a worthwhile efforts going for after the Mini2? I have listened to all the Q series (1 to 7), it is easy to just go for Q1 or Q3 given the limited size of my listening room but i want to try something different.. There is also a big fuss in my neck of the woods on the latest Raidho D1 launch right which has local enthusiasts swearing by them.

i know sound preference is subjective.. i have been "faithful" to the mini2 as long as i have for any speakers I have owned...

question is the CR1 will be the next keeper? of course i will move the Mini2 to the living room to mate with the devialet d-primer..

appreciate your comments and share any direct experience if you have both magico and TAD in your listening space...

The only way to know is to listen to both under the same controlled conditions. Both speakers are at the absolute top of the food chain right now, but do note the differences in physical size and driver arrangement (2way vs 3way) - the CR1 sounds and feels like a full range floor-stander.

 

[PeterA]

That's righ, lloyd. Even though it's not as precise and transparent as the Q3 or Q1, I still think its positioning is correct, in between the Q1 and Q3. I've said to some local friends, that the S5 is the perfect introduction to the Magico line, for those of you who only had ported speakers before. It'll provide the most seamless transition, and will get people hooked up to the sealed box aspects. Then, going forward to the Q3 will only improve things, with more transparency, etc.

PeterA, what kind of speaker would you think this intermediary piece should be?


alexandre

Ideally, I'd like to see the curved cabinet of the S series with the crossover and drivers and the seamless/hidden-mounting curved front baffle of the Q1. All this on an all aluminum base the same shape as that of the Mini 2. In other words, an all aluminum Mini 2 speaker with the extension and improved clarity of the Q series. It would be a bigger cabinet with less wood bracing, so more internal volume and perhaps better efficiency. Price: $30K. Name: Mini Q. They now have the in-house capabilities to design such a speaker. I have no delusions that this will ever happen. I'm just telling you what I would like to see because you asked. I have no idea about "should be". This is only what "could be".

I have heard the S5, though not in my system. Based only on my one listening session, I will write this: The S5 is a completely different speaker than the Q series. It has a darker tonal balance and much more bass slam than my speaker or the Q3. The Mini 2 and the Q3 sound more refined and transparent to me. The S5 would also probably overload my room. I think I would need something smaller. My impression is that the S5 was released to compete with the Wilson Sasha. The Q series is the reference line. The price points are different, and I think the target customer is different.

 

[andromedaaudio]

Maybe i am cursing here peter ,but what about the V3 ,it has more bottom end than the Mini 2 and is a great speaker , i think

 

[asiufy]

PeterA,

Sounds like a good plan, but from a marketing/product perspective, it'll require an entirely new product line, which is quite unlikely.
You don't like the Q-series rectangular looks, or is it on technical grounds?


alexandre

 

[PeterA]

PeterA,

Sounds like a good plan, but from a marketing/product perspective, it'll require an entirely new product line, which is quite unlikely.
You don't like the Q-series rectangular looks, or is it on technical grounds?


alexandre

I love the curves of the Mini 2. I like the look of the Q3, I don't like the look of the Q1. The Q series does indeed sound excellent. I just don't think the shape of the Q works when cut and placed on a vertical post.

The Mini was a stand alone design with out others in the series. The V2, V3 were different. As was the M series. I understand the direction of the Q and the S. I was just asked a hypothetical design exercise, and I imaged the Mini Q.

 

[PeterA]

Maybe i am cursing here peter ,but what about the V3 ,it has more bottom end than the Mini 2 and is a great speaker , i think

I heard the V3 on three occasions and preferred the Mini 2. I actually prefer the V2 to the V3. Before the Q series, I think the Mini 2 was their best design. The M5 was way too expensive and big to consider for me, but it sounded great when I heard it.

 

[IanG-UK]

You could try the Q1s with the Wilson Benesch Torus infrasonic generator. Coherent combination, both sound and visual. Great for a small/medium room.

Edit: By the way I run these with the electronics you own: Devialet D-Premier, albeit in dual-mono. The configurator allows you to set all the frequency passes and filters.

i have been running Mini2 for more than 6 years now...for better part of the early years with dartzeel pre and power combo (18 and 108). recently i acquired Soulution 501s monoblock and been running it. Mini2 just got even faster and better with the faster amp.

there is an itch i need to scratch, i had a short audition early last year on the CR 1 powered by Gryphon top end amps. As much i love the Mini2 for its sealed box bass characteristics, there is something i heard in the CR1 i can't shake off till now a year later.

I will not have a chance to home audition the CR1 side by side with the Mini2. I see some of fellow regulars here pair dartzeels with the CR1.. so I have electronics choices to pair nicely, even with the much hyped Devialet D-primer.

Is the CR1 a worthwhile efforts going for after the Mini2? I have listened to all the Q series (1 to 7), it is easy to just go for Q1 or Q3 given the limited size of my listening room but i want to try something different.. There is also a big fuss in my neck of the woods on the latest Raidho D1 launch right which has local enthusiasts swearing by them.

i know sound preference is subjective.. i have been "faithful" to the mini2 as long as i have for any speakers I have owned...

question is the CR1 will be the next keeper? of course i will move the Mini2 to the living room to mate with the devialet d-primer..

appreciate your comments and share any direct experience if you have both magico and TAD in your listening space...

 

[Mike Gillespie]

Any one tried the Raidho D-1 with a pair of subs and tested that against the CR-1?

Thanks.

 

[stereo]

You could try the Q1s with the Wilson Benesch Torus infrasonic generator. Coherent combination, both sound and visual. Great for a small/medium room.

Edit: By the way I run these with the electronics you own: Devialet D-Premier, albeit in dual-mono. The configurator allows you to set all the frequency passes and filters.

I have the Q1, and personally I don't see the point of adding 2 subs.... I have also a Devialet (which I don't use as my main amp, I prefer my Dartzeel) and out of curiosity I also tried to connect my two Fathom F113 to complement the Q1. For sure you move more air in the bass, and get more extension, but you are losing a bit on the purity of sound from the Q1. The Fathom is a great sub, but I would need a sub of the caliber of the new Qsub to be confident it doesn't degrade the sound.

For me, either you have a small room, and in this case, you get so much room resonance in the bass that you are better off having a speaker which doesn't go too low. At around 35Hz, the Q1 is then the perfect choice. Or you have more volume, and then you are better off buying a Q3 or a S5 than trying to complement a monitor with a subwoofer.... less floor footprint, and you get a speaker which has been designed to work as a single piece across the frequency range.

Btw, Zag, the Q1 is a significant improvement over the mini 2. I compared both in the same room - the Q platform is a step change, not a minor improvement. The mini 2 is nearer to the performance of a S1 than the Q1 (I have both)

 

[Steve Williams]

The Fathom is a great sub, but I would need a sub of the caliber of the new Qsub to be confident it doesn't degrade the sound.

really

 

[PeterA]

I have the Q1, and personally I don't see the point of adding 2 subs.... I have also a Devialet (which I don't use as my main amp, I prefer my Dartzeel) and out of curiosity I also tried to connect my two Fathom F113 to complement the Q1. For sure you move more air in the bass, and get more extension, but you are losing a bit on the purity of sound from the Q1. The Fathom is a great sub, but I would need a sub of the caliber of the new Qsub to be confident it doesn't degrade the sound.

For me, either you have a small room, and in this case, you get so much room resonance in the bass that you are better off having a speaker which doesn't go too low. At around 35Hz, the Q1 is then the perfect choice. Or you have more volume, and then you are better off buying a Q3 or a S5 than trying to complement a monitor with a subwoofer.... less floor footprint, and you get a speaker which has been designed to work as a single piece across the frequency range.

Btw, Zag, the Q1 is a significant improvement over the mini 2. I compared both in the same room - the Q platform is a step change, not a minor improvement. The mini 2 is nearer to the performance of a S1 than the Q1 (I have both)

I agree with this. I tried to integrate two JL F110 subs with my Mini2 and preferred the sound without the subs. Regarding the Qsub, it is more expensive than the Q1. And if Magico recommends two subs, then where in their model line should it be inserted? I wonder if they are thinking the Q5 owner would buy two of these instead of a Q7.

Stereo, I'm curious about your comments regarding the Mini2. Are you saying that you prefer both the S1 and Q1 to the Mini2 or do you think the Mini2 falls between them, but closer to the S1? I've thought about upgrading my Mini2, but I think that I would only do it for the Q3 to get more scale and lower extension. Thanks.

 

[stereo]

I agree with this. I tried to integrate two JL F110 subs with my Mini2 and preferred the sound without the subs. Regarding the Qsub, it is more expensive than the Q1. And if Magico recommends two subs, then where in their model line should it be inserted? I wonder if they are thinking the Q5 owner would buy two of these instead of a Q7.

Stereo, I'm curious about your comments regarding the Mini2. Are you saying that you prefer both the S1 and Q1 to the Mini2 or do you think the Mini2 falls between them, but closer to the S1? I've thought about upgrading my Mini2, but I think that I would only do it for the Q3 to get more scale and lower extension. Thanks.

In the same room, I have only done a comparison S1 against Q1 and Q1 against Mini2, so cannot have a firm answer to your question, since I did only an indirect comparison. Based on listening memory, I would say that most probably the mini2 is slightly above the S1, but only slightly. S1 is a true bargain, it compete with speakers well above its price.
If your room size can accommodate a Q3, yes, it would be a perfect upgrade to the Mini2!

 

[IanG-UK]

I have the Q1, and personally I don't see the point of adding 2 subs.... I have also a Devialet (which I don't use as my main amp, I prefer my Dartzeel) and out of curiosity I also tried to connect my two Fathom F113 to complement the Q1. For sure you move more air in the bass, and get more extension, but you are losing a bit on the purity of sound from the Q1. The Fathom is a great sub, but I would need a sub of the caliber of the new Qsub to be confident it doesn't degrade the sound.

For me, either you have a small room, and in this case, you get so much room resonance in the bass that you are better off having a speaker which doesn't go too low. At around 35Hz, the Q1 is then the perfect choice. Or you have more volume, and then you are better off buying a Q3 or a S5 than trying to complement a monitor with a subwoofer.... less floor footprint, and you get a speaker which has been designed to work as a single piece across the frequency range.

Btw, Zag, the Q1 is a significant improvement over the mini 2. I compared both in the same room - the Q platform is a step change, not a minor improvement. The mini 2 is nearer to the performance of a S1 than the Q1 (I have both)

The Torus is different to a conventional subwoofer like the Fathom and you need only one. Here it is £6k. The Qsub seems to be an astronomical price here since we pay £1:$1 so it is just not viable. i guess it will retail here at £22k (or $33k).