Best speakers at low volume

[Ricco275]

After having got accustomed to my new Vitus RI-101 mk II, I came to the conclusion that I need to improve my system's performance at low volume to enjoy music more.

Current sources: LinnLP12, Holo Spring 3 KTE, Nucleus.
Speakers: Avalon Idea.
Shunyata Delta NR V2 and Hemingway Indigo PC, Tara Labs Forté, TQ 2 Black diamond IC.

I am looking at replacing the Avalon Idea with speakers that could improve the low volume listening experience. I listen to 60 / 70db, I can afford to go up to 85db for very short time (neighbours).

I am also considering to purchase a Loki Max which I understood being quite a neutral EQ unit.

I have selected a few speakers which should match my musical taste based on what I have read:

- YG Carmel 2
- Wilson Sabrina X
- Vandersteen treo ct
- TAD ME1

I don't have the chance to listen to them except the TAD ME1 which I have enjoyed very much but not in my apartment.

Budget max $15k new or used.

I am looking for speakers sounding musical, with wide soundstage, not cold, detailed yet not analytical.

I mostly listen to classic rock, blues and jazz.

The system sits at the end of the long wall in a living room measuring 33x13ft, listening position 8ft from the speakers.

Unfortunately I have to face a tough WAF putting several limits:

- speakers must have a clean design, not black, not too hifi looking... and not too big
- distance from the wall behind the speakers 25cm

I don't mind changing amplifier if it will be necessary to match the next speakers.

I haven't found a preamp that I could consider a good candidate except a very expensive CSport featuring a loudness button which works very well (tested at Ana Mighty Sound).

I would much appreciate some advice from who knows well the above speakers or who had similar needs.

 

[Another Johnson]

This is a really difficult problem if the source is wide dynamic range. You have the choice of setting volume low to keep the peaks low enough to satisfy others, or the alternative of setting the volume high enough to enjoy the lowest levels of the program.

In the first case, you may push the low levels below your enjoyment level. In the second, you will push the high levels to the point of annoying your near neighbors.

Compressed programs don’t exhibit this need for compromise… but you lose the true dynamic range.

 

[thomask]

Efficient speakers tend to play better at low volume.

You may consider getting field coil drivers from Voxativ and make enclosure yourself or get one from Aliexpress.

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisb4e04-voxativ-ac-xp-fieldcoil-driver-full-range

 

[Kingrex]

I play at that volume all the time. I like my speakers, but they are not WAF.
Like thomask said. Think high efficiency. Devore, Daedalus, Zu.

 

[DSkip]

The Certaldo from Rosso Fiorentino could save you some money and do well at lower volume. We also have custom finishes so the wife can become part of the design process. I recently showed these at Lone Star Audio Fest and the response was overwhelming.

 

[Ricco275]

I play at that volume all the time. I like my speakers, but they are not WAF.
Like thomask said. Think high efficiency. Devore, Daedalus, Zu.

I knew Devore, not the other 2 brands which look very interesting but difficult to get in Europe.
My boss likes very much the Fleetwood Deville. I have listened them once and they were not bad. But the design is not really my cup of tea.

You think high efficiency is really the solution? I have heard several opinions pointing out that the main issue is hearing certain frequency at low volume and that it's not necessarily linked to sensitivity. Therefore some recommend tweaking with tone controls or loudness button where available.

 

[dan31]

Harbeth should be on your list. Part of their tuning.

I have the M40.1 and they excel at sounding integrated and full at your lower listening levels. Try to demo a pair of the latest if this is your primary requirement.

 

[ashandger]

May be worthwhile to consider a used Stenheim 3. I think the new 2.5 is above your price range of 15K, unless you are trading your own speakers as well.

 

[Ricco275]

Harbeth should be on your list. Part of their tuning.

I have the M40.1 and they excel at sounding integrated and full at your lower listening levels. Try to demo a pair of the latest if this is your primary requirement.

Thanks. I had the Graham LS5/9 for 6 years and I was very happy. I’d like to try a speaker different from BBC monitors even though the Harbeth have a different house sound.

 

[Argonaut]

I listen to 60 / 70db, I can afford to go up to 85db for very short time (neighbours).

I mostly listen to classic rock, blues and jazz.

Hmmmm , Well this is your dichotomy right there …

Perhaps Vintage Monitor Gold / HPD Tannoy in original or later DIY cabinets , More modern Tannoy perhaps , an obvious recommendation being La Scala AL5 with their almost furniture WAF vibe .

 

[Ricco275]

May be worthwhile to consider a used Stenheim 3. I think the new 2.5 is above your price range of 15K, unless you are trading your own speakers as well.

Too expensive even second hand. I could afford the 2. Not sure it will solve my issues being 2 way.

 

[Another Johnson]

Therefore some recommend tweaking with tone controls or loudness button where available.

A very good point. That’s really what the loudness contour is for.

 

[wisnon]

Try the HEIL AMT SYRINX and save big on your budget, Its affectionately called the LOW SPEAKER.
Ivor Humphreys Hi-FiNews JANUARY 2005

.............'Polite' is a word that too easily damns with faint praise, and in the first few moments of listening to these speakers I did wonder if it was

appropriate in just that way. This is a sound not unlike that of the Quad ESL-63 - so clean and seamless in the HF as to seem almost subdued, until you realise that what is missing is the artificial edge imparted by so many conventional tweeters, even today.
..........This aria for soprano, flute, lute, continuo and strings has all that is required to worry a mid/HF driver but the AMT conveyed it with a seamless grace, separating the bow on string noise from the notes themselves, responding to the 'chuff' start of each note on the baroque flute, the finger-work on the lute and to the fine, sibilant detail in the voice. There was nothing in this presentation for the ear to query. It was convincing in every regard.

......Here the Syrinx was conspicuously successful in its essentially 'tuneful' low frequencies, Beethoven's crucial double-bass lines appropriately purposeful and natural sounding at any pitch, and remarkably free of resonant boost.
.......Again the Syrinx gave an excellent account of itself, realising the full compass and weight of the instrument, detailing Debussy's subtle tonal inflections exquisitely, maintaining the delicate harmonic structure of sustained chords as they fade towards silence, true to the bright top end of the Steinway and entirely equal to the dynamic requirements and percussive nature of the louder passagework. Few speakers, certainly of this modest size, do all this quite so convincingly.
Rock and pop retains its propulsive attack, the sound being crisp and responsive. The plethora of busy, studio-contrived positional detail with which somany of the familiar hi-fi show demo favourites claim our attention, was always stable and true.
The Syrinx is an extremely rewarding, essentially musical speaker......... Ivor Humphreys Hi-FiNews JANUARY 2005

Supplier: Sugden 01924 404088 www.precide.ch

HI-FiNews verdict:
A loudspeaker with a capable, well-defined and exceptionally refined sound. What's more, it's well made nicely presented and has a modestly-sized cabinet Precide is distributed in the UK by Sugden.

 

[Pokey77]

Great question. I play at 50-70 db almost always. Not because I have to, but because that is all I need to get amazing sound. I can play louder, but really just don't want to. I know three of the four speakers you mentioned; don't remember hearing that YG model before.

In my personal opinion and experience, the TAD is much better than the other two I've heard. So much so that I bought the E-1. I've had the TAD Evolution system for five years now and am very happy with it; I've been upgrading my digital from the internet all the way to my server, but the TAD Evo system is going nowhere. Look below in my sig to see my system. I can tell you that the E-1s would work o-so-good for your application, but they are black. But they also did come in wood grain as well.

The E-1, compared to the ME-1, give you a more substantial full range bass and IMO they are also more elegant in appearance. If they fit your spouse's WAF, I'd suggest you give them a listen. I do realize they are no longer made, but who knows, maybe someone near you has a pair. If not, as you said you liked the ME-1, the E-1 will fill the bill even better. Of course, please take my advice with a grain of salt as I am just one happy TAD owner - I have no affiliation with TAD.

 

[wisnon]

The Kithara is physically bigger (much less WAF) but still far below your budget: Read feedback here.

Heil AMT Kithara Test English

Best bet for Heil AMT speakers used is from Canada, where TriCell is the dealer. Typically the Syrinx will run for Can$1500 used and $5k new. Greg B in Baltimore used to sell them...United Home Audio.

 

[Ricco275]

A very good point. That’s really what the loudness contour is for.

I’m totally ignorant about technical aspects but heard several apparently expert audiophiles with technical knowledge that high efficiency is not the solution but tone control. Obviously I should try to find out.

 

[Kingrex]

I knew Devore, not the other 2 brands which look very interesting but difficult to get in Europe.
My boss likes very much the Fleetwood Deville. I have listened them once and they were not bad. But the design is not really my cup of tea.

You think high efficiency is really the solution? I have heard several opinions pointing out that the main issue is hearing certain frequency at low volume and that it's not necessarily linked to sensitivity. Therefore some recommend tweaking with tone controls or loudness button where available.

It comes down to, what are you looking for in low volume listening. What do you feel you are missing, or what is there you do not want. Are you looking for rich full sound. Or are you looking for clean fresh air.

 

[Another Johnson]

I’m totally ignorant about technical aspects but heard several apparently expert audiophiles with technical knowledge that high efficiency is not the solution but tone control. Obviously I should try to find out.

I agree with them. The efficiency of the speakers does nothing to change the relationship between the quiet and loud parts of the music.

Fletcher and Munson did the original research on this before WWII (iirc). Google Fletcher Munson Equal Loudness curves and you will find a good bit of information.

 

[Ricco275]

Great question. I play at 50-70 db almost always. Not because I have to, but because that is all I need to get amazing sound. I can play louder, but really just don't want to. I know three of the four speakers you mentioned; don't remember hearing that YG model before.

In my personal opinion and experience, the TAD is much better than the other two I've heard. So much so that I bought the E-1. I've had the TAD Evolution system for five years now and am very happy with it; I've been upgrading my digital from the internet all the way to my server, but the TAD Evo system is going nowhere. Look below in my sig to see my system. I can tell you that the E-1s would work o-so-good for your application, but they are black. But they also did come in wood grain as well.

The E-1, compared to the ME-1, give you a more substantial full range bass and IMO they are also more elegant in appearance. If they fit your spouse's WAF, I'd suggest you give them a listen. I do realize they are no longer made, but who knows, maybe someone near you has a pair. If not, as you said you liked the ME-1, the E-1 will fill the bill even better. Of course, please take my advice with a grain of salt as I am just one happy TAD owner - I have no affiliation with TAD.

Lovely system! Glad to hear TAD E1 perform well at low volume. Beside the need to play low volume I also prefer to play not loud, especially because my living room is not properly acoustically treated. You give me hope for the ME1. They come in a cool platinum colour version.

 

[morricab]

After having got accustomed to my new Vitus RI-101 mk II, I came to the conclusion that I need to improve my system's performance at low volume to enjoy music more.

Current sources: LinnLP12, Holo Spring 3 KTE, Nucleus.
Speakers: Avalon Idea.
Shunyata Delta NR V2 and Hemingway Indigo PC, Tara Labs Forté, TQ 2 Black diamond IC.

I am looking at replacing the Avalon Idea with speakers that could improve the low volume listening experience. I listen to 60 / 70db, I can afford to go up to 85db for very short time (neighbours).

I am also considering to purchase a Loki Max which I understood being quite a neutral EQ unit.

I have selected a few speakers which should match my musical taste based on what I have read:

- YG Carmel 2
- Wilson Sabrina X
- Vandersteen treo ct
- TAD ME1

I don't have the chance to listen to them except the TAD ME1 which I have enjoyed very much but not in my apartment.

Budget max $15k new or used.

I am looking for speakers sounding musical, with wide soundstage, not cold, detailed yet not analytical.

I mostly listen to classic rock, blues and jazz.

The system sits at the end of the long wall in a living room measuring 33x13ft, listening position 8ft from the speakers.

Unfortunately I have to face a tough WAF putting several limits:

- speakers must have a clean design, not black, not too hifi looking... and not too big
- distance from the wall behind the speakers 25cm

I don't mind changing amplifier if it will be necessary to match the next speakers.

I haven't found a preamp that I could consider a good candidate except a very expensive CSport featuring a loudness button which works very well (tested at Ana Mighty Sound).

I would much appreciate some advice from who knows well the above speakers or who had similar needs.

Avantgarde zero partial active or Odeon Helix and a good mid-price SET like Aries Cerat Genus, Amplifon SET42 SE, NAT Single, KR Audio VA350i, New Audio Frontiers SE 845 integrated etc.