Alsyvox - Hi end Munich 2022 - your thoughts

[Rhapsody]

Hi Bob,
Thanks for the info. my apologies for having you repeat. I’m juggling multiple projects and way, way, way behind on my audio reading. ( and considering all the platonic intellectual masturbation in most threads about stuff guys haven’t even heard , I’m sure I’m missing some good information, but not much.)

Nevertheless, I’m surprised Jadis wasn’t prepared for the show with what many regard as some of the best amps they make, or anyone makes in this hobby. Kinda of like Nadal not prepared with relevant equipment for the French Open.

Caeser, shit happens. Jadis WAS prepared, you don't carry around spare amps. Something happened to the planned amps at the last minute.

Did you hear the system? A LOT of people liked the system. For those that want(ed) to hear the Alsyvox speakers driven with bigger amps, there are Alsyvox speakers available to listen to around the globe with all types of different amplification. Interested buyers will seek them out, conversationalist can wait until next Munich where Alsyvox will be driven with Pilium amps.

 

[Zero000]

Some of this will be gracing my listening room but it occured to me this or similar would match nicely with Alsyvox.

It's not expensive but I have samples and it looks great. Really.

https://www.thewoodveneerhub.co.uk/collections/acupanel?gclid=Cj0KCQjwhqaVBhCxARIsAHK1tiPJtqu6HnmkW4-YgBoX10aifnil7NTnE3VDp-HuyNwtakSi736Z8RAaArDfEALw_wcB

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Some of this will be gracing my listening room but it occured to me this or similar would match nicely with Alsyvox.

It's not expensive but I have samples and it looks great. Really.

https://www.thewoodveneerhub.co.uk/collections/acupanel?gclid=Cj0KCQjwhqaVBhCxARIsAHK1tiPJtqu6HnmkW4-YgBoX10aifnil7NTnE3VDp-HuyNwtakSi736Z8RAaArDfEALw_wcB

Hi Justin,

Did they supply measurements for these? Assume they have some absorption on the backing membrane for the slats.

 

[Zero000]

Hi Justin,

Did they supply measurements for these? Assume they have some absorption on the backing membrane for the slats.

These shots of my samples give you an idea of what the backing is like, Bill.

Effectively looks like a diffusion and absorption. You can place on a false front wall with extra absorption behind that if you want to get extra absorption.

No strict performance measurements that I can recall seeing but I may look later.

Convinced it will look great, though, and I think that's important. The veneer is nice. The idea is to cover the full front wall around the projector screen and put some on the rear wall.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

These shots of my samples give you an idea of what the backing is like, Bill.

Effectively looks like a diffusion and absorption. You can place on a false front wall with extra absorption behind that if you want to get extra absorption.

No strict performance measurements that I can recall seeing but I may look later.

Convinced it will look great, though, and I think that's important. The veneer is nice. The idea is to cover the full front wall around the projector screen and put some on the rear wall.

View attachment 94571 View attachment 94572

Yes it looks super.

 

[christoph]

Yes it looks super.

It really is beautiful to look at.
But judging from the depth of the porous material, those panels can not be significantly damping below 600-700hz on their own. They would need some more depth of damping material behind them and then they are "just" a very nice to look at panelling.

 

[Brian Beck]

It really is beautiful to look at.
But judging from the depth of the porous material, those panels can not be significantly damping below 600-700hz on their own. They would need some more depth of damping material behind them and then they are "just" a very nice to look at panelling.

Absolutely correct. They are very pretty cosmetically, but too shallow to be very absorptive. About 2/3 of the surface area is hard reflective wood too. There will be some diffractive benefit, but not much. The regularly spaced (periodic) wood strips will emphasize some frequencies over others (as compared to some of the more pseudo-random patterns seen in today’s better diffractive products).

I saw somewhere on their site a claim that these panels absorb 97% at 1000Hz. I seriously doubt that.

Better than a bare wall? Probably. And way nicer looking…

 

[Bobvin]

It really is beautiful to look at.
But judging from the depth of the porous material, those panels can not be significantly damping below 600-700hz on their own. They would need some more depth of damping material behind them and then they are "just" a very nice to look at panelling.

But they would provide some diffusion / scattering which would be welcome vs. a bare sheetrock wall. It would, of course, require an additional approach if there are problematic peaks or suck-outs. (I was typing while the above post landed.)

and yes, not quite a BAD panel the openings are too regular.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

It really is beautiful to look at.
But judging from the depth of the porous material, those panels can not be significantly damping below 600-700hz on their own. They would need some more depth of damping material behind them and then they are "just" a very nice to look at panelling.

Indeed so. I was asking for the measurements for the same reason.

 

[christoph]

Absolutely correct. They are very pretty cosmetically, but too shallow to be very absorptive. About 2/3 of the surface area is hard reflective wood too. There will be some diffractive benefit, but not much. The regularly spaced (periodic) wood strips will emphasize some frequencies over others (as compared to some of the more pseudo-random patterns seen in today’s better diffractive products).

I saw somewhere on their site a claim that these panels absorb 97% at 1000Hz. I seriously doubt that.

Better than a bare wall? Probably. And way nicer looking…

Can you give some examples?
If things turn out the way my wife would like, I might be getting a new, bigger listening room where acoustics AND cosmetics will matter

 

[christoph]

But they would provide some diffusion / scattering which would be welcome vs. a bare sheetrock wall. It would, of course, require an additional approach if there are problematic peaks or suck-outs. (I was typing while the above post landed.)

and yes, not quite a BAD panel the openings are too regular.

Too regular and too shallow but still very nice to look at

 

[ACHiPo]

Some of this will be gracing my listening room but it occured to me this or similar would match nicely with Alsyvox.

It's not expensive but I have samples and it looks great. Really.

https://www.thewoodveneerhub.co.uk/collections/acupanel?gclid=Cj0KCQjwhqaVBhCxARIsAHK1tiPJtqu6HnmkW4-YgBoX10aifnil7NTnE3VDp-HuyNwtakSi736Z8RAaArDfEALw_wcB

Very interesting. Will they be mounted directly on studs with bat insulation behind them?

 

[christoph]

Very interesting. Will they be mounted directly on studs with bat insulation behind them?

According to the faq on the webpage, you can mount them directly to the wall or on studs with additional damping material to increase the damping properties further.
So they are aware that there is a lot more to gain

 

[Brian Beck]

Can you give some examples?

Without mentioning brand names, I would suggest “3D”-style diffraction panels like these pictured - the deeper the better. Expensive generally, but you could DIY. Then augment with absorptive panels, which are much easier to DIY. Make panels from 2”, or preferably 4” thick rock wool wrapped in fabric and install with a gap to the wall behind. The chosen ratio of diffracted to absorbed is based upon your room, your speakers and your preferences. There are as many opinions out there on this topic as there as audiophiles who attempt room treatment.

 

[christoph]

Without mentioning brand names, I would suggest “3D”-style diffraction panels like these pictured - the deeper the better. Expensive generally, but you could DIY. Then augment with absorptive panels, which are much easier to DIY. Make panels from 2”, or preferably 4” thick rock wool wrapped in fabric and install with a gap to the wall behind. The chosen ratio of diffracted to absorbed is based upon your room, your speakers and your preferences. There are as many opinions out there on this topic as there as audiophiles who attempt room treatment. View attachment 94577 View attachment 94576 View attachment 94578

Thanks Brian
Are you suggesting that the porous material should go between the diffusor and the wall?
And aren't the skyline diffusors supposed to be mounted on the ceiling?
I think I read somewhere that the skylines reflect the sound energy towards the floor if they are mounted on the walls...

Or are you suggesting to mount the skyline diffusors and the porous absorbers in some kind of chess board pattern?

The room will be around 5.6m x around 8m x 2.4m and the speakers will be Apogee Studio Grands using the length of the room (and maybe a small system using the width of the room).

The Apogees might vastly take profit from the front wall (on the back of the Apogees) being all QRD diffusors.

The ceiling a mix of skyline above the listening spaces and the rest some mix of irregular diffusion and absorbtion (maybe something similar to what Justin showed further up, just irregular and with more depth - 10cm - for am more wideband/deeper in the bass region efficency) to bring the reverb time down to a reasonable value.

 

[Zero000]

Indeed so. I was asking for the measurements for the same reason.

Measurements against what reference?

Have a good think about that. Deeply. We both know there is no standard. But hold on, I might claim one to pretend there is. The patent on this reference room costs £4,973,871

Bill the last speaker shot I saw on your main thread looks great. Respect.

 

[Audiophile Bill]

Measurements against what reference?

Have a good think about that. Deeply. We both know there is no standard. But hold on, I might claim one to pretend there is. The patent on this reference room costs £4,973,871

Bill the last speaker shot I saw on your main thread looks great. Respect.

Thanks Justin. I am nearly there to listen this weekend. Just be testing in mono this evening. Deciding what voltages to use etc.

In terms of the room treatment. It was out of interest. Actually I have no doubt that what you have chosen will not only look great but also really improve the rooms acoustics. At the end of the day, you can add a few bass traps if (and only if) you wanted. I think we can get caught up in all this nonsense when truth is it is your home so aesthetics are paramount.

 

[mtemur]

IMHO in the noisy and bustling show conditions people listen louder than most do in their systems.

I agree, but shows give you the opportunity to listen and compare systems side by side in minutes. It’s not the top performance of components/speakers but still give you an idea.

What are the peak levels you are addressing? IMHO when operated in their limited dynamic range electrostatics such as the SoundLab A1 or even the ESL63 have attack - bu they need a proper amplifier and source.

I can not say anything about Soundlab A1 cause I haven’t listened it. but I find panel speakers in general are a little bit shy on impact and attack.

 

[DESMODXB]

Caeser, shit happens. Jadis WAS prepared, you don't carry around spare amps. Something happened to the planned amps at the last minute.

Did you hear the system? A LOT of people liked the system. For those that want(ed) to hear the Alsyvox speakers driven with bigger amps, there are Alsyvox speakers available to listen to around the globe with all types of different amplification. Interested buyers will seek them out, conversationalist can wait until next Munich where Alsyvox will be driven with Pilium amps.

Hi Bob

I saw the video you posted of the Tintoretto with the Kondo Overture amp, sounded great. I know you have your personal Ongaku (watched too many Herb Reichert Vids). Have you tried the Tinteretto or Botticheli with your Ongaku. Whats it like, would it deliver the goods in a 18" X 27" room.

 

[Rhapsody]

Hi Bob

I saw the video you posted of the Tintoretto with the Kondo Overture amp, sounded great. I know you have your personal Ongaku (watched too many Herb Reichert Vids). Have you tried the Tinteretto or Botticheli with your Ongaku. Whats it like, would it deliver the goods in a 18" X 27" room.

Alsyvox/Kondo is kinda my dream/obsession right now - would be great if you posted a vid again.

Hi,

I like more power on the Alsyvox. There’s a big difference running 30 W or 50 W push pull vs SETs.

I have never even tried to 50 watt Kagura SETs on Alsyvox at my place, But I have sold that combination and it sounds fine, actually very good.

I like to light up the room with the Alsyvox speakers and to do that you need some power.