It Was Inevitable…

[Addicted to hifi]

'

I fail to understand how Nordost is any different from any other company that chooses to sell their USB cable for 10k or an amplifier company that prices it’s monobloc for 150k........surely can’t be attributable to manufacturing cost. One doesn’t need to be a metallurgist or an electrical engineer to figure that. This is by no means new knowledge.
PS: I have nary a dog in this fight nor very expensive cables to boot.

I couldn’t agree more

 

[Al M.]

I fail to understand how Nordost is any different from any other company that chooses to sell their USB cable for 10k or an amplifier company that prices it’s monobloc for 150k........surely can’t be attributable to manufacturing cost. One doesn’t need to be a metallurgist or an electrical engineer to figure that. This is by no means new knowledge.
PS: I have nary a dog in this fight nor very expensive cables to boot.

Into some very expensive products there goes very impressive and expensive engineering, such as Wilson Chronosonic or Magico M9 speakers, to name just two examples from the loudspeaker world. Or CH Precision amplifiers, or even, on a somewhat less expensive level, the R&D that went into my Octave amplification. And so on.

Of course, you can argue with the results or about sonic tastes, but the fact is that independent of these considerations there are some really impressive and time consuming, serious engineering and manufacturing efforts involved in a number of high end products. So I can see, to a certain extent, a justification for high prices in that regard.

Yet for me it's hard to see how the same is the case with cables, beyond a certain point at which a very high price becomes a head scratching affair. Goldplating certainly is not what I would call an impressive engineering effort. Perhaps someone can enlighten me?

 

[wil]

To me, what makes this different from other extremely expensive gear is that, as far as I can tell, the only difference between an Odin 2 and Odin Gold is the electroplating. It’s seems to be only a different flavor, not some new breakthrough level product.

 

[TLi]

To me, what makes this different from other extremely expensive gear is that, as far as I can tell, the only difference between an Odin 2 and Odin Gold is the electroplating. It’s seems to be only a different flavor, not some new breakthrough level product.

As a Odin 2 user for years and just switched to Odin Gold, I can say with very little doubt in my mind that the difference is not just the plating material. Silver plating for Odin 2 and gold plating for Odin Gold alone cannot explains the improvement in sound quality such as better imaging, larger dynamics and more 3D presentation.

You have to listen to one to believe. I am a believer

 

[sujay]

Into some very expensive products there goes very impressive and expensive engineering, such as Wilson Chronosonic or Magico M9 speakers, to name just two examples from the loudspeaker world. Or CH Precision amplifiers, or even, on a somewhat less expensive level, the R&D that went into my Octave amplification. And so on.

Of course, you can argue with the results or about sonic tastes, but the fact is that independent of these considerations there are some really impressive and time consuming, serious engineering and manufacturing efforts involved in a number of high end products. So I can see, to a certain extent, a justification for high prices in that regard.

Yet for me it's hard to see how the same is the case with cables, beyond a certain point at which a very high price becomes a head scratching affair. Goldplating certainly is not what I would call an impressive engineering effort. Perhaps someone can enlighten me?

I appreciate that and agree that considerable skill, effort and knowledge goes into manufacturing a high end product……one look at the Rockport Arrakis and I can understand how much effort goes into monocoque construction and how labor intensive it could be.
But my point is different. To some it may seem (and rightly so) that cables are straightforward and easy to manufacture and so the high prices aren’t justified. Try saying that to a cable manufacturer (or a cable enthusiast ) who holds a few patents, etc and some mumbo jumbo NASA background………..
Everyone has an opinion and is entitled to one…….and in that respect an amplifier/speaker designer is no different than a cable manufacturer. This is just my common sense speaking

 

[sujay]

…………..And not to mention that >50% of the price of most high end products is marketing amd distribution cost. I’m sure Kedar will agree with that

 

[tima]

I alleged no violation of any criminal law.

Case dismissed.

 

[christoph]

Then in 2023 it will be the Odin Unobtanium only available to registered users of Odin Gold.

This obviously works for Ferrari

 

[microstrip]

(...) Yet for me it's hard to see how the same is the case with cables, beyond a certain point at which a very high price becomes a head scratching affair. Goldplating certainly is not what I would call an impressive engineering effort. Perhaps someone can enlighten me?

Just a simple question - do you think a speaker or an amplifier can emulate the sound characteristics of a cable such as this new Odin ? I have always been impressed by the consistency of many cable manufacturers, and probably as as you very displeased how they managed to make the more expensive sound better than the cheaper ones.

IMHO this particular cable discussion must be carried considering the overall budget of the system. And surely if people really find that in general $100k brings us a better sounding system that $1000k there is no point in any discussion.

One nice thing in the high end is the diversity of approaches we can have - it is why most of the time we disagree a lot!

 

[wil]

As a Odin 2 user for years and just switched to Odin Gold, I can say with very little doubt in my mind that the difference is not just the plating material. Silver plating for Odin 2 and gold plating for Odin Gold alone cannot explains the improvement in sound quality such as better imaging, larger dynamics and more 3D presentation.

You have to listen to one to believe. I am a believer

That's great that you're experiencing all those improvements with the Odin Gold, and I agree it would seem unlikely gold plating of the connectors would account for much more than a warmer sound signature. But doesn't it seem odd that Nordost wouldn't be touting tech changes from Odin 2 to Odin Gold in their marketing material? I didn't notice anything other than the mention of gold, gold, gold. Maybe I missed something? Their marketing of Odin Gold just strikes me as over the top, and misleading, even in the world of high-end "luxury" audio. I really believe some of this stuff needs to be called out for what it is. I'll drop it now as I'm repeating myself...

 

[Gregadd]

We all know Nordost has a pedigree
Thus until proven otherwise they deserves the presumption of the law of diminishing returns.
The question is what is the return on a significant investment. Is it worth it?

 

[marty]

Where's the value and how long before the next super Bullshitium plated version making this one obsolete ?

I'm pissed! I want bullshitium cables and I want them now.....
I've tried to find bullshitium anywhere but can't. Even tried to see if there was a SPAC specializing in bullshitium as an investment opportunity. Somebody is obviously hoarding bullshitium and planning to make a fortune with it, but who? Oprah? the My Pillow guy? Robinhood? I just can't seem to catch a break.

 

[dan31]

I have not decided if I should introduce a superconducting interconnect or speaker cable first. The cooling system is expensive but the market is there. Once you buy the cooling system, adding additional cables distributes the cost. Buy once, cry once. Maybe $1M. Your music collection and system deserve the best.

 

[frd]

I didn't notice anything other than the mention of gold, gold, gold. Maybe I missed something?

Here they mention :

“Now, with the Odin Gold Loudspeaker, Nordost has developed an innovative termination process that eases the transition from cable
to connector over several stages. This process minimizes the conversion points of conductors, eliminating overcrowding and creating orderly and precise connection points with the connectors. By decreasing the impedance introduced in standard termination practices, this innovative technique allows perfect mass- matching to occur between the conductor and connector. The methodical and natural transition contributes to the smooth auditory experience only available with Nordost’s Odin Gold cables.
“

Nordost | HI-FI Audio Cables

Nordost, manufacturer of high technology cables including speaker / video cables and analog and digital interconnects. Brand names include the Supreme Reference Odin, Reference Valhalla and Tyr and others including Norse, Flatline and Sort Systems

www.nordost.com

 

[Addicted to hifi]

If there was no market for such expensive cables the manufacturers wouldn’t be selling them at these prices.

 

[tima]

I have not decided if I should introduce a superconducting interconnect or speaker cable first. The cooling system is expensive but the market is there. Once you buy the cooling system, adding additional cables distributes the cost. Buy once, cry once. Maybe $1M. Your music collection and system deserve the best.

Good luck with that!

Louis Motek, the guy that owns LessLoss cables, looked at the theory of superconductivity with its notion that under certain superconductive conditions electricity can flow without an accompanying magenetic field. He wondered if it was possible to build a cable that mimicked the effect without all the expensive apparatus. His product, named TunnelBridge, claims to offer a signal-transmission environment where electromagnetic force neutralizes itself.

Around the signal carrying wire he runs a shield that carries a signal cloned from the original audio signal. The shield and signal carrying wire never touch. With like charges on both, the charges repel - there is no electrical field (no voltage potential) between shield and conductor. The effect is that the dielectric no longer acts as a capacitor. The whole thing requires a power supply. Shunyata does something similar with their Zitron technology which is a more elegant solution that does not require a power supply.

 

[morricab]

Good luck with that!

Louis Motek, the guy that owns LessLoss cables, looked at the theory of superconductivity with its notion that under certain superconductive conditions electricity can flow without an accompanying magenetic field. He wondered if it was possible to build a cable that mimicked the effect without all the expensive apparatus. His product, named TunnelBridge, claims to offer a signal-transmission environment where electromagnetic force neutralizes itself.

Around the signal carrying wire he runs a shield that carries a signal cloned from the original audio signal. The shield and signal carrying wire never touch. With like charges on both, the charges repel - there is no electrical field (no voltage potential) between shield and conductor. The effect is that the dielectric no longer acts as a capacitor. The whole thing requires a power supply. Shunyata does something similar with their Zitron technology which is a more elegant solution that does not require a power supply.

I have lessloss c-Marc interconnects and they are the best non-foil type I have tried.

 

[tima]

I have lessloss c-Marc interconnects and they are the best non-foil type I have tried.

I'm not familiar with the LL c-Marc IC. Would you please say more.

 

[assessor43]

I am devastated .... That pricing model would cost me $16,000 to enumerate my manhood !

What? OMG

 

[spiritofmusic]

I'd rather gold plate my Prince Albert for that sum.