What are you favorite 845 tubes?

[Anchorman]

More than welcome. Power tubes are, imo, tricky (and NOS ridiculous). I have experimented more with the smaller driver and phase tubes internally. You may find some interesting insights here: https://www.audioasylum.com/scripts/d.pl?audio/faq/joes-tubes.html. I certainly experimented.

For sure, quality never goes out of style. I cannot decide whether to get another pair for bi-amping (bi-wired), a Classic Amp for the same, or seek a new design completely (all Ypsilon?). Nagra service is dependable too (As is Epsilon, btw). That means a lot with this level of investment on components. In truth, I think I'd change the speakers before the amps. I cannot fault them, even against to comparisons I have made (Spectral 300s, Boulder 1060 & 2060, Burmester 956 - probably the weakest here).I perhaps miss the scale of the 2060 - but it's a machine compared to an instrument set against the VPAs...

Have a great day.

 

[calloway]

I use Psvane ACME 845s...a matched pair in each of my 2 Chalice Audio ' Grail" mono blocks..have tried most of what are called the best of the 845s..

 

[Anchorman]

They well be a very good tube. No good for an unmodified Nagra VPA, however as they won't fit. ACME range use a 66mm dia glass enclosure (as do many others nowadays) so these will not fit through the milled opening in the Nagra top plate.

It is (should be) possible to modify the VPAs by shortening the standoff hex fasteners for the tube sockets so that the tube glass "terminates" before entering the opening in the top plate (with just the base cap going through). May even be possible without altering the wiring. BUT, that won't solve for the tube guards or the tube finisher rings. These are technically optional, of course.

With Linlai being a waste of time, Shuguang closed for the foreseeable, KR being out of the original RCA spec (at least according to Nagra), Elrog too big (that again) that only leaves PSvane and Sophia. The latter, I'm told being rubbish and the former increasingly making larger dia. tubes. Add that to international supply chain tensions, and modifying the VPA may become the only choice for tubes. I hear from Nagra 211s can work, if anyone had any sonic experience there. Doesn't solve all the issues, but does allow for a wider choice...

 

[Ovenmitt]

@Anchorman , thanks for sharing your experience with your Nagra VPA’s and the replacement 845’s you’ve tried. I also have VPA’s and you’ve probably saved me some time and money. I have been thinking about trying some of the Chinese brands - the RCA clones sound especially interesting - but haven’t pulled the trigger yet. Elrog’s seemed like a great tube to try until I learned early on that they don’t fit. It sounds like I’m going to be sticking with the Nagra sourced tubes….. oh well.

I do wonder if you could share more info on the 211 sub? You mentioned that Nagra told you this? Did they give you any further details?

 

[Anchorman]

@Anchorman , thanks for sharing your experience with your Nagra VPA’s and the replacement 845’s you’ve tried. I also have VPA’s and you’ve probably saved me some time and money. I have been thinking about trying some of the Chinese brands - the RCA clones sound especially interesting - but haven’t pulled the trigger yet. Elrog’s seemed like a great tube to try until I learned early on that they don’t fit. It sounds like I’m going to be sticking with the Nagra sourced tubes….. oh well.

I do wonder if you could share more info on the 211 sub? You mentioned that Nagra told you this? Did they give you any further details?

I need to bring it up with the distributor. My 211 information is based on the old Nagra website from around 2008 when they had a FAQ posted. One of the FAQs they answered related to 211s and the need to re-bias Nagra sourced tubes are/were match to the serial # of the amps requiring minimal biasing.

When I next order a replacement quad, I'll ask the distributor for a technical statement and post it here. I suspect 2008 was a more enlightened time and that now, the response will be don't do it... but I'd like to know myself as well.

 

[70Bin]

For whatever reason after about the 200 hour mark, one or more started wild bias fluctuations causing the amps to engage the protection circuits and shutdown. Re-biasing only ever provided a temporary solution and eventually, even that was not possible. Just before I removed them, one amp would make a sizzling sound on start up and I'd have to immediately shutdown manually. The tubes were lit, but the sound of frying electronics was disconcerting....

Thank you for sharing important information,
Was it Linlay we845?
Have you considered psvane we845 plus as a replacement?

Thank you in advance

 

[Kingrex]

I need KT88 and I worry Shuguang and Psvane are not making their premium versions anymore.

 

[adamaley]

I currently have quite a few pair of 845. In order of preference:

1. 1941 RCA 845.

2. 1959 United 845W with the JAN-CUE designation and with the getter capsule

These two are the best. To my ears, I like the RCA a touch better than the United, but often swap back and forth with various other 845.

3a. SuperTnT metal plate 845W "Nobleman"

These are my daily use tubes which were produced in very limited numbers and no longer made. These are the only high dissipation metal plate tubes produced. Very detailed, with extended highs. Bass extension almost as good the RCA and United.

3b. Psvane 845 WE Replicas

Very nice tubes and do everything well without any noticeable short comings. Very reliable and well built

4 Shuguang 845C

Very sweet sound metal plate but does not conform the RCA specification standard. This tube is a 65-70w dissipation. Most 845 amps will burn this tube up.

5. 1972 Centron 845W JAN

Very rugged tube with excellent build quality. Not sure if it is still produced. I purchased mine direct from Richardson Electronics about 7-8 years ago.

6. Shuguang 845B, Psvane 845 T and TII series

Great all round tube. Can’t be beat for the price

7. Shuguang 845

The tube that typically comes standard with current production amplifiers. They last a long time and sound pretty good

Elrog - very interesting design. I would be interested in trying a pair to try out but they have had huge reliability problems which I've heard have been addressed, although I have not read any collaborating reports.

I no longer seek out United and vintage RCA due to their very high asking prices, but value is purely subjective. Half the fun of these tubes is hunting down a pair for a fair value which has become almost impossible. My vintage 845 tubes are the only pieces of audio equipment that has actually appreciated in value.

Can you explain that the differences between the RCA and United 845 were? Have you ever tried the United 845 without the glass support at the top? I think it is an older version. If so, could you share the differences?

 

[bonzo75]

Can you explain that the differences between the RCA and United 845 were? Have you ever tried the United 845 without the glass support at the top? I think it is an older version. If so, could you share the differences?

RCA is not close to United or Amperex or WE 242c

 

[adamaley]

RCA is not close to United or Amperex or WE 242c

I'm looking to understand why he preferred the RCA to the United in order to understand how to mix and match them. I need 4 845s and currently have an RCA. I can mix and match them in any way and would look to have some attributes of each type mixed in in different amounts.

Also, the older Uniteds do not have the capsule getter or the glass stem at the top - there's an older version for sale currently and I'm tempted but there's no information on it's sound vs the commonly known and accepted holy Grail newer variant.

Of course, it's a shot in the dark asking on here, but you never know

 

[bonzo75]

I'm looking to understand why he preferred the RCA to the United in order to understand how to mix and match them. I need 4 845s and currently have an RCA. I can mix and match them in any way and would look to have some attributes of each type mixed in in different amounts.

Also, the older Uniteds do not have the capsule getter or the glass stem at the top - there's an older version for sale currently and I'm tempted but there's no information on it's sound vs the commonly known and accepted holy Grail newer variant.

Of course, it's a shot in the dark asking on here, but you never know

Oh sorry I thought this was about 211. My bad will read posts above from next time lol